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Author Topic: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options  (Read 857 times)

Michael Erlewine

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Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« on: September 15, 2021, 08:47:15 am »

Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options

https://www.apple.com/iphone-13/?afid=p238%7CsUQLTpWMH-dc_mtid_20925d2q39172_pcrid_545747010871_pgrid_126654828189_&cid=wwa-us-kwgo-iphone--slid---Brand-iPhone13-Announce-


The advent of Apple’s iPhone 13 Pro Max is sure to cause groans from a lot of readers, but not from me. I find I use my iPhone 11 Pro Max cameras more and more as I get older. And I’m about to trade that in for the iPhone 13 Pro Max with 1 TB memory.

This newest iPhone has sensor-shift image stabilization, new ultra-wide camera with 47% more light that can focus at just 2 cm, essentially a macro mode. Also, a new telephoto camera with 77mm focal length and 3x optical zoom, plus 6x optical zoom.

A new video Cinematic mode now has rack focus, which shoots in Dolby Vision HDR. For video, this allows you to edit depth effect and focus transitions after shooting. The iPhone 13 Pro Max will include ProRes this fall and the ability to shoot, cut, and ship the footage.

The phone continues to have Night Mode as included in earlier iPhones. Portrait Mode can blur the background bokeh and includes six lighting effects to swipe through. Smart HDR now recognizes up to four different people in a scene and optimizes contrast, lighting, and skin tones for each one. And it continues to have Deep Fusion for low-light scenes.

The OLED display has true blacks and is 28% brighter (800 nits up to 1200 nits) The iPhone 13 Pro Max includes a 1 TB option. And 2.5 hours more battery life. Also, 5G.

Camera:

Telephoto, 77 mm, 3x optical zoom, f/2.8 (6 element lens)

Ultra-Wide 13mm, f/1.8 (6 element lens)

Wide 26 mm, f/1.5, 1.9µm pixels (7 element lens)
« Last Edit: September 15, 2021, 09:19:35 am by Michael Erlewine »
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armand

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2021, 06:38:54 am »

I have the 12 Pro Max and use it quite a lot even when I have my good cameras with me. Part of the reason is that at small sizes the photos are as good as the bigger camera but with less effort.

From what I see it is more an incremental update to the 12, not enough to push an upgrade unless they offer huge discounts. I do like the 77mm more then the current 65mm equivalent which is not that sharp. Ideally they would either use a small zoom of 50/60-105mm equivalent or 2 focal lengths at the extremes, ~50mm and 105-120mm.

Michael Erlewine

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2021, 12:30:19 pm »

I have the 12 Pro Max and use it quite a lot even when I have my good cameras with me. Part of the reason is that at small sizes the photos are as good as the bigger camera but with less effort.

From what I see it is more an incremental update to the 12, not enough to push an upgrade unless they offer huge discounts. I do like the 77mm more then the current 65mm equivalent which is not that sharp. Ideally they would either use a small zoom of 50/60-105mm equivalent or 2 focal lengths at the extremes, ~50mm and 105-120mm.

Have you checked out the DNG files on the iPhone 12? If so, how are they?
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digitaldog

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2021, 01:30:26 pm »

I have the 12 Pro Max and use it quite a lot even when I have my good cameras with me. Part of the reason is that at small sizes the photos are as good as the bigger camera but with less effort.
From what I see it is more an incremental update to the 12, not enough to push an upgrade unless they offer huge discounts.
+1, with a 12 Pro; no need at this time to upgrade. Rumors of the 14 camera sound more interesting so I can wait. Every two models for me. The iPhone 10 to 12 camera was impressive.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2021, 07:16:52 pm »

At the moment I feel that Sony is on top for camera phones.

Their latest Xperia is mighty impressive.

I use a company iphone but if I were to buy a personal phone with a focus on photography I would get the Sony.

Michael Erlewine

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2021, 07:09:08 am »

Driving up into the Leelanau Peninsula of northern Michigan, looking at possible places to move, while waiting for an appointment, we followed a winding road until it stopped with this look at Lake Michigan, high above the shore. Here is a quick shot using the iPhone 13 Pro Max and the raw DNG option. This clearly shows me the use of raw on these new phones is very worthwhile. No, it's not perfect, but I can see the advantage of shooting raw with these little cameras.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2021, 07:48:08 am »

Have you checked out the DNG files on the iPhone 12? If so, how are they?

I also have the 11, and will get the new 13 around Xmas. However, I did try raw files and found that almost without exception, in-camera (in-phone?) jpeg is superior. Part of the reason is that the phone appears to do more behind-the-scene processing at the moment of shooting that it is available in post-processing of raw.

Manoli

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2021, 11:48:06 am »

… This clearly shows me the use of raw on these new phones is very worthwhile. No, it's not perfect, but I can see the advantage of shooting raw with these little cameras.

For a more in-depth analysis, Guillermo Luijk …
https://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=139155.msg1225285#msg1225285
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Manoli

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2021, 12:10:14 pm »

I also have the 11, and will get the new 13 around Xmas. However, I did try raw files and found that almost without exception, in-camera (in-phone?) jpeg is superior. Part of the reason is that the phone appears to do more behind-the-scene processing at the moment of shooting that it is available in post-processing of raw.

Benefits mainly from moving up to HEIC/HEIF and its support for 16 bit colour (as opposed to the venerable 8-bit jpeg), plus the option to undo some adjustments later. The codec stores editing information within the file. iPhone cameras are 10 bit capable.

« Last Edit: October 07, 2021, 12:23:00 pm by Manoli »
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Peter McLennan

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2021, 02:23:27 pm »

Benefits mainly from moving up to HEIC/HEIF and its support for 16 bit colour (as opposed to the venerable 8-bit jpeg), plus the option to undo some adjustments later. The codec stores editing information within the file. iPhone cameras are 10 bit capable.

I find no advantage to shooting RAW with my phone, even with the relatively primitive JPG files from my (now retired) Pixel 3XL. 

This Pixel 3 XL image was shot while underway nearly an hour before sunrise on a deserted highway south of Jasper, AB.  I can't imagine shooting this with any other camera.

I swapped out the Pixel for a Samsung S20 for one reason only: voice activated shutter.  Worth the price of admission for that feature alone.
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Guillermo Luijk

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2021, 09:27:34 am »

It's a good time to give up the "always shoot RAW" story for every device. That holds true if you have a FF camera, but using a smartphone in RAW mode most of the times will just let you with a mediocre camera (because of its tiny sensor).

It's the software in a smartphone that closes the gap with larger sensors: HDR multiexposure to achieve a great dynamic range, automated panoramas to collect a lot of Mpx and detail, night mode to be able to see in darkness, TOF based algorithms to mimic narrow DOF only possible with large and expensive primes on a regular camera. So yes, it's no surprise that in many situations out of the phone JPEG can be better than anything you get fiddling with single RAW files, not to mention the effort saved in processing.

My favourite option is a hybrid between both worlds (JPEG and RAW): Apple's ProRAW DNG files have the same elasticity as RAW files in most regards (white balance, linear information, highlight preservation,...), while they can include most of the processing power provided by software (HDR blending, lens corrections) and any imaginable feature that doesn't play well with undemosaiced RAW data (basically any translation, rotation or interpolation).

Hope other brands follow Apple. My fear is that smartphone JPEG's can be so good for 99% of users as to make such formats unatractive to makers.

Considerations about Apple's ProRAW: https://www.overfitting.net/2021/05/apple-proraw-lo-mejor-de-dos-mundos.html

Regards

« Last Edit: October 08, 2021, 01:03:02 pm by Guillermo Luijk »
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armand

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2021, 05:10:34 pm »

I also have the 11, and will get the new 13 around Xmas. However, I did try raw files and found that almost without exception, in-camera (in-phone?) jpeg is superior. Part of the reason is that the phone appears to do more behind-the-scene processing at the moment of shooting that it is available in post-processing of raw.

While I also did experience this with my 12 Pro Max it's a case by case situation. I would say that in 2/3-3/4 of the cases the jpeg and what extra I can process in the phone is as good or even better than the raw. There are however this other situations when the raw is advantageous. That's why when I find a situation that I really like, I often take the same shot in jpeg and in raw.

Michael Erlewine

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2021, 07:21:29 pm »

I follow what some folks are saying, that .JPG images are or are not better than the RAW option on the iPhone 13 Pro Max. I get that, yet that’s not how I tend to look at it. To me ‘raw’ is just ‘raw’, and it can be manipulated and moved around easier that an image like ‘.JPG’ that is ‘baked in.’  Perhaps I don’t need to push the ‘.JPG’ image around. I grant that. In which case I don’t. Yet, if I do need to manipulate the image, pushing a ‘.JPG’ is not as easy as working with raw. IMO.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2021, 05:10:34 am »

I follow what some folks are saying, that .JPG images are or are not better than the RAW option on the iPhone 13 Pro Max. I get that, yet that’s not how I tend to look at it. To me ‘raw’ is just ‘raw’, and it can be manipulated and moved around easier that an image like ‘.JPG’ that is ‘baked in.’  Perhaps I don’t need to push the ‘.JPG’ image around. I grant that. In which case I don’t. Yet, if I do need to manipulate the image, pushing a ‘.JPG’ is not as easy as working with raw. IMO.

That's correct for classic cameras, not phones.

Phones do what cameras can't: take multiple exposures and then combine them by selecting the sharpest and less noisy parts, for instance.

digitaldog

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #14 on: October 11, 2021, 10:06:22 am »

That's correct for classic cameras, not phones.

Phones do what cameras can't: take multiple exposures and then combine them by selecting the sharpest and less noisy parts, for instance.
News flash: the same can be done to raws on non phone cameras.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #15 on: October 11, 2021, 10:38:44 am »

News flash: the same can be done to raws on non phone cameras.

Not with the same simplicity and instantaneously. 

digitaldog

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #16 on: October 11, 2021, 10:45:56 am »

Not with the same simplicity and instantaneously.
It is not simple for you, understood and still in need of correction and thus corrected. 🤔
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bluekorn

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2021, 04:45:32 pm »

When printing from the iPhone 13 pro or 13 pro max can one expect technical results approaching the characteristics of fine art photos at A4 size. Yes, this question can only be understood subjectively but I couldn’t think of another way to ask it. If you get the general drift of it I’d appreciate your giving it consideration. Thanks. Peter
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digitaldog

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Re: Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max Camera Options
« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2021, 04:55:49 pm »

When printing from the iPhone 13 pro or 13 pro max can one expect technical results approaching the characteristics of fine art photos at A4 size. Yes, this question can only be understood subjectively but I couldn’t think of another way to ask it. If you get the general drift of it I’d appreciate your giving it consideration. Thanks. Peter
Subjectively and with good handling of data, I'd say more yes than no (and I'm referring to iPhone 12 Max which I own).
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