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Author Topic: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D  (Read 494 times)

rollsman44

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Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« on: June 21, 2019, 09:47:23 pm »

I have had both of these cameras and I happen to like them both. I am semi retired and will use the camera not often and mainly shoot Portraits and Family Groups. The 1 thing I am not so happy with, which is not a big deal is the 645D takes so long
it takes to Playback the images. They both have CCD and Low ISO capability. Both on the Heavy side.
The lenses are Less expensive on the Pentax. The H4D-40 is just right for the file sizes. I think the 645D LCD is sharper and better detail then the Hassy Rear LCD. Any other info that can help me make a decision. The Pentax body and the Hassy body are about the same price. The Hassy Lenses are more money. Can someone tell me the Better IQ of the Lenses on both, especially Skin Tones. Thanks
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BobShaw

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Re: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2019, 03:34:34 am »

I had an H4D with an H3DII-39 back.
I don't think that anyone would be disappointed with the image quality.
Do not rely on the image on the back of the scene for any decisions.
It often looks bad but the actual file captured is brilliant.

Having said that, I sold my H4 kit and for less money bought an X1D demo.
Get one in your hands and then decide if you want to walk around with the size and weight of a large mirror camera.

Good luck.
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rollsman44

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Re: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2019, 12:02:10 pm »

  Hi Bob, thank you. I know the IQ on the back of the screen is not all that good but the IQ is very good indeed. I dont have a Budget for the X1D and 1 lens.  The 2 cameras I mentioned are older and heavy and with Excellent IQ for the money. I am trying to buy a Med Format camera again
  for my personal self. For Me. So, I need to buy in as cheap as I can. I would love to have the X1D and just one lens( 80mm Standard lens)
   Even when the New Hassy comes out the camera will not drop that much. Thank you for sharing your info with me.
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Dan Wells

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Re: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2019, 01:37:19 pm »

What about a Fuji GFX 50R or a used GFX 50S? They are exactly the same sensor format as the old 40 MP CCD backs, with s modern CMOS sensor, and you can get a new 50R for $4000 right now.  Or, for that matter, a 24x36mm camera over 40 MP like a Nikon Z7 (or D850), Sony A7rIII, etc.? Any of them, in either format, will have significantly better image quality (in general) than the old 40 MP CCD backs - even cropping a modern 24x36mm sensor to 4:3 to match the shape will give you nearly 40 MP (starting with the 46 MP Nikon), and each pixel is enough better than the old CCDs that the overall image should be better...

 The CCD backs were at their best at base ISO (often 50), and really fell to pieces by ISO 400 or so. The Nikons capture some of the low ISO magic of medium format, although not the sensor size or shape (they go to ISO 64, and they're utterly noiseless at ISO 64), while offering modern high ISOs as well. I've seen varying opinions about whether the Fujis' lowest ISO is a true ISO 50 or an "L" setting (does it increase or decrease dynamic range?), but the Fujis are awfully nice at ISO 100. Either a Fuji GFX or a Nikon/Sony pixel monster will give you really usable ISOs up to 6400 and beyond as well as pristine low ISOs with huge dynamic range like the old backs had.

The 40 MP backs are 2010-era cameras built when the exotic Nikon D3x and Canon 1Ds III (around $7000-$8000, and 22-24 MP) were the next step down, and nothing much else was >12 MP. They were more or less obsoleted by the D800 in 2012, and completely obsoleted for most applications by the 50 MP medium format CMOS sensor and the D810 (which brought really low ISO to high resolution 24x36mm) a few years later.

Unless you need something really unique (a relatively inexpensive body to mount an HTS adapter, or a back to go on a view camera with an Hasselblad H mount if they exist), I wouldn't pay more than $1000 or $2000 at most for a pre-CMOS 40 MP Hasselblad. Since the Pentax doesn't have any of the 'blad's special flexibility with adapters, I wouldn't pay more than $800 for one (you can get a nice used D800 for that, and a D800 will make a better image in most situations).

The only case where a CCD camera makes sense (unless there's some unusual quality to the image you want as an effect) is some of the later generation 80 MP backs at low ISO. They really are lovely, and nothing short of a GFX 100 or a modern CMOS Phase is going to match them at ISO 50. They're also still very expensive (about $10,000 right now).

Unlike the GFX 100, they're very close to full 645 frame size. Those may become bargains for certain types of images (studio work, architecture, landscape close enough to the car that you're willing to carry their associated camera) if the GFX 100 pushes their prices way down - they'd be very interesting around $5000, because they offer higher low-ISO IQ than a GFX 50 or any Nikon or Sony, but with less ISO flexibility and convenience. They're also very flexible for view camera use, and could provide an interesting option with movements..
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 01:40:25 pm by Dan Wells »
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rollsman44

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Re: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2019, 11:01:21 pm »

  Hi Dan, what you say makes a lot os sense.  I am just speculating and would like to have Hassy X1D one day when the prices come way down( I hope )
   So, I will wait it out and see what happens with the market. I also realize that I dont want to carry around a Pentax 645D or Z so I will wait on the New Cameras to come out and then see what is a great deal. I had the NikonD810 Great IQ but I have this so called thing about MF as I had the Fuji GFX 50S and loved it, I really dont need BIG files anymore. So The Hassy X1d or any other cameraI might decide to wake up and smell the coffee.  Thanks for sharing all the info and it was a Wake up call for me. Greatly appreciate it 
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StoryinPictures

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Re: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« Reply #5 on: July 03, 2019, 02:00:01 pm »

My local store just sent an email offering lower pricing on the X1D and some lenses, so it might be worth checking around.
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Dan Wells

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Re: Hasselblad H4D-40 or Pentax 645D
« Reply #6 on: July 04, 2019, 01:12:40 am »

With the new mk II version of the Hassy being around $6000, you might luck into a used one of the original model for $4000 or so - GFX 50R money, and not that much more than a 24x36mm pixel monster... Expensive lenses, though... What did you not like about your 50S - why did you once (but no longer) have one?

Also remember that 33x44mm "medium format" is  closer to oversize 35mm film than to the old 645 film format. It's about 160% of the area of 24x36mm , while 645 was closer to 270%. It could almost fairly be called "half-frame 645" - it's a bit bigger than that, but not much. If you remember really odd older film formats, it's very close to 4x4 cm Superslide! I've only shot borrowed cameras a bit, but my impression of it is large-format detail (which the 24x36mm pixel monsters also do), but  without the different bokeh of a larger format. It feels a lot like really, really good 24x36mm digital.

If you want that larger format feel and you're willing to carry the weight and deal with the ISO limitations, maybe find an old Phase IQ 180? They're really gorgeous at base ISO, and that format is very close to 645.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2019, 01:16:05 am by Dan Wells »
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