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Author Topic: Impeaching Donald Trump  (Read 137242 times)

John Camp

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #460 on: October 22, 2019, 05:39:02 pm »

With Taylor's testimony today things are getting worse for the Prez.  I think it's looking more and more like a resignation before the end of the year; I don't think he wants to go through impeachment.

I don't think you've been paying attention. Nothing is too low for this guy. If he beat conviction by a single vote in the Senate, he'd claim complete vindication. And I'm not sure they can get enough Republicans to vote for conviction, though they might come close. The problem the Republicans face is that Pence, who'd be the presumptive nominee if he assumes the presidency later in this year or earlier in the next, has all the charisma of a barrel of hair. I think for Republicans, Trump would run stronger.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #461 on: October 22, 2019, 06:48:08 pm »

I don't think you've been paying attention. Nothing is too low for this guy. If he beat conviction by a single vote in the Senate, he'd claim complete vindication. And I'm not sure they can get enough Republicans to vote for conviction, though they might come close. The problem the Republicans face is that Pence, who'd be the presumptive nominee if he assumes the presidency later in this year or earlier in the next, has all the charisma of a barrel of hair. I think for Republicans, Trump would run stronger.

That's an interesting conversation.  Just how strong would Pence be in an election?  Pence seems like a squeaky clean kind of guy.  He looks like a president, speaks like a president, coherently and with authority.  He comes from middle America (Indiana) and would attract middle American votes from the swing states.  If the Democrat nominate is a left winger, he could attract a lot of votes in other states that might not vote for Trump.  Who knows how it would turn out?

JoeKitchen

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #462 on: October 22, 2019, 07:16:27 pm »

I doubt he did it personally, so the comparison is still not looking good for Trump.

Capone made his bones as a hit man for the mob in his younger days.  When he was a boss, yes, he did not do it personally, but before that, he had no qualms with executing someone. 
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Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #463 on: October 22, 2019, 07:18:34 pm »

Capone made his bones as a hit man for the mob in his younger days.  When he was a boss, yes, he did not do it personally, but before that, he had no qualms with executing someone. 
Fugetaboutit.

JoeKitchen

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #464 on: October 22, 2019, 07:25:28 pm »

That's an interesting conversation.  Just how strong would Pence be in an election?  Pence seems like a squeaky clean kind of guy.  He looks like a president, speaks like a president, coherently and with authority.  He comes from middle America (Indiana) and would attract middle American votes from the swing states.  If the Democrat nominate is a left winger, he could attract a lot of votes in other states that might not vote for Trump.  Who knows how it would turn out?

It is really a question of voter turnout with this election.  Fact is, although many may not like Trump, he draws a big crowd and large support from those that do support him.  Another fact is that many just don't like the current Dems.  Warren's policies and the recent CNN LGBT town hall turned off a lot of voters, more then those on the Left want to admit, that would be shoe ins for the Dems, so there is very low enthusiasm there. 

Last, and this something that I realized today, the WOKE and Trans movement is an ideological pure all or nothing crowd.  They refuse compromise, and any movement that does this is doomed for failure and will bring down all politicians that support it as well.  This is the main reason why prohibition failed; the teetotalers refused to compromise.  If they did, we would probably live in a country with only wine and light beer. 

In the past election, many were still too scarred to rail against the obvious parts of these movements that were flawed.  Now though, both comedians and female athletes (and their upset fathers and mothers watching them get trounced by biological boys) are starting to openly critique both movements.  6 to 9 months, the damn will break wide open, just in time for the election.  Given the recent mess created in CT, I would not be surprised if that state turns red. 
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 07:31:12 pm by JoeKitchen »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #465 on: October 22, 2019, 07:31:08 pm »

It is really a question of voter turnout with this election.  Fact is, although many may not like Trump, he draws a big crowd and large support from those that do support him.  Another fact is that many just don't like the current Dems.  Warren's policies and the recent CNN LGBT town hall turned off a lot of voters, more then those on the Left want to admit, that would be shoe ins for the Dems, so there is very low enthusiasm there. 

Last, and this something that I realized today, the WOKE and Trans movement is an ideological pure all or nothing crowd.  They refuse compromise, and any movement that does this is doomed for failure and will bring down all politicians that support it as well.  This is the main reason why prohibition failed; the teetotalers refused to compromise.  If they did, we would probably live in a country with only wine and light beer. 

In the past election, many were still too scarred to rail against the obvious parts of these movements that were flawed.  Now though, both comedians and female athletes (and their upset fathers and mothers watching them loose to biological boys) are starting to openly critique both movements.  6 to 9 months, the damn will break wide open, just in time for the election.  Given the recent mess created in CT, I would not be surprised if that state turns red. 

A lot of the left wing stuff will disappear during the general election.  Right now, everyone is trying to win the nomination.  Whoever wins will shift back into the middle.  People have short memories.

JoeKitchen

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #466 on: October 22, 2019, 07:35:18 pm »

A lot of the left wing stuff will disappear during the general election.  Right now, everyone is trying to win the nomination.  Whoever wins will shift back into the middle.  People have short memories.

I don't know how Warren goes back to the middle.  She already ruined herself. 
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Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #467 on: October 22, 2019, 08:09:15 pm »

I don't know how Warren goes back to the middle.  She already ruined herself. 
She'll be protected by the media.

JoeKitchen

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #468 on: October 22, 2019, 08:22:00 pm »

She'll be protected by the media.

I think the media is falling apart right now though. 

I used to watch and read CNN all of the time, but just cant anymore.  My wife initially criticized me for getting my news elsewhere, but eventually she stop as well.  I think her newfound opinion on the CNN, which she held onto for a long time, just proves the point. 

I have been listening to a lot of podcast recently, and people are more and more getting their news from these sources.  On one such podcast, a credentialed journalist made the point that the mass media is realizing this and trying to correct for it by being over the top, which in turn makes it worse. 

I listened to a two hour interview with Peter Theil, a rather interesting person, and he made a similar point.  Essentially he said news for the longest time was a monopoly (I would argue an oligopoly), and that is the reason they were so successfully.  Monopolies are good so long as you dont become too fat and bureaucratic, becuase then a new technology and company can come and wipe you out.  This is essentially what happened to news.  They developed a false reality of why they were doing so well, blaming it on good reporting, when in fact it was because they were local monopolies.  Then the Internet came along and blew that to hell, and since they became lazy, were lost. 

Interesting enough, Theil made another interesting point on government organizations I tend to agree with.  He stated that all large organizations, no matter how well they work, will eventually become too bureaucratic to function.  In the private sector, the way this is fixed is by a better newer company coming along and putting the older one out of business.  In government though, there is no fix to the problem.  It just gets more and more inefficient and never gets replaced, and this is the problem with most government agencies today.  They worked well when they were created 60+ years ago, but have become ossified by bureaucracy and people just refuse to accept it.  They look at the past reality of these institutions instead realizing the current reality and allowing for the whole thing to be nixed and replaced with something else.  No politician wants to just fire everyone and start over, which is exactly what happens in the private sector. 
« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 08:25:17 pm by JoeKitchen »
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Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #469 on: October 22, 2019, 09:12:15 pm »

Joe, Unfortunately, it's not just the main media but most of the cable media is biased left as well.   Most people just read headlines.  And a lot of the main stations, CBS, ABC, NBC, are democrat left.  So that's all they hear.  If Trump gets impeached and boring Pence becomes president, no one will watch the news at all.  They'll all lose half their customers, many will go broke, and they'll rue the day they got rid of him.  Bull-in-the-CHina-shop Trump suck all the oxygen out of the room.  Constantly.  Cable and people can;t get enough off it.  Look at our forums.  Page after page after page.  But actually, I think Pence will be good for the public who will appreciate some quiet, a pause.  There's too much commotion with Trump and people will like a break and see Pence as the guy to give it to them.  Steady, quiet, polite, thoughtful, mature, experienced.  No angst.  :)

Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #470 on: October 22, 2019, 09:13:46 pm »

Totally opposite Trump.

degrub

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #471 on: October 22, 2019, 10:04:36 pm »

Pence is so conservative, be careful what you wish for....
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Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #472 on: October 22, 2019, 10:29:03 pm »

Pence is so conservative, be careful what you wish for....
So why do they want to impeach Trump?

Alan Klein

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #473 on: October 22, 2019, 11:56:43 pm »

Congrats to my Canadian friends having re-elected Justin Trudeau.  Please, I no longer wish to hear how Trump only got 46% of the popular vote.  How do you run Canada when only 1/3 of the people voted for you?  33.1%! Also, no more complaints about the American electoral system.

"Not only was Trudeau's Liberal Party forced by voters to accept a demotion to a minority government -- grabbing just 157 of 338 seats in the House of Commons -- but about two-thirds of the country voted against him. His party's share of the popular vote clocked in at just 33.1 % -- less than the 34.4% earned by the rival the Conservative Party of Canada and its leader Andrew Scheer."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/22/opinions/canada-election-bociurkiw/index.html

LesPalenik

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #474 on: October 23, 2019, 12:33:47 am »

Congrats to my Canadian friends having re-elected Justin Trudeau.  Please, I no longer wish to hear how Trump only got 46% of the popular vote.  How do you run Canada when only 1/3 of the people voted for you? 33.1%! Also, no more complaints about the American electoral system.

"Not only was Trudeau's Liberal Party forced by voters to accept a demotion to a minority government -- grabbing just 157 of 338 seats in the House of Commons -- but about two-thirds of the country voted against him. His party's share of the popular vote clocked in at just 33.1 % -- less than the 34.4% earned by the rival the Conservative Party of Canada and its leader Andrew Scheer."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/22/opinions/canada-election-bociurkiw/index.html

No problem. Canada just announced Cannabis 2.0, a legalization of cannabis derivatives, including cheery beverages, new types of cookies and all kinds of creams. Happy Years Ahead!   
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jeremyrh

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #475 on: October 23, 2019, 01:15:46 am »

Capone made his bones as a hit man for the mob in his younger days.  When he was a boss, yes, he did not do it personally, but before that, he had no qualms with executing someone.

Too bad he didn't have drones and an air force, eh?  Could have avoided getting his little hands dirty altogether.
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Alan Goldhammer

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #476 on: October 23, 2019, 08:26:51 am »

I think the media is falling apart right now though. 

I used to watch and read CNN all of the time, but just cant anymore.  My wife initially criticized me for getting my news elsewhere, but eventually she stop as well.  I think her newfound opinion on the CNN, which she held onto for a long time, just proves the point. 

I have been listening to a lot of podcast recently, and people are more and more getting their news from these sources.  On one such podcast, a credentialed journalist made the point that the mass media is realizing this and trying to correct for it by being over the top, which in turn makes it worse. 
I don't watch a lot of TV news and when I do, I try to sample both FOX and MSNBC both of which are good for some laughs.  Since I walk an hour each morning, I listen to lots of podcasts, some of which are news related.  With the ubiquitous of the Internet, there are lots of alternative news outlets.  The Washington Post does a poor job of local news coverage these days but we have a very good local outlet Bethesda Beat that delivers a daily email with links to all current stories that are of interest to me.

ProPublica is home to the best investigative journalists outside the mainstream and they collaborate with a number of mainstream news organizations.  While they are doing a lot of work on Trump finances, they are also investigating state and local corruption in both Red and Blue areas.   As always, one has to recognize the bias of any news organization and sample a variety of sources.

« Last Edit: October 23, 2019, 11:12:20 am by Alan Goldhammer »
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JoeKitchen

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #477 on: October 23, 2019, 08:43:26 am »

Too bad he didn't have drones and an air force, eh?  Could have avoided getting his little hands dirty altogether.

 ;D
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #478 on: October 23, 2019, 08:58:12 am »

Don't know why you want to portrait yourself as unnecessarily more dim than you actually are...

Personal attack  >:(

JoeKitchen

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Re: Impeaching Donald Trump
« Reply #479 on: October 23, 2019, 09:04:56 am »

Damn, and this is in the NY Times! 

Anxious Democratic Establishment Asks, ‘Is There Anybody Else?’

And it looks like Hillary may jump back in for a 2020 run.  It is mud slinging time.  Personally I think she is done.  Maybe before Farrow book came out, she had a chance.  However now that it is evident that Hillary also tried to squash the Weinstein story, I cant see her surviving the Me2 people. 

Personally, I would like to see Michael R. Bloomberg enter the race. 
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