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Author Topic: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine  (Read 82721 times)

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #60 on: February 05, 2021, 07:08:56 am »

The main issue is that these data, even if true, mean nothing important. Or maybe nothing at all. Just putting something in a pretty chart is, in itself, meaningless.

 ;D ;D ;D

Your desire to shoot the messenger is getting the better of you.

For almost a year you (collective) have been arguing the shots are going to save the world, "we can't reopen the economy until a vaccine comes,"  blah, blah... and now it is not important at all how fast the vaccine is distributed!?

rabanito

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #61 on: February 05, 2021, 10:04:18 am »

;D ;D ;D

Your desire to shoot the messenger is getting the better of you.

For almost a year you (collective) have been arguing the shots are going to save the world, "we can't reopen the economy until a vaccine comes,"  blah, blah... and now it is not important at all how fast the vaccine is distributed!?

HAHAHA
Depends on what you understand by "saving the world". You mean the Economy or the Human Species? Well, that's part of it :-)
« Last Edit: February 05, 2021, 11:13:15 am by rabanito »
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faberryman

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #62 on: February 05, 2021, 10:21:42 am »

For almost a year you (collective) have been arguing the shots are going to save the world, "we can't reopen the economy until a vaccine comes,"  blah, blah... and now it is not important at all how fast the vaccine is distributed!?

The chart appears to show that as of the date of the undated chart, 108 million doses of vaccine had been administered in the world, and that the rate of vaccinations had been higher in the United States and Europe. That strikes me as a fun fact to know and tell, but not much more. Is there anything else that you think I should takeaway from the chart?

I don't recall anyone (except maybe Alan) arguing "we can't reopen the economy until a vaccine comes". Perhaps you are being hyperbolic about what others have said. Most economies have been open since last April or May with some restrictions which differ from location to location and from time to time. I do recall some people saying that things won't get back to normal until most people are vaccinated, which is something quite different and not particularly controversial.

I also don't recall anyone (not even Alan) arguing "shots are going to save the world" or "it is not important at all how fast the vaccine is distributed". Perhaps you are being hyperbolic about what others have said there too. Have you been drinking a lot of coffee lately?

My experience is that, when making an argument, misstating what others have said generally does not enhance one's credibility. In each of these three instances doing so constitutes a strawman, which of course is a logical fallacy. Three strawmen in one sentence is quite an accomplishment.

I did read the article in the link which contained other interesting facts not shown in the chart. The two that struck me were that, at the current rate, it will take 11 months to vaccinate 75% of the US population, and for the world 7 years.  I do not believe those statements take into consideration, for example, increasing vaccine production, increasing vaccine administration, one dose vaccines, or the effect of virus variants. So those appear to be "for what it's worth" kind of statements, at least to me.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2021, 04:46:48 pm by faberryman »
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LesPalenik

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #63 on: February 05, 2021, 04:30:51 pm »

I did read the article in the link which contained other interesting facts not shown in the chart. The two that struck me were that, at the current rate, it will take 11 months to vaccinate 75% of the US population, and for the world 7 years. I do not believe those statements take into consideration, for example, increasing vaccine production, increasing vaccine administration, one dose vaccines, or the effect of virus variants. So those appear to be "for what it's worth" kind of statements, at least to me.

Not to forget the millions of people who will die while waiting for the vaccine.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #64 on: February 05, 2021, 05:11:55 pm »

... I don't recall anyone (except maybe Alan) arguing "we can't reopen the economy until a vaccine comes"....

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #65 on: February 05, 2021, 05:15:12 pm »

... Most economies have been open since last April or May with some restrictions which differ from location to location and from time to time....


 ;D ;D ;D

You are a funny guy. Ever tried a stand up?

In some locations, you can't even walk.

faberryman

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #66 on: February 05, 2021, 05:43:36 pm »

Thanks for posting those images.

I don't think any of the three articles, the titles of which you posted here as images, were written by anyone around here.

Perhaps I misunderstood. I thought when you said "you (collective)", you meant "you" meaning specifically Peter to whose post you were responding, and "(collective)" meaning others participating in the discussion here.

If you intended "you (collective)" to mean that someone somewhere said "we can't reopen the economy until a vaccine comes", "shots are going to save the world", and "it is not important at all how fast the vaccine is distributed", then I would concede the point. I don't doubt someone somewhere said those things, just not around here.

I also think you may be confusing the words "recover" and "grow[th]" which are used in the article titles you posted, with the word "reopen" which you attributed to "you (collective)".

The ban on "unnecessary walking" in LA County is actually a ban on unnecessary travel by any means. Exceptions include going to church and going to protests. It also exempts what are commonly known as essential businesses. For the sports minded, it further exempts golf, tennis, and pickleball. It is part of what is generally referred to as a stay at home order, not unlike the restrictions imposed at the onset of the pandemic. Of course, a snappy title like "LA Mayor Bans Unnecessary Walking..." sells papers and catches peoples' eyes on social media. It goes without saying that you would actually have to read the article to find all that out.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2021, 02:59:10 pm by faberryman »
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LesPalenik

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #67 on: February 05, 2021, 07:08:18 pm »


The ban on "unnecessary walking" in LA County is actually a ban on unnecessary travel by any means. Exceptions include going to church and going to protests. It also exempts what are commonly known as essential businesses. For the sports minded, it also exempts golf, tennis, and pickleball. It is part of what is generally referred to as a stay at home order, not unlike the restrictions imposed at the onset of the pandemic. Of course, a snappy title like "LA Mayor Bans Unnecessary Walking..." sells papers and catches peoples' eyes on social media. My feeling is that if you can still play pickleball, my use of the term "some restrictions" is appropriate.

In my book, going to church or to a street protest happening are the most blatant examples of non-essential activities.
On the other hand, a small shoe repair store with a handful of customers or a store with spare car items can police how many customers enter their stores and should be allowed to stay open.
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Chris Calohan

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #68 on: February 05, 2021, 07:10:01 pm »

Got my second shot (Moderna Vaccine) at 9:30 CST this morning and so far, a lot of sore arm stiffness, a touch of nausea and a little fatigue. Hope this is as bad as it gets.
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faberryman

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #69 on: February 06, 2021, 06:49:20 am »

In my book, going to church or to a street protest happening are the most blatant examples of non-essential activities.

It's that pesky First Amendment. I don't know why God didn't give his followers the good sense not to go to church in a pandemic.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2021, 09:04:04 am by faberryman »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #70 on: February 06, 2021, 10:27:35 am »

Got my second shot (Moderna Vaccine) at 9:30 CST this morning and so far, a lot of sore arm stiffness, a touch of nausea and a little fatigue. Hope this is as bad as it gets.
How do you feel today, Chris?  My wife and I are due for our second shots Feb 19th. 

Chris Calohan

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #71 on: February 06, 2021, 02:56:12 pm »

I'm fine today other than the sore arm but I had a sore arm for about three days after the first shot, too. It's a rather large needle and it goes in intramuscular. My wife, though, is experiencing some chills, general malaise and her arm also hurts like the dickens.
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degrub

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #72 on: February 06, 2021, 09:54:58 pm »

My 88 year old mother received her second Moderna shot Thursday. Only symptom was extremely tired Friday and today with improving this afternoon. Appears that she had an immune response. I have read that one is not supposed to take any nsaids after the shot but Tylenol is ok. Something about them interfering with the immune response.
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Manoli

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #73 on: February 07, 2021, 03:57:18 pm »

Quote
South Africa halted use of the AstraZeneca-Oxford coronavirus vaccine on Sunday after evidence emerged that the vaccine did not protect clinical-trial participants from mild or moderate illness caused by the more contagious virus variant that was first seen there.

Source: NYT
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jeremyrh

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #74 on: February 08, 2021, 09:34:45 am »

Source: NYT

For some more detailed information see this twitter thread:

https://twitter.com/mugecevik/status/1358539975122419712

Bottom line is that the SA study was extremely small and the results have huge confidence bounds, so don't draw too many conclusions from it.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #75 on: February 08, 2021, 09:50:43 am »

In my book, going to church or to a street protest happening are the most blatant examples of non-essential activities.
On the other hand, a small shoe repair store with a handful of customers or a store with spare car items can police how many customers enter their stores and should be allowed to stay open.
The First Amendment to our Consitution protectss free speech and religious expression, not shoe repair stores.

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #76 on: February 08, 2021, 09:53:07 am »

I'm fine today other than the sore arm but I had a sore arm for about three days after the first shot, too. It's a rather large needle and it goes in intramuscular. My wife, though, is experiencing some chills, general malaise and her arm also hurts like the dickens.
Hope she feels better soon, you too.

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #77 on: February 08, 2021, 09:54:44 am »

My 88 year old mother received her second Moderna shot Thursday. Only symptom was extremely tired Friday and today with improving this afternoon. Appears that she had an immune response. I have read that one is not supposed to take any nsaids after the shot but Tylenol is ok. Something about them interfering with the immune response.
Hope your mom is doing better.  Where does she live?  We live in New Jersey and they've run out of vaccine for everyone looking to get it. 

jeremyrh

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #78 on: February 12, 2021, 12:02:30 pm »

Had my first shot today (Pfizer) No side effects so far except a strange compulsion to buy Microsoft products ... :-(
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #79 on: February 21, 2021, 08:02:15 am »

Had my first shot today (Pfizer) No side effects so far except a strange compulsion to buy Microsoft products ... :-(
Good luck.  we got our second Moderna Friday.  Again our arms hurt like the first shot..  But for my wife, she developed a little fever and chills but is Ok today. 

Interesting article on herd immunity.

Just what some of us have been observing here; the Swedes too.  It may turn out that those who will get the shots late, they might not need it.

The brutal COVID-19 surge that killed so many is now helping to create herd immunity
https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2021/02/21/the-brutal-covid-19-surge-that-killed-so-many-is-now-helping-to-create-herd-immunity/
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