Canon Pro-1000 ink "usage" for small paper size?

[Abdo]

There is a huge amount of pigment in the ducts and there is also a sub-tank. Which I think system considers as lost, but this in the system.

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

So the accounting software does in take into account the ink lost to the maintenance tank?

I was suprised to see that after the initial set up, the printer utility showed only 40% remaining ink and substantial use of the maintenance tank... but my plan is to stop thinking about it and enjoy the prints

Good plan. Canon printers are generally very efficient with ink use, and small print sizes are less efficient anyway. The initial setup also uses a certain amount of ink for filling the various channels, after which things get better. Maybe the initial tanks were starter tanks with less content than regular ones, don't know what they exactly deliver with the printer.

Cheers,
Bart

[GrahamBy]

In theory the Canon is delivered with full size 80ml carts, so pumping 30mls into the sub-tanks etc should have left 60% rather than 40%. Then again, I have little faith in the linearity of the display, so... whatever

The prints are splendid. I can see bronzing with colour on gloss RC only by holding the paper at absurd angles, but not with lustre. With BW on gloss, there was some gloss variation around patches of a print blown out to pure white using CO on auto, again only if I held the paper at some finely tuned extreme angle to both the light source and my eyes.

It'll do

[Mark D Segal]

So the accounting software does in take into account the ink lost to the maintenance tank?

No it does not - at least not in the version of Accounting Manager I have, nor in its accompanying instruction manual. One can always make off-line before and after weight measurements to get an idea of the rate at which the maintenance tank gets consumed as a function of various job characteristics, but as far as I know, this is not built in to any application. When I raised this very question with Canon many months ago they informed me it is not provided information. If any one can point us to very specific factual information to the contrary I'd be interested in seeing it.

[Mark D Segal]

Maybe the initial tanks were starter tanks with less content than regular ones, don't know what they exactly deliver with the printer.

Cheers,
Bart

The printer is delivered with filled 80ml ink tanks.

[Abdo]

Entering service mode and printing the full report, does not this information Mark?

[Mark D Segal]

Entering service mode and printing the full report, does not this information Mark?

I did not see anything called "Service Mode" on the Canon Pro-1000. There is a Maintenance function reached from the printer LCD panel, within which there is a Maintenance Cartridge Information function, but all that shows is a diagram of usage level with no scaling whatsoever - not useful for the purposes discussed here. Ink level information reached from the Utility tab of the driver also shows a non-scaled general pane for maintenance cartridge consumption, again not useful for present purposes. If you have another route to more precise information grateful if you would explain exactly how to access it.

[Abdo]

Mark,

I do not have the Pro 1000, I have a 4000. And I have her service manual. But I have not yet looked to see if line 4000 has this function. Thank you.

[Mark D Segal]

Mark,

I do not have the Pro 1000, I have a 4000. And I have her service manual. But I have not yet looked to see if line 4000 has this function. Thank you.

OK, once you've had a chance to find out from the printer and/or the manual whether the question you asked me is actually answerable please let us know; it could be instructive.

[Abdo]

What I can do, is to provide a complete report for your analysis.
I confess I do not understand much that is in it.
Would you like to see ?
Thanks

[Mark D Segal]

What I can do, is to provide a complete report for your analysis.
I confess I do not understand much that is in it.
Would you like to see ?
Thanks

Sure, I'd like to have a look. I assume you can attach it as a Private Mail message through this Forum's Message module.

[Mark D Segal]

Abdo has kindly sent me manuals on the Pro-2000/4000 which indicate that for those models there is a service mode in which one can read data on the percentage of the maintenance tank filled. However, there is nothing that indicates the volumetric fill capacity of the tank, therefore the percentage information would not be helpful for knowing how much ink goes there at any particular time. Nor is the granularity of the measurement indicated. Much as it would have been nice otherwise, this aspect of ink usage remains rather obscure.

[unesco]

So the accounting software does in take into account the ink lost to the maintenance tank?

I was suprised to see that after the initial set up, the printer utility showed only 40% remaining ink and substantial use of the maintenance tank... but my plan is to stop thinking about it and enjoy the prints

no, it does not. uso of ink for maintenance was computed by weighting maintenance tank after each print job

[Geraldo Garcia]

Just a remark:
I saw some of you mentioning sub-tanks regarding the Pro-1000.
I do not believe this printer actually has sub-tanks like the Pro-2000 and Pro-4000 models. Sure there is a lot of ink on the lines, but that is not the same of the sub-tank system.
Printers with sub-tanks can run for some time with empty carts and allow cart replacement during printing. That is not the case of the Pro-1000.
On the models with sub-tank the "!" warning actually means the cart is empty and can be replaced, while the "X" warning means the sub-tank is empty and the printer stops.
On the Pro-1000 the "!" warning is displayed while you still have something like 15ml of ink on the cart and the "x" warning means the cart is as empty as it gets and you cannot keep printing without replacing it.
Regards.

[Mark D Segal]

Just a remark:
.........I saw some of you mentioning sub-tanks regarding the Pro-1000.
I do not believe this printer actually has sub-tanks like the Pro-2000 and Pro-4000 models. .........

Correct, as far as I know too.

[GrahamBy]

Just a remark:
I saw some of you mentioning sub-tanks regarding the Pro-1000.
I do not believe this printer actually has sub-tanks like the Pro-2000 and Pro-4000 models. Sure there is a lot of ink on the lines, but that is not the same of the sub-tank system.

Supposing the lines have a 3mm id, then 4.2m of line would be required to hold the 30ml of each ink unesco mentions.
So whether they are technically called sub-tanks or not, there is some substantial storage volume somewhere in the printer.

[GrahamBy]

no, it does not. uso of ink for maintenance was computed by weighting maintenance tank after each print job

Thank you for the clarification. I had misunderstood your comment that all of the different measures of ink consumption were well correlated.

[1erCru]

From my experience using both the P800 and Pro 1000 it felt like the Canon went through ink faster. I'd imagine Canon could reduce this amount by not requiring a maintenance check after every print but maybe this is partly the reason why Canon printers tend to clog less. I'm not sure why that maintenance check couldn't occur 30 mins or an hour after the printer sits idle. Can't see how a nozzle / line that's actively in use during a line of print jobs would need to be checked after each job.

In terms of print quality Canon felt bolder and more intense and vivid. Epson may have had the edge in tone. The Pro 1000 was prone to far less skew errors most likely due to Canons superior paper movement technology / vacuum through the machine.

Part of the slight increase in perception of quality that I experienced may have had more to do with Canons Print studio pro which is not perfect but provides many tools for finalizing and image before hitting the launch button.

[Mark D Segal]

From my experience using both the P800 and Pro 1000 it felt like the Canon went through ink faster. I'd imagine Canon could reduce this amount by not requiring a maintenance check after every print but maybe this is partly the reason why Canon printers tend to clog less

There is still no reliable evidence available on the specifics of the variables determining internal maintenance checks and self-initiating cleaning cycles. As well, there is no reliable information that a maintenance check consumes ink or even the specifics of how the internal maintenance checks are implemented. If required from the results of a maintenance check, cleaning would of course consume ink. Very carefully weighing the maintenance tank before and after a known cleaning cycle and applying an estimate of the specific gravity of the ink could provide some insight.

[henrikolsen]

Supposing the lines have a 3mm id, then 4.2m of line would be required to hold the 30ml of each ink unesco mentions.
So whether they are technically called sub-tanks or not, there is some substantial storage volume somewhere in the printer.

Opening the lid to the printer head, you can see the head has 2 x 6 bundled flexible tube lines, and near the front is long and more fixed kinds of tubing from the tank, easily around a meter worth of bundled tubing (6 in each). So if we call that 6 meter of tube (very roughly though), it's exceeding your length calculation. It doesn't seem unreasonable to me.