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Author Topic: All the TS-E lenses  (Read 1253 times)

keithcooper

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All the TS-E lenses
« on: July 11, 2018, 11:47:42 AM »

After Canon lent me the three new TS-E lenses for reviews I looked back at previous articles and reviews I'd done and realised that I needed several new reviews for the full TS-E 'set'

Anyway, I've just finished lengthy reviews of the TS-E17mm F4L and TS-E24mm F3.5L II and one of the TS-E45 F2.8 in the same format as I did for the new 50/90/135 lenses

So, if anyone's curious, they're at:

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-ts-e-24mm-3-5l-ii-review/

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-ts-e17mm-f4l-review/

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/ts-e45mm-f2-8-lens-review/

The 17mm is probably the first for an update, but given the frequency of TS-E announcements in the past (1991/2009/2017) I perhaps won't be holding my breath (well that and I actually rarely have issues with the 17mm ;-)  )

My only consistent dislike of the 2009 and 2017 TS-E lenses is the much reduced focus throw compared to the 1991 ones.  Not much, but a gripe none the less...

I do note that Canon have had patent applications that have added electronics to the T/S mechanisms - maybe 2024?  ;-)

Shiftworker

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2018, 12:43:57 PM »

The 17mm needs an update IMO. It's got quite a field curvature problem that gets worse as you stop down so the edges of the frame never 'pull in' and demands careful focusing using live view to get optimal sharpness right across the frame on distant scenes. It's probably too specialised to get upgraded optically but using it on a 5Ds or a Sony 42mp sensor shows it's limitations. The 24mm is a much better and more consistent lens. The new 50mm looks great but I can't fault my shift adapted Hassleblad 50mm FL-E so I can't justify the cost.
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NancyP

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2018, 11:55:47 AM »

Thank you very much, Keith. Your explanation of T-S mechanics, tables, and so on are quite clear.

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keithcooper

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2018, 12:33:53 PM »

Thanks - with all the reviews still 'fresh', Karen has been twisting my arm to write a few extra articles about different aspects of T/S use, hopefully should get a few done over the next few weeks!

philbond87

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2018, 05:09:49 PM »

The 17mm needs an update IMO. It's got quite a field curvature problem that gets worse as you stop down...

Strange, I've never noticed a field curvature issue on either mine or a colleague's.
Have you seen this on more than one copy?

(Admittedly I don't know that I've ever had the lens racked out to actual infinity, but effectively so, I reckon, when shooting large building exteriors.)
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keithcooper

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2018, 05:43:27 PM »

Strange, I've never noticed a field curvature issue on either mine or a colleague's.
Have you seen this on more than one copy?

(Admittedly I don't know that I've ever had the lens racked out to actual infinity, but effectively so, I reckon, when shooting large building exteriors.)
I also looked when writing up the review - I've not seen it either.

I get no significant problems using it with my 5Ds (YMMV, but it earns me a chunk of my living)

Now, I -could- do with better edge performance and a bit better resistance to flare, but I can wait until I've plenty more MP than in the 5Ds

NancyP

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2018, 09:17:40 PM »

Keith, concerning the mechanical properties of the TS-E 24mm f/3.5 L II, how delicate are the T/S/rotate lens orientation controls? Do the TS-E lenses need occasional tune-ups from Canon Services? I am a beginner at TS use and am considering buying used (if a good copy becomes available) vs new, and wondering if I should skip used TS-E lens. (I have bought ordinary used and refurbished lenses with good success).
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Shiftworker

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2018, 02:28:18 AM »



I -could- do with better edge performance
lack of edge performance can be caused by field curvature. Would you honestly say it's as good as the 24mm? Just to put it in perspective I'm not saying it's a bad performer and certainly it's acceptable in may cases and the only choice when you need a wider than 24mm shift lens but if you wanted to guarantee maximum detail across the frame on a shot and you had the luxury of moving back would you be equally confident in using the 17mm as you would with the 24mm?
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keithcooper

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2018, 04:33:30 AM »

Keith, concerning the mechanical properties of the TS-E 24mm f/3.5 L II, how delicate are the T/S/rotate lens orientation controls? Do the TS-E lenses need occasional tune-ups from Canon Services? I am a beginner at TS use and am considering buying used (if a good copy becomes available) vs new, and wondering if I should skip used TS-E lens. (I have bought ordinary used and refurbished lenses with good success).
I've had both 17 and 24 since 2009 and neither have needed any work or service.

The shift axis rotation on the 17 is a bit looser than it was, but still fine by me for regular use.

Both my original 24mm and Mk1 90mm were purchased used and worked fine, The 90mm is still fine...

keithcooper

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2018, 04:48:10 AM »

lack of edge performance can be caused by field curvature. Would you honestly say it's as good as the 24mm? Just to put it in perspective I'm not saying it's a bad performer and certainly it's acceptable in may cases and the only choice when you need a wider than 24mm shift lens but if you wanted to guarantee maximum detail across the frame on a shot and you had the luxury of moving back would you be equally confident in using the 17mm as you would with the 24mm?

Well, it's not just moving back - sometimes I want the perspective of a shot with the 17 over the 24.

The 17 is good enough that the choice of shot would usually be my prime driver between the two.

However, there are times where the drop off in image quality at the edge of the image circle would nudge me to the 24, not often but they are there.  Whether this matters on a particular job is an entirely different question ;-)

As I said, I could do with an improved version, but it's well down my list of urgent needs.

Sometimes where I need really fine detail over a large area, I take the gigapan with me and stitch - sure, it means more work and limits some types of shots, but it works a treat

NancyP

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2018, 11:51:37 AM »

Keith, thank you very much. I just bought a used TS-E 24mm f/3.5 II  ;D
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BartvanderWolf

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2018, 07:35:07 AM »

Sometimes where I need really fine detail over a large area, I take the gigapan with me and stitch - sure, it means more work and limits some types of shots, but it works a treat

And stitching with the TS-E 24mm (unshifted) uses the superior center of the image circle, and still allows to use tilt ...

Cheers,
Bart
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keithcooper

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How and why I use shift...
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2018, 09:54:47 AM »

After finishing the reviews off I had a look at them and noted that whilst i've written lots about using tilt, I'd never really addressed the different ways to use lens shift.

Anyway, I've just put together some notes on how and why I use shift - mainly intended for those looking to try stuff out rather than people with years of experience of camera movements ;-)

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/how-to-use-a-shift-lens-on-your-camera/

I hope it's of some interest.

David Good

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2018, 04:05:14 PM »

Another interesting and informative article Keith, thank-you.

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haefnerphoto

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2018, 09:37:04 PM »

After Canon lent me the three new TS-E lenses for reviews I looked back at previous articles and reviews I'd done and realised that I needed several new reviews for the full TS-E 'set'

Anyway, I've just finished lengthy reviews of the TS-E17mm F4L and TS-E24mm F3.5L II and one of the TS-E45 F2.8 in the same format as I did for the new 50/90/135 lenses

So, if anyone's curious, they're at:

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-ts-e-24mm-3-5l-ii-review/

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/canon-ts-e17mm-f4l-review/

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/ts-e45mm-f2-8-lens-review/

The 17mm is probably the first for an update, but given the frequency of TS-E announcements in the past (1991/2009/2017) I perhaps won't be holding my breath (well that and I actually rarely have issues with the 17mm ;-)  )

My only consistent dislike of the 2009 and 2017 TS-E lenses is the much reduced focus throw compared to the 1991 ones.  Not much, but a gripe none the less...

I do note that Canon have had patent applications that have added electronics to the T/S mechanisms - maybe 2024?  ;-)


I have quite a bit of experience with both the 17 and 24, they are wonderful lenses!  One thing of note is that the lenses vary in quality quite a bit, I recommend testing a new lens before using it on a job.  I have two copies of each and one of my 24s isn't sharp anymore.  Canon has tested it a number of times but insists it's within their acceptable parameters.  Unfortunately, I'll have to replace it.  Jim
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alatreille

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2018, 01:47:53 PM »


I have quite a bit of experience with both the 17 and 24, they are wonderful lenses!  One thing of note is that the lenses vary in quality quite a bit, I recommend testing a new lens before using it on a job.  I have two copies of each and one of my 24s isn't sharp anymore.  Canon has tested it a number of times but insists it's within their acceptable parameters.  Unfortunately, I'll have to replace it.  Jim


Hi Jim, I've had the same conversation with CPS in Canada at least twice for each of my lenses.  When I shift a certain direction, I loose focus right out on the edge.  It feels like the focus plane is off ever ever so slightly as it only occurs at a certain point.
But apparently my lenses are perfect on their optical bench...You'd think CPS would listen to it's field testers (pros)  ;-)

I just ordered a new copy of each.

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TomRobbins

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Re: All the TS-E lenses
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2018, 05:13:52 AM »

Understanding Aspect Ratios & The Art of Cropping, Michael Reichmann's article, is as informative now as it was eleven years ago.

The simplest way to obtain an aspect ratio different from the 35mm 2x3 is to shoot wide and then crop down. Doing so involves throwing away pixels, which I hate doing doing just on general principle. A better alternative is to stitch multiple frames and then crop to the desired format. The end result can have more pixels than any of the individual 35mm files—sort of a poor man's large format.

An efficient way of taking multiple frames for stitching is to use shift-tilt lenses. With the camera body in landscape orientation, it is possible to shift side to side for a 1x2 panorama without going anywhere near the edge of lens travel. Two frames will suffice. Similarly, shifting vertically with the camera in landscape orientation will enable cropping to square to a variety of rectangles, all without having to shift to the extreme edges of lens travel.

There are difficulties with this approach, the most obvious of which is the subject must be fairly static. Another, which will become quickly apparent at the beginning, is the need to mentally see in aspect ratios other than the standard 2x3 ratio. This may take some practice.

On the other hand, merging the shifted frames when processing is a snap. Photoshop's tools work perfectly fine in my experience.

I've used Canon's tilt-shift lenses for years. The new versions have improved controls and, more importantly, better optics at the extreme limits of shift travel. Especially the 50mm over the old 45mm, which was never a stellar performer.  A recent shifted pano - http://www.pbase.com/image/167798014/original And a recent two-shot vertical shift - http://www.pbase.com/image/167598158/original
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