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Author Topic: Sonyís new A6400  (Read 739 times)

Martin Kristiansen

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Sonyís new A6400
« on: January 16, 2019, 05:34:09 am »

We seem to some threads that have gone on incredibly long and have slowly morphed into different areas. Someone actually mentioned this on the thread announcing Nikonís new mirrorless offerings. I thought this new camera therefore deserved a thread of its own

Iím not going to link to any particular source. There are now many including YouTube videos. It seems Sony is focussing on AF on this camera that looks like an upgrade to the 6300. No IBIS, which is a little disappointing but some good stuff. Built in interverlometer is good.

425 phase detection AF points and the same for contrast detection AF points. What they call real time eye tracking. You can specify left or right eye. A statement that eye AF will be introduced with a firmware update in the next few months. That sounds interesting. Basically enhancements to AI auto focussing and tracking. AI has become a bit of a marketing buzz word but this still all sounds good.

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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2019, 05:36:35 am »

Wanted to add that this seems to confirm Sonyís commitment to APSC. Particularly in light of the rumors of a new A7000 that are slowly starting to gain some credibility. 
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hogloff

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2019, 08:21:34 am »

Seems like a great camera for it's price point ( $900 ). Interested to see how it's AF tests out...might be time to dump my 7D.
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2019, 08:40:30 am »

Crazy price really. I ran my entire business for almost a year using a 6300 as my main camera. When I think back to the mid 1990s and what i paid for my 1,4MP Kodak DCS 420.
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mcbroomf

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2019, 02:43:33 pm »

I may be interested in an a6700 or a7000 as it's being called, with features building on the a6500, but not this one.  However the bigger news (for me) in this whole Sony announcement is the firmware updates coming to the A7 series, in particular the intervalometer which was nixed when Sony moved from the II series to III series.  There's improved eye af and animal eye af as well as connectivity but I don't use them.
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gkroeger

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2019, 03:11:03 pm »

However the bigger news (for me) in this whole Sony announcement is the firmware updates coming to the A7 series, in particular the intervalometer which was nixed when Sony moved from the II series to III series.

+1

And I will also appreciate the improved eye af
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HywelPhillips

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2019, 04:11:33 pm »

I was briefly interested in this - I have use of a vlogging camera, my wife even more so, and the idea of one with souped-up Eye AF that takes my Sony lenses was exciting.

BUT...

for this use case I think they blew it.

1) No IBIS.
2) The flip screen flips up... where it will immediately get blocked by the hot shot video micPro that an awful lot of vloggers (including us) use as standard.
3) Still the tiny previous-gen Sony batteries.

I could just about accept the lack of stablisation, I can use it on a gimbal.
The battery would definitely be an annoyance, but at least I have a bunch of them around to go with my A7RII.

But the flip screen being blocked by the mic is a real "who the hell thought that was the way to do it?" moment.

Honestly Sony, how hard can it be to put the hinge on it so it articulates out the side, like other manufacturers do? One honestly has to wonder who their ergonomics department has been speaking to that this simple fact of vlogging life escaped them at the design stage.

Does Panasonic have the patent on the GH4-style fully-hinged articulated flip out screen or something?

Sigh.

Hywel.



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Kirk_C

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2019, 07:53:53 pm »

BUT...

for this use case I think they blew it.

They put several significant improvements into an existing design and dropped the price. It's a tremendous value and has one of the best auto focus systems in the world. They didn't give you everything you wanted because it's an interim update and so that's blowing it ?

That's a rhetorical question by the way.





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Dan Wells

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Re: Sony’s new A6400
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2019, 08:37:25 pm »

Sony certainly does have a significant advantage as the only mirrorless system with APS-C and FF options with the same accessories and decent lens compatibility. I don't personally like their interface, but it is pretty consistent across models as well, with modifications for cameras with fewer controls

FF lenses are often, although not always, bulky and odd focal lengths on APS-C (although long telephotos work very well on APS-C - they get "longer", and they're always bulky, regardless of format).. This is certainly not a unique Sony problem. Canon and Nikon DSLRs have the same issue of largely poor-quality APS-C lenses supplemented by excellent FF lenses that may not be what you want on the smaller format.

Where Sony has a huge advantage is in accessories other than lenses - flash systems and the like are completely compatible. I use Nikon Z and Fuji, and even my memory cards don't cross over!

Everybody has battery issues - neither option is completely satisfactory. Some manufacturers stick to one very small battery that fits in their smallest camera and end up like Fuji. The NP-W126 is completely ridiculous in some of the larger cameras, especially the X-H1.

 Others use a larger battery in larger cameras and wind up without the problem of a power-hungry camera with a tiny battery, but with two or more incompatible batteries in many photographers' bags, as Sony has done with the larger battery in recent FF models.

Nikon has done as good a job of this as anyone - the ubiquitous EN-EL15 series is large enough to power a pro camera, and shows up in  the more serious APS-C DSLRs, all the FF DSLRs except the D3-D5 series, and the Z6/Z7. If they come out with an APS-C Z-series body, I hope they squeeze the EN-EL15b in...

Overall, this doesn't change much that I can see - a decent backup body for Sony FF shooters that gives a different set of focal lengths. It's clearly superior to the A6300, unless you get the 6300 on clearance for much less.

 It's not that much more camera than the A6000 for half the price, although the faster AF is useful. If you have Sony FF and don't care about the different focal lengths, the price difference to the A7II is relatively small for FF, IBIS and other features? The A7II is presently $1398, a meaningful difference - but it has been as low as $998, and it probably will be again.

If you don't have Sony FF, Sony APS-C isn't compelling on its own because of the poor lens selection. if you're going to use FF lenses but haven't considered an FF body, why not an A7II? The A6400 is $1298 with a decent lens (18-135). The A7II is $1598 with the 28-70. You get a much wider zoom range with the A6400, but you get into the FF system Sony's really supporting with the A7II
« Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 08:49:07 pm by Dan Wells »
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hogloff

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2019, 10:19:48 pm »



Where Sony has a huge advantage is in accessories other than lenses - flash systems and the like are completely compatible. I use Nikon Z and Fuji, and even my memory cards don't cross over!


You illustrate the biggest problem with going Fuji for your APS-C system...it's a dead end if you also want a full frame system. I just cannot see how you travel with both a Fuji and Nikon system where everything from memory cards, batteries, lenses, chargers etc... are duplicated.
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Dan Wells

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2019, 12:48:08 am »

I choose one per trip into the backcountry - sometimes I bring both if I have several shoots on one trip, and I'll have a place to store what I'm not using. Not ideal, and that is Sony's big advantage. I don't like Sony's weather sealing (for which there is some empirical evidence), and I've never personally gotten along with their ergonomics - but they certainly have the most compatible two-format mirrorless system (it's comparable to Canon and Nikon DSLR systems).

Even going all Fuji (I looked seriously at the GFX before going with the Z) wouldn't help much but memory cards and my lone flash. The difference in sensor size is too great for any lens compatibility. The great weakness of the GFX system is that, while they do handle like a big X camera, they share so few accessories with the X system. Cards, sure - but everybody but Nikon shares cards. Flash, yes, and that could be important to someone who shoots a lot of flash and owns a bunch of them. I have one that lives in the bottom of my bag for occasional use, mainly for family snapshots (it's a Nikon dedicated Phottix that works in manual on the Fujis). No lenses, batteries, grips or really anything else.

The tiny NP-W126 batteries  on Fuji APS-C wouldn't power the medium format cameras, so Fuji wen't with a battery block that looks kind of like two NP-W 126 batteries stacked.  This odd shape wouldn't fit in any smaller camera.  Most standard-size DSLR batteries fit in good-sized mirrorless bodies just fine (e.g. Sony FZ100, Nikon EN-EL15, Canon LP-E6). The Fuji medium format battery is also a 10.8 volt unit, while every other camera battery except the D3-D5 and 1D series monsters is around 7.2-7.4 volts. Why not do a Fuji version of an EN-EL15 or FZ-100, and share it between medium format and the X-H and X-T series? The GFX should run just fine on 7+ volts, because other medium format cameras do. Such a battery would fit easily in an X-H1 and probably even an X-T2 or X-T3.

I like Fuji a lot, but they need to recruit some Sony or Nikon battery engineers (or just buy the batteries Sony wants to sell them)...
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HywelPhillips

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2019, 08:08:20 am »

They put several significant improvements into an existing design and dropped the price. It's a tremendous value and has one of the best auto focus systems in the world. They didn't give you everything you wanted because it's an interim update and so that's blowing it ?

That's a rhetorical question by the way.

Please note the "for this use case" in my original post.

The A6400 looks like a fine camera, especially for the price. But for the specific use case of vlogging- something which Sony's own promo videos seem to be emphasising- the blocking of the screen by a shotgun mic on the hot shoe which is absolutely standard equipment in this use case counts as blowing it, yes. Even the mic Sony will sell you blocks the screen!

Hinging the screen at the side as numerous other manufacturers do is a much better solution which Sony flat out should have adopted for a camera aimed at vloggers.

Hywel
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 08:12:21 am by HywelPhillips »
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2019, 08:16:01 am »

Please note the "for this use case" in my original post.

The A6400 looks like a fine camera, especially for the price. But for the specific use case of vlogging- something which Sony's own promo videos seem to be emphasising- the blocking of the screen by a shotgun mic on the hot shoe which is absolutely standard equipment in this use case counts as blowing it, yes. Even the mic Sony will sell you blocks the screen!

Hinging the screen at the side as numerous other manufacturers do is a much better solution which Sony flat out should have adopted for a camera aimed at vloggers.

Hywel

Is the camera aimed at vloggers? I guess if that is so they did blow it. For most other stuff at the price point it looks pretty good though.
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HywelPhillips

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2019, 09:02:45 am »

Is the camera aimed at vloggers? I guess if that is so they did blow it. For most other stuff at the price point it looks pretty good though.

Here is a Sony promo video showing that yes, Sony are aiming the camera at vloggers.
#VlogWithSony hashtag and pistol grip and all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=7&v=IHGRyw9NKR0

My comment wasn't out of the blue. They're aiming the camera at Vloggers but have screwed up the ergonomics for this use case.

Cheers, Hywel
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2019, 09:19:21 am »

Here is a Sony promo video showing that yes, Sony are aiming the camera at vloggers.
#VlogWithSony hashtag and pistol grip and all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=7&v=IHGRyw9NKR0

My comment wasn't out of the blue. They're aiming the camera at Vloggers but have screwed up the ergonomics for this use case.

Cheers, Hywel

Thanks for the link and clearing that up. Looks like a disjunction between engineering am
Nd marketing. I agree thatís  poor for vlogging so why make a big deal out of it. To me the big deal here is enhancements to auto focus and what that indicates for other future models.
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hogloff

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #15 on: January 17, 2019, 09:43:48 am »

Thanks for the link and clearing that up. Looks like a disjunction between engineering am
Nd marketing. I agree thatís  poor for vlogging so why make a big deal out of it. To me the big deal here is enhancements to auto focus and what that indicates for other future models.

I'm looking at this camera for its AF abilities as well as its fps for action. I have zero interest in vlogging or in fact video.
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2019, 09:57:03 am »

I'm looking at this camera for its AF abilities as well as its fps for action. I have zero interest in vlogging or in fact video.

Also for me. I do some video but use a Zoom recorder for sound and an external hdmi monitor so really not an issue at all. But the Auto focus sounds very interesting.

I have been offered a boxed mint A9 at a crazy price. Doing some research to be sure itís legit and not stolen. It will run this new firmware update that the 6400 is running. That could be a good deal for me.
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HywelPhillips

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2019, 10:11:55 am »

Thanks for the link and clearing that up. Looks like a disjunction between engineering am
Nd marketing. I agree thatís  poor for vlogging so why make a big deal out of it. To me the big deal here is enhancements to auto focus and what that indicates for other future models.

I completely agree! I'm not a Sony hater- far from it, I've got an A7RII and an A7RIII and a lot of native lenses and shoot Sony most of the time these days. The autofocus was already good, improvements are very welcome. I'm very much looking forward to shutter button half depress to active eye EF on my A7RIII.

The 6400 is a nice camera built to a good spec for the price.

It's just that putting a flip screen in that orientation is a bit daft if you're then going to try to sell it to vloggers.

I'm guessing this rear flip arrangement may be cheaper to build, or maybe require licensing some patents or something? Some cheap cameras do have the side hinge arrangement (eg Panasonic FZ330, Canon EOS 800D, Panasonic G7, Canon EOS M50). Some compacts also have this "flip from behind" arrangement, including even a few with the hot shoe also blocking the screen, but I've not seen them billed as specifically vlogging cameras. 

Cheers, Hywel


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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #18 on: January 17, 2019, 10:16:55 am »

Off topic Hywel

I have a A7RII. I have a choice to upgrade between a A9 and a A7RIII. I figure I already have the bigger sensor in the A7RIII so might go for the A9. But I reLly like the A7RII. My question is would you reccomend the upgrade to the III? Is it that much better than the II?
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hogloff

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Re: Sonyís new A6400
« Reply #19 on: January 17, 2019, 10:59:30 am »

Off topic Hywel

I have a A7RII. I have a choice to upgrade between a A9 and a A7RIII. I figure I already have the bigger sensor in the A7RIII so might go for the A9. But I reLly like the A7RII. My question is would you reccomend the upgrade to the III? Is it that much better than the II?

Depends on what you shoot. I use the A7R2 for landscape and travel and looked into the A7R3, but did not see enough differences to justify the extra cost.

Personally I'd go with the A9 and A7R2 combo.
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