PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political

[John Camp]

Thank God not all sheriffs in this country are wanna-be fascists. I hope there are more of the kind this guy is, supporting the Constitution and refusing to enforce those unconstitutional orders by quarantidiots:

https://www.facebook.com/buddy.cooley/videos/4356561637703296/

Here's the part of the Declaration of Independence he was trying to quote:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,--That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it <snip>

He skipped right over "life" and within seconds, had gotten to "guns." The declaration says almost exactly the opposite of what he was advocating; and among the list of unalienable rights, which governments are formed to to secure, LIFE is listed first, because without that, the others are moot.

[JoeKitchen]

Why wouldn't they have a job? When people feel safe doing so, they'll flood to restaurants and bars. People will start buying things again, driving manufacturing. It might take a while, but things will bounce back...they always have before.

All the people I talked with are not concerned about getting a job or returning to their existing job...it's they are still scared of the virus. For things to get back on track, people need to feel safe...and that's when we have a vaccine. If we see this virus raise its head again in the fall for a second round...that is when major shit hits the fan.

This will all change once we come back and realize the 2 months of lost wealth just does not magically appear.  It will be a long road to recovery, with many people killing themselves along the way. 

[John Camp]

This will all change once we come back and realize the 2 months of lost wealth just does not magically appear.  It will be a long road to recovery, with many people killing themselves along the way.

Well, tough. People kill themselves all the time. That's their problem. What I'm against is their killing me. And we now have something like 45,000 people dead in America in a month. I doubt that the suicide rate will soar so high that 45,000 kill themselves in a month. You're right about the lost income/wealth. It won't just magically reappear, it's gong to take work, and it's going to take some government help. That's what governments are for. Unfortunately, under this government, it seems that most of the help is going to the big banks, the big restaurant chains, the big hotel chains, the airlines, and so on. The guy who needs his minimum wage $320 a week is gonna get jack shit.

[JoeKitchen]

Well, tough. People kill themselves all the time. That's their problem. What I'm against is their killing me. And we now have something like 45,000 people dead in America in a month. I doubt that the suicide rate will soar so high that 45,000 kill themselves in a month. You're right about the lost income/wealth. It won't just magically reappear, it's gong to take work, and it's going to take some government help. That's what governments are for. Unfortunately, under this government, it seems that most of the help is going to the big banks, the big restaurant chains, the big hotel chains, the airlines, and so on. The guy who needs his minimum wage $320 a week is gonna get jack shit.

And people die of the flu all the time.  I could be cold and callous like you and just write it off as "that's their problem."  Besides, you can stay in during all this and let the rest of us get back to work. 

And you know, the government has already screwed us over with this, due to policies from both the left and right.  So I'd rather them stay out and not provide anymore "help" please.  Just let us get back to work. 

That is the one thing I like about Trump so much in this pandemic/emergency is that he refused the temptation to increase federal government reach.  He has not permanently increased government like in every other emergency, and that is music to my ears. 

[JoeKitchen]

Close one door and another opens, or destroy one kind of park and create a totally different one. 

California skate park filled with sand to enforce social distancing backfires as dirt bikers show up

I for one did not see this coming. 

Although I did feel it was a stupid thing for LA to do, I did realize that there was no way a few skateboarders would be able to remove 37 tons of sand and thought that would be it for the park.  The law of unintended consequences at work. 

[chez]

This will all change once we come back and realize the 2 months of lost wealth just does not magically appear.  It will be a long road to recovery, with many people killing themselves along the way.

Concerned about people killing themselves because they are locked up, but not about the virus killing many times more?

[chez]

Close one door and another opens, or destroy one kind of park and create a totally different one. 

California skate park filled with sand to enforce social distancing backfires as dirt bikers show up

I for one did not see this coming. 

Although I did feel it was a stupid thing for LA to do, I did realize that there was no way a few skateboarders would be able to remove 37 tons of sand and thought that would be it for the park.  The law of unintended consequences at work.

No it's the law of the weakest links at work...the Covidiots. Poor souls have no where to play in the dirt anymore. Give me a break. I understand people in tough needing to eat, but I have ZERO respect for selfish pricks that are bored and want to play.

[JoeKitchen]

Concerned about people killing themselves because they are locked up, but not about the virus killing many times more?

As has been stated before, no one has died from lack of care (in the USA at least), meaning some people who get this just die and there is nothing we can do about it.  We will be opening up again before a vaccine is created, meaning a 2nd wave will come, which the CDC predicts could be worse then this one.  So the question, as I see it is, should we loose those people in the second wave along with all the suicides and drug overdoses, or just those in the second wave?

I'd pick the latter and get this thing open again. 

PS, I just dont think anything is going to change insofar as treatment, at least not for a while.  Sooner or later we have to get back out and back to work and deal with the death.  We cant stay inside forever.  It's a sad thought, but it is how I feel it will ultimately play out. 

[JoeKitchen]

No it's the law of the weakest links at work...the Covidiots. Poor souls have no where to play in the dirt anymore. Give me a break. I understand people in tough needing to eat, but I have ZERO respect for selfish pricks that are bored and want to play.

Two things can be true at once, that and the law of unintended consequences, not to mention the law of load motors running in a residential neighborhood getting old real damn fast. 

[chez]

As has been stated before, no one has died from lack of care (in the USA at least), meaning some people who get this just die and there is nothing we can do about it.  We will be opening up again before a vaccine is created, meaning a 2nd wave will come, which the CDC predicts could be worse then this one.  So the question, as I see it is, should we loose those people in the second wave along with all the suicides and drug overdoses, or just those in the second wave?

I'd pick the latter and get this thing open again. 

PS, I just dont think anything is going to change insofar as treatment, at least not for a while.  Sooner or later we have to get back out and back to work and deal with the death.  We cant stay inside forever.  It's a sad thought, but it is how I feel it will ultimately play out.

There have been people dying from the virus in their homes. People dying from the virus because they did not have a ventilator. People dying from the virus because lack of medical staff. Total BS that people are not dying from the virus because of lack of medical care.

And to be insensitive like you...those people dying from suicide are just looking for an excuse...they'd find that excuse later on anyway...so let them kill themselves and get it over with.

[JoeKitchen]

There have been people dying from the virus in their homes. People dying from the virus because they did not have a ventilator. People dying from the virus because lack of medical staff. Total BS that people are not dying from the virus because of lack of medical care.

And to be insensitive like you...those people dying from suicide are just looking for an excuse...they'd find that excuse later on anyway...so let them kill themselves and get it over with.

As I said, not in the USA.  Perhaps in their homes, but that is because they did not seek care.  Going by you feelings on suicide victims, maybe we should not care, since, you know, they would not have seek care with anything else? 

Well it's great to know what you really think about people who kill themselves, in essence, who gives a shit.  Love the total lack of empathy here.  I suppose you dont care about people who overdose either?  Or women too stupid to marry abusive husbands and get beaten to death?  Or how about men who marry black widows and get poisoned?  Really, who cares, right? 

But I'll ask it again, what if we find no cure for this?  What should be we do?  Stay inside for the rest of our lives? 

No thanks. 

[John Camp]

As I said, not in the USA.  Perhaps in their homes, but that is because they did not seek care.  Going by you feelings on suicide victums, maybe we should not care, since, you know, they would not have seek care with anything else. 

Well it's great to know what you really think about people who kill themselves, in essence, who gives a shit.  I suppose you dont care about people who overdose either?  Or women too stupid to marry abusive husbands and get beaten to death?  Or how about men who marry black widows and get poisoned?  Really, who cares, right? 

But I'll ask it again, what if we find no cure for this?  What should be we do?  Stay inside for the rest of our lives? 

No thanks.

Joe, we're probably talking about a month or two, not the rest of our lives. We already know how to hold down the spread of the virus, and we're quickly finding out how to prevent deaths from the virus. There's a new report out that the virus apparently causes blood clots that are killing many people, and that can apparently be handled with blood thinners. And there are other aspects of the disease that are being tracked down. I think by the first of July or August, we'll be whittling down the deaths to flu levels, as long as we don't overwhelm the hospitals with big spikes like they're going to get in Georgia, as long as people can actually get into a hospital. Then there'll be a vaccine. All the extra people that we kill now, with premature openings, are avoidable, pointless tragedies. 

[chez]

As I said, not in the USA.  Perhaps in their homes, but that is because they did not seek care.  Going by you feelings on suicide victims, maybe we should not care, since, you know, they would not have seek care with anything else? 

Well it's great to know what you really think about people who kill themselves, in essence, who gives a shit.  Love the total lack of empathy here.  I suppose you dont care about people who overdose either?  Or women too stupid to marry abusive husbands and get beaten to death?  Or how about men who marry black widows and get poisoned?  Really, who cares, right? 

But I'll ask it again, what if we find no cure for this?  What should be we do?  Stay inside for the rest of our lives? 

No thanks.

I do care about suicide victims...I was just illustrating for you how your lack of empathy for people dying from the virus looks from a different direction. People going out their regular routines would spread the virus much more rapidly which would infect at risk people and ultimately killing many of them. Right now reducing exposure of the virus reduces the risk for these at risk people and gives them a chance until a vaccine is available.

If there is no cure for this virus...we might as well kiss our asses good bye as it will run wild through the world basically picking off people at will. And yes you Joe who might pick up a cold congestion one day and along with the virus...bring you down to your knees.

Lots still unknown about this virus...and the medical community is working on either a vaccine for the long haul or quick detection devices that will allow us to better manage who's infected and who's not. But just releasing the gates without knowledge is just hoping things will work out, and I'm one not willing to risk life on a hope...especially when this world is full of idiots.

[JoeKitchen]

John, it took us 20+ years to come up with a treatment for HIV.  So we need to start thinking about what do we do if we just dont come up with a solution anytime soon. 

I do think it is part science fiction to just assume we will have this covered in the near future.  Perhaps it will, but it is probably more likely it wont. 

[elliot_n]

John, it took us 20+ years to come up with a treatment for HIV.

Yes, and still no vaccine.

So we need to start thinking about what do we do if we just dont come up with a solution anytime soon. 

Well with HIV we practiced safe sex. With Covid, after lockdown, we will have to continue practising social-distancing (so 2 metres between people + face masks + frequent hand-washing etc)

[Robert Roaldi]

John, it took us 20+ years to come up with a treatment for HIV.  So we need to start thinking about what do we do if we just dont come up with a solution anytime soon. 

I do think it is part science fiction to just assume we will have this covered in the near future.  Perhaps it will, but it is probably more likely it wont.

This is a pointless statement. You're not an expert in the field so your opinion about whether a vaccine is possible or not is utterly beside the point. As a matter of fact, all the vaccination experts are optimistic at the moment and there are several trials going on. The various corona viruses behave completely differently than flu or HIV viruses. Lumping them all in together and predicting outcomes based on the comparison is silly. There are probably hundreds of articles and podcasts out there saying this. It's almost impossible to miss them.

[Robert Roaldi]

And people die of the flu all the time.

Not 45,000 in a month they don't.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

https://ktrh.iheart.com/featured/michael-berry/content/2020-04-22-harris-county-wasted-millions-on-never-used-pop-up-hospital-at-nrg-park/?sc=editorial&keyid=KTRH&pname=local_social&fbclid=IwAR1VKYx2gK_wthmeqSp-2QzrwaSd8oaslSxHT16O_aJ6xH-33OnglbLEthk

Harris County Wasted Millions On Never Used Pop-Up Hospital At NRG Park

Remember how some public health experts predicted that the Emergency Rooms would be so overwhelmed that a new makeshift, temporary hospital was necessary.

None of that materialized and now we are left with tens of millions of dollars in waste.

The facility, with a potential price tag of $60 million, was designed by Garner Environmental Services, a Deer Park company, to help with a surge of coronavirus patients at the Texas Medical Center. But that surge never materialized and the facility sits empty right now.

Construction on the temporary medical shelter began just over two weeks ago and was finished in a matter of days. It features 250 beds and is equipped to handle an influx of COVID-19 patients....

[JoeKitchen]

This is a pointless statement. You're not an expert in the field so your opinion about whether a vaccine is possible or not is utterly beside the point. As a matter of fact, all the vaccination experts are optimistic at the moment and there are several trials going on. The various corona viruses behave completely differently than flu or HIV viruses. Lumping them all in together and predicting outcomes based on the comparison is silly. There are probably hundreds of articles and podcasts out there saying this. It's almost impossible to miss them.

It does not take an expert to recognize that in many cases, it took a long time to come up with the vaccines we take for granted today. 

You really need to get off your experts are always right wagon.  They have more intelligence about a narrow subject range, but not anymore wisdom then you or I.  Not to mention, at first they told us wearing masks did nothing and now they do. 

But as I said before, it is a legitimate time to think about what we do if we just dont get one. 

[Robert Roaldi]

https://ktrh.iheart.com/featured/michael-berry/content/2020-04-22-harris-county-wasted-millions-on-never-used-pop-up-hospital-at-nrg-park/?sc=editorial&keyid=KTRH&pname=local_social&fbclid=IwAR1VKYx2gK_wthmeqSp-2QzrwaSd8oaslSxHT16O_aJ6xH-33OnglbLEthk

Harris County Wasted Millions On Never Used Pop-Up Hospital At NRG Park

So what. So someone over reacted and screwed up. What else is new? If I were them, I'd hang on to that structure for when a second wave comes along.

Is it as big a waste of money as several generations of over-redundant nuclear weapon systems no one ever intended to use?

If you want to start documenting all the dumb things people have done over the years, you'd better stock up on a lot of coffee.