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Author Topic: V flats or new Neewer panels?  (Read 796 times)

kevs

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V flats or new Neewer panels?
« on: February 18, 2019, 04:33:35 pm »

I've always wanted to have V flats in studio. The type that is tall and stands on it's own, black on one side white on another. Is it worth it to build your own, old fashioned, or just get the easy cheap Neewers  for example, that go against stands?



« Last Edit: February 18, 2019, 10:41:28 pm by kevs »
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BobShaw

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2019, 05:28:24 pm »

These are discussed heavily in places like the Sue Bryce Education group.
I guess it depends on what you need.
Personally i think that they are a complete waste of time and money.
I made one over several days of spraying and it has now sat taking up space for some time.
All I ever use is a 6x3m Manfrotto system with black, white and a mottled background.
When I am not using it then it is rolled up and out of the way.
When I am using it then it is big enough for a whole family or I can pull it out over the floor and shoot a model full length two metres from the back.
If I need a portable portrait system then I just use a trifold or a supported cloth.
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BobShaw

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2019, 08:32:06 pm »

Thanks Bob. I think the S. Bryce, at $360.00 a year, is a bit much for a discussion on this. You subscribe there?
 > No I don't. There are Facebook groups https://www.facebook.com/groups/SueBryceEducation/?fref=nf  and also the Creative Live course
I have a place to store these so that is not issue.  You never used yours after making them?  How much time and money was each one?
>Well I had the spray gun, but had to buy the sheets, buy the paint and do it. The dollar value is not much but if you add in your labour at even $20 per hour it adds up.

Do you have a link to the Manfrotto? Did a search, could not find it. Same question: "trifold or a supported cloth."
> This is in Australia but you will find them everywhere eg B&H
https://www.kayellaustralia.com.au/manfrotto-background-supports-c-199_354_362.html
Trifold just means "Collapsible"   https://www.kayellaustralia.com.au/backgrounds-c-207_816.html
See comments above >
Basically if you shoot natural light then you have to put the subject in a space where the light is. If you shoot flash then you do anything, anywhere, at midnight.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2019, 08:39:42 pm by BobShaw »
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Kirk_C

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2019, 08:52:51 pm »

Thanks Bob. I think the S. Bryce, at $360.00 a year, is a bit much for a discussion on this. You subscribe there?

I have a place to store these so that is not issue.  You never used yours after making them?  How much time and money was each one?

Do you have a link to the Manfrotto? Did a search, could not find it. Same question: "trifold or a supported cloth."

Here you have a wide range of experienced professionals who're helping you with all your newbie questions for free through your many, many posts on this forum.

Sue Bryce is making a living by charging for similar advice. How much is that worth ? I guess it depends on who you are, how you value your time and the time of the people you're asking to teach you photography.
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BobShaw

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2019, 10:22:48 pm »

Thanks Bob, just studio strobe:

If you have a link to the Manfrotto- please send? Did a search, could not find it. Same question: "trifold or a supported cloth."?
Please go back and read my last post.
I posted links there. Once you know what it is called it is easy to find.
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bcooter

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #5 on: February 19, 2019, 11:13:09 am »

I've always wanted to have V flats in studio. The type that is tall and stands on it's own, black on one side white on another. Is it worth it to build your own, old fashioned, or just get the easy cheap Neewers  for example, that go against stands?

To really answer this I need more information.  What market do you live or work in?  Do you have crew or a one man band?
Do you want negative and positive fill?  You said you work in studio, but how about location?   Do you have C stands with arms and knuckles, along with Sand/Shot bags for weight?

The reason I ask is if your in the U.S. almost every professional camera store/rental supply, will sell foam board white on one side black on the other, in 4 ft. x 8 ft. sheets.  Those and a roll of black gaffers tape and you can build 3 sets of 8x8 V flats in 10 minutes.

For support you just put a C stand with an extended arm and it will hold them which are now 4 ft. x 8 ft.   If your outside same thing, but you need shot bags and an assistant to mange them if there is wind. 

If you want something that stores away, there is the California sun bounce, but smaller and much more expensive.  It's a flexible cloth which stretches to a fold away frame.  There is also this company that is U.S. based https://vflatworld.com that makes foldable v flats that travel easier.   Either way, I would also look at purchasing a 4x4 matthews shiny board for accents, it has a yoke frame that allows you to mount it on a c-stand and if you learn to work it you can do some amazing things with the shiny board, but you need to be imaginative and know why you use it not just how.

http://www.clutchcamera.com/product/matthews-shiny-board/

I personally don't like flexible fill devices and there are many, because any wind is always changing the fill and one person can hold a shiny board or a 4x8 sheet of foam board.

In countries outside of the states, foam board is a little more difficult to source, but can be found.   We just worked in a London studio that had 4x8 styrofoam that was painted black on one side.  I've never believed styrofoam works well, as it tends to bounce or absorb less light and are horribly fragile.   

If your just learning lighting, the best teacher you'll ever have is a cinema gaffer as a good one knows their business. 

As I said above, the problem with learning on line or in a class room is they usually teach you how to do something, but don't explain why.   

IMO

BC
« Last Edit: February 19, 2019, 12:14:04 pm by bcooter »
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kevs

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2019, 01:06:54 pm »

Thanks Nice post Bcooter:

This will be one man band, test shoots, personal work, maybe jobs later --mostly studio, major US cities, I have stands, and some knuckles etc and can buy BH what don't have.
No C stands, many normal stands.

V flat world com sells these ready to go $200. Anywhere to see those? You think good value buy?

Are you sure flats are so easy, This video which is most popular on the subject, looks very draining to do. I can hardly follow it- maybe it's over-complicated?:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oamY8DNaw98&feature=youtu.be

You think V flats can be done super quick easy?

And I think to DIY still will come to $100 each.. but maybe you don't need the V. Maybe just get flats, (I want black mainly) and just lean it against a stand or chair?

Also, I have one flag, and may go the flag route.

All these have pro/ cons. Board, flats (apart from the ones V flat world sells),  are bulky in studio ( and take room but are so quick to put up.

Flags are very cool with arms, knuckles, I'm leaning toward getting more of those, they have issue.

the hokey fold out stuff from Neewer looks ok, real cheap, have not tested, but have to set up those little arm things.

Is this the shiny board:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/33444-REG/Matthews_B119069_Reflector_24x24.html
What amazing things can you do with it? I generally don't fill with hard silver.

Not sure that interest me so much, I have oval reflectors with arm.

How do you define flexible fill devices?

I assisted many photographers years ago.just never really dived into depth on subtractive lighting.. actually one of the more complex topics in photography!  Even the folks I assisted did not use flags or flats that much..  (still shoots, not film)

« Last Edit: February 19, 2019, 01:12:02 pm by kevs »
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faberryman

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2019, 01:09:53 pm »

What do you want to do with v-flats that you can't do with your existing lighting equipment?

kevs

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2019, 01:45:34 pm »

If you have two V flat in black, you can put them on one or both sides of a person, creating interesting shadows and lighting on face/ body.

Exploring options. Never used flats or flags extensively, so seeing options/ possibility.
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Joe Towner

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2019, 02:30:46 pm »

$100??? 4'x8' foam core Black/White sheets are $34 each at the local camera store.  Some gaff and you're done.  Check local art supply stores - Blick or such - as they'll have them on hand.  Don't think shipping them will ever make sense - you're paying for the dimensions, not the weight.
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StoryinPictures

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2019, 12:25:35 am »

The trick is finding a local source for supply.

I find v flats very useful in studio. They are easy enough to get where you want them. They are self-supporting, which is more efficient than putting up a stand. And moving them is quicker, too.

They are too much hassle to transport, so on location I use options like those others mentioned above.

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D Fuller

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2019, 08:15:10 am »


Is this the shiny board:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/33444-REG/Matthews_B119069_Reflector_24x24.html
What amazing things can you do with it? I generally don't fill with hard silver.

Not sure that interest me so much, I have oval reflectors with arm.

How do you define flexible fill devices?


Yes, that’s the shiny board. You don’t use it for fill (at least not usually), you use it to move the sun where you want it.

Google “flex fill” a number of people make them. Everything cooter says about them is true, but they’re handy if you’re working very light with one assistant.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2019, 08:18:42 am by D Fuller »
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Fred Salamon

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Re: V flats or new Neewer panels?
« Reply #12 on: May 09, 2019, 01:34:59 pm »

Try https://graphicdisplayusa.com/distributors/
Also try looking for graphics/sign suppliers, not sign makers but the companies that sign makers buy their materials from.

I have recently ordered samples of Foamcor, Gatorboard and Ultraboard.
Does anyone know if these products are all suitable for vflats or if one is better than the others?

« Last Edit: May 09, 2019, 01:39:47 pm by Fred Salamon »
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