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Author Topic: Another Thing:  (Read 2071 times)

Rob C

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Another Thing:
« on: May 13, 2018, 01:40:55 pm »

As some of us with grey or no hair may remember, was a time that a better, blanket word was used to encompass street: we called it candid.

It included almost every situation where a photo was made of subjects not entirely aware that they were being photographed. At a stroke, it permitted indoor images as well as those exterior masterpieces we were going to make next time out. If there was a common thread, it was that humans were the centre of interest. Formal portraits were not, of course included.

Rob

OmerV

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2018, 02:26:22 pm »

As some of us with grey or no hair may remember, was a time that a better, blanket word was used to encompass street: we called it candid.

It included almost every situation where a photo was made of subjects not entirely aware that they were being photographed. At a stroke, it permitted indoor images as well as those exterior masterpieces we were going to make next time out. If there was a common thread, it was that humans were the centre of interest. Formal portraits were not, of course included.

Rob

Good point Rob. I think "street" has become romanticized to the point of being exclusive by ignorance. All the great street/candid/documentary photogs that have been listed recently made many candid photos in bars, fairs, churches, etc. that are part of their serious work. Even Winogrand, who seemed to live on streets, made great photographs while he was inside rather than outside. Diverse settings help to stay enthusiastic.

RSL

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2018, 03:47:19 pm »

Omer, "street" photography has nothing at all to do with a street. Check HCB, who's certainly the most honored definer of the genre. Specifically, check "Behind the Gare St. Lazare," which is one of his most famous street shots. See a street there?
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RSL

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2018, 03:48:46 pm »

As some of us with grey or no hair may remember, was a time that a better, blanket word was used to encompass street: we called it candid.

Rob

Rob, for me the trouble with "candid" is that it brings back visions of tourist "color slides" made with an Argus C3.
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Rob C

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2018, 05:16:59 pm »

Rob, for me the trouble with "candid" is that it brings back visions of tourist "color slides" made with an Argus C3.

Ah! Bad luck!

For me, it brings to mind other stuff entirely that I only saw in US publications.

Incidentally, Tony Vaccaro used an Argus, didn't he, as an enlisted soldier during WW2, when the officials wanted him to use an impossible 4x5? Didn't do him any harm on his way to a civilian career!

Rob

OmerV

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2018, 08:41:21 pm »

Omer, "street" photography has nothing at all to do with a street. Check HCB, who's certainly the most honored definer of the genre. Specifically, check "Behind the Gare St. Lazare," which is one of his most famous street shots. See a street there?

Yes Russ, I've known that for a long time. But there are many people who sincerely believe that "street" means street, period. That mistaken belief was what I was addressing in my comment.

I think both Winogrand and Cartier-Bresson disliked the "street photography" term, or perhaps it was only Winogrand. It may be that curators and critics favor the term for historical reasons, but who knows.

PS  I've got 40+yrs in photography, not as much as you, Rob and others, but still, it counts for something, no?  :D

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2018, 01:49:08 am »

Omer, "street" photography has nothing at all to do with a street...

Then why call it so?

Come to think of it, as we have international readership, it would be interesting to know how is that genre known in other lanquages. I used to read German photo magazines, and do not remember seeing it referred to as “strasse fotografie.”



Rob C

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2018, 05:35:44 am »

Then why call it so?

Come to think of it, as we have international readership, it would be interesting to know how is that genre known in other lanquages. I used to read German photo magazines, and do not remember seeing it referred to as “strasse fotografie.”

In Spain, it is called street too, or calle, which is simply the word street in Spanish.

Rob C

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #8 on: May 14, 2018, 05:42:41 am »

In my view, that New York book by Klein is the best definition, by example, of what the words "street photography" mean to me.

HC-B was a different thing, because his work was often very much commissioned, at which point it became commercial, like it or not, in the photographer's manner or handwriting.

I think some of his African work reminiscent of Martin Mukácsi's non-commercial stuff...

RSL

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #9 on: May 14, 2018, 07:12:05 am »

Yes Russ, I've known that for a long time. But there are many people who sincerely believe that "street" means street, period. That mistaken belief was what I was addressing in my comment.

I think both Winogrand and Cartier-Bresson disliked the "street photography" term, or perhaps it was only Winogrand. It may be that curators and critics favor the term for historical reasons, but who knows.

PS  I've got 40+yrs in photography, not as much as you, Rob and others, but still, it counts for something, no?  :D

Didn't mean to step on your toes, Omer. And I agree. I wish we had a better term for street photography. I think it got that name because people like HCB walked the streets shooting what became called "street" even though a lot of it had nothing to do with a street.
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2018, 09:36:41 am »

In Spain, it is called street too, or calle, which is simply the word street in Spanish.

It might be original, or it might be simply a translation from English, as an indicator of its world cultural dominance.

I can’t even remember if we had a term for it in my mother tongue, but I can certainly remember that it wasn’t “ulična fotografija,” which would be a direct translation. I wouldn’t be surprised, however, that after I left, the new generation actually just did that, direct translation, as already we, and even more so they, have done so many times in the past. Or even simpler, just adopted the English term.

RSL

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2018, 09:45:52 am »

HC-B was a different thing, because his work was often very much commissioned, at which point it became commercial, like it or not, in the photographer's manner or handwriting.

I think some of his African work reminiscent of Martin Mukácsi's non-commercial stuff...

You're right, Rob. HCB did most of his real street work before he and the others started Magnum, and he very clearly stated that it was one of Mukácsi's photographs that showed him, in a flash, what was possible. This is the one that grabbed him.
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Eric Myrvaagnes

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2018, 10:53:17 am »

That is a fine one to be inspired by.
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Rob C

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #13 on: May 14, 2018, 01:33:44 pm »

That is a fine one to be inspired by.


Indeed it is, Eric, and it clearly explains the young HC-B's obsession with not cropping: if Marty didn't crop, why should young Henri?

History teaches us all so much. I shall soon be a history book too - if paper production is still permitted by the Greens.

Two23

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #14 on: May 14, 2018, 09:15:26 pm »

Another point to kick around.  Does it have be outside, i.e. on the street, to be "street" photography?  Or does it simply imply wandering around and taking photos in an urban setting?  My thinking is there has to be two elements:  (1) candidness  (2) at least one human in the image.   Are urban photos without people just a form of architectural photography?

Below photo from Chicago, using a 1935 Voigtlander Bessa, HP 5.


Kent in SD
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #15 on: May 15, 2018, 07:11:11 am »

...(1) candidness  (2) at least one human in the image...

#2 is redundant. You can’t have a candid shot without a person in it.  :)

Rob C

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #16 on: May 15, 2018, 07:39:43 am »

#2 is redundant. You can’t have a candid shot without a person in it.  :)


Agreed, especially according to my Klein definition!

:-;

stamper

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #17 on: May 15, 2018, 11:27:45 am »

Didn't mean to step on your toes, Omer. And I agree. I wish we had a better term for street photography. I think it got that name because people like HCB walked the streets shooting what became called "street" even though a lot of it had nothing to do with a street.

What about.... A slice of life.....?

RSL

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #18 on: May 15, 2018, 11:30:32 am »

Too many words, Rob. How about "humanity?"
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stamper

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Re: Another Thing:
« Reply #19 on: May 15, 2018, 11:54:42 am »

Too many words, Rob. How about "humanity?"

That is the description that this guy uses.

https://erickimphotography.com
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