New Phase One XF?

[Kagetsu]

As long as the AF is an improvement, I don't need the extra features (except the top down finder, that excites me).

[BJL]

BJL: Doesn't work: just post the pdf / screenshots! Please!

If DT doesn't want us to see it for a few more hours (to honor an NDA, I assume) I will respect that by not posting their copyrighted material . . . but any working URLs that I find with a simple Google search are fair game!

Note to DT people: get a content management system that allows you to develop site updates on an intranet server, and then to publish to the internet with one click when the time is right; putting stuff on an internet server and trying to hide it by obfuscating the URLs is futile against the search engine superpowers.

[BernardLanguillier]

I guess Phase One will not give us the fullframe CMOS back until they can clear out the inventory of CCD.

Do we know for a fact that Sony has taken the decision to manufacture larger CMOS chips?

I continue to think that Phaseone and Leaf backs have the 50mp Sony chip mostly because Pentax is using the same sensor, I am wondering whether we will get a larger one until Pentax decides that their next 645 body will use a larger chip.

As a result, I don't think we are going to get a new larger CMOS from Sony before mid year 2017, that is if we get one at all. that would also be compatible with the 2 years upgrade cycle of IQ backs.

Just my guess obviously.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Kagetsu]

Do we know for a fact that Sony has taken the decision to manufacture larger CMOS chips?

I continue to think that Phaseone and Leaf backs have the 50mp Sony chip mostly because Pentax is using the same sensor, I am wondering whether we will get a larger one until Pentax decides that their next 645 body will use a larger chip.

As a result, I don't think we are going to get a new larger CMOS from Sony before mid year 2017, that is if we get one at all. that would also be compatible with the 2 years upgrade cycle of IQ backs.

Just my guess obviously.

Cheers,
Bernard

I too am sceptical about a rumoured full size 645 CMOS... I'd like to see it happen, but I think it's a tough to justify with the market right now.

[voidshatter]

Do we know for a fact that Sony has taken the decision to manufacture larger CMOS chips?

I continue to think that Phaseone and Leaf backs have the 50mp Sony chip mostly because Pentax is using the same sensor, I am wondering whether we will get a larger one until Pentax decides that their next 645 body will use a larger chip.

As a result, I don't think we are going to get a new larger CMOS from Sony before mid year 2017, that is if we get one at all. that would also be compatible with the 2 years upgrade cycle of IQ backs.

Just my guess obviously.

Cheers,
Bernard

Doug predicted Late-2015 / Early-2016 for fullframe CMOS. I would have thought so. Note that Phase One terminated their Investment Protection Plan in September 2014, so I would assume that the XF IQ3 is a money sink to clear out the pre-Sep-2014 purchases. After that, they are safe to announce fullframe CMOS. It would be sad if we have to wait until 2017 for a fullframe CMOS.

[BernardLanguillier]

Doug predicted Late-2015 / Early-2016 for fullframe CMOS. I would have thought so. Note that Phase One terminated their Investment Protection Plan in September 2014, so I would assume that the XF IQ3 is a money sink to clear out the pre-Sep-2014 purchases. After that, they are safe to announce fullframe CMOS. It would be sad if we have to wait until 2017 for a fullframe CMOS.

Well, I sure hope I am wrong! A full frame sensor leveraging a further improved version of the Sony technology would be about 75MP and would likely get 15 stops DR.

That would really become a tempting proposition. Not sure I could afford it though.

Cheers,
Bernard

[synn]

Back to the original topic.

I really hope the new body will provide AT LEAST the existign functionality as the DF+ with the current backs. I dont need fancy in body stabilization and whatnot. The ability to control in back settings (Such as ISO) from the body, the interchangable viewfinders and the AF module are reasons enough.

[synn]

 the image is now mainly Sony and the lenses Schneider

So, if Phase's contribution to the system is negligible, surely the Edmund Ronald special MFD should be out any day now. Afterall, the Image can be "Mainly Sony" and "The Lenses Schneider", right? What's stopping you?

[Lawrie_Hope]

I'm personally very excited they're bringing back the waist level finder. Unfortunately looking at the pictures I get the impression the handle doesn't swivel, which would make it useless for me at least. I hope I'm wrong. Also, I would have preferred analog knobs and buttons for the basic stuff instead of a touch screen, but I might be in a minority on that point nowadays. Initial impression is that it looks a little too much like previous cameras for me to get hyped, but I really hope looks are deceiving and that I will be blown away once all the details are presented.

Fingers crossed.

If that's what you are looking for it's been in front of your eyes for years, the Leaf AFI/ Rollei HY6 mod 2 was almost the perfect camera, 6x6 frame, large bright WLF, 45 and 90 degree finders, rotating handle, analog buttons, rotating backs! Schneider glass, and if Leaf or DHW had been given a chance then I believe this could have been the ultimate camera!

[amsp]

If that's what you are looking for it's been in front of your eyes for years, the Leaf AFI/ Rollei HY6 mod 2 was almost the perfect camera, 6x6 frame, large bright WLF, 45 and 90 degree finders, rotating handle, analog buttons, rotating backs! Schneider glass, and if Leaf or DHW had been given a chance then I believe this could have been the ultimate camera!

I agree, the Hy6 was (is) a lovely camera, but the fact that you couldn't mount a Phase One back on it always stopped me from buying one. But I fully expected Phase to take a lot of design cues from it, instead it seems they just iterated on their existing platform.

[ciccio]

what a deception !!!!!!!

no iq3 full frame cmos

just "old" iq 2 adapted to iq 3

just ridicolous >>>>>>nobody doing upgrade for sure !

[eronald]

Thankfully the Contax is now orphaned, , as well as all the old P+ backs - the used back market is going to get really  interesting.

Edmund

[BJL]

Thankfully the Contax is now orphaned, , as well as all the old P+ backs - the used back market is going to get really  interesting.

Edmund

The spec sheet impiies that various IQ2 back models are staying around for the sake of Hasselblad bodies (V as well as H); will that also cover Contax?  The IQ3 changes are moslty just supporting another "mount" with enhanced body-back interface, rather than an upgrade, so maybe P1 will keep the IQ2 and even IQ1 series around as its way to continue selling backs for every MF body that is still generating enough demand.

Then again, this was clearly a body upgrade, with a few side-effects -- a much asked for and long promised body upgrade -- so who knows what effect the next more substantial sensor ugrade will do to the mount  offerings.

UPDATE: Doug P. has now confirmed that Contax bodies are no longer supported.  More old Hasselblad V bodies in use, apparently!

[Anders_HK]

If that's what you are looking for it's been in front of your eyes for years, the Leaf AFI/ Rollei HY6 mod 2 was almost the perfect camera, 6x6 frame, large bright WLF, 45 and 90 degree finders, rotating handle, analog buttons, rotating backs! Schneider glass, and if Leaf or DHW had been given a chance then I believe this could have been the ultimate camera!

As an Hy6 user with 80MP Leaf back, I wonder what XF has over Hy6 to make it the "worlds best camera system"?

Specifically, what makes it better for me and my photography than my Hy6 already is?

How does its waist lever finder work in portrait mode? Plus never mind high tech gadgets which are not what I need (or wish spend $$ on), what I specific value is camera helps me set up to frame and capture image pre visualised in my mind.

What would be reason to spend how much $$ to switch and what advantage would bring to my photography of landscape and models??

Can rotate sensor??

Why when Leaf owns rights to Hy6 and thus the superb Rolleiflex lenses not simply further the superior Hy6 is beyond my belief....

Is any reasonable answer to a photographer and loyal Leaf customer such as I Phase One/ Leaf???

Just my 2c...

Anders
I

[uaiomex]

+1

Strange times indeed these post-Concorde years. Somebody please get the Delorean ready!

Eduardo

As an Hy6 user with 80MP Leaf back, I wonder what XF has over Hy6 to make it the "worlds best camera system"?

Specifically, what makes it better for me and my photography than my Hy6 already is?

How does its waist lever finder work in portrait mode? Plus never mind high tech gadgets which are not what I need (or wish spend $$ on), what I specific value is camera helps me set up to frame and capture image pre visualised in my mind.

What would be reason to spend how much $$ to switch and what advantage would bring to my photography of landscape and models??

Can rotate sensor??

Why when Leaf owns rights to Hy6 and thus the superb Rolleiflex lenses not simply further the superior Hy6 is beyond my belief....

Is any reasonable answer to a photographer and loyal Leaf customer such as I Phase One/ Leaf???

Just my 2c...

Anders
I

[BJL]

As an Hy6 user with 80MP Leaf back, I wonder what XF has over Hy6 to make it the "worlds best camera system"?

Perhaps it is just the best camera system still in production, now that the Rolleiflex/Hy6 fabrication tools and such have been sold off at the Franke & Heidecke liquidation auction in April, at least according to what I read a few months ago.

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi Anders,

In a way, photography is about lens and sensor. In the old days it was about lens and film.

What I would say the Phase One XF offers is  convenience, a new and hopefully more  robust user interface compared to the older Phase One options.

Now, our way of shooting may differ. Personally, I am a slow worker using the prism viewfinder on the old V-series blad with a 3X Zeiss monocular. Some users use AF, and the new AF-system on the XF may be a great improvement. Personally, I would prefer magnified live view for focusing so the 50 MP CMOS back may be optimal for me. Overexposure warnings based on raw data would be a real boon for me, and a couple of F-stops in DR from the CMOS back is nothing I would sneeze at.

I don't know about the Phase One lenses, but according to the MTF charts from Schneider they are pretty good. It is quite possible that the Schneider lenses for the Hy6 are truly excellent. The Zeiss lenses I am mostly familiar with having experience with many of the Zeiss lenses for the Blad (40/4 CF FLE, 50/4 CF FLE, 80 CFE, 120/4 CF/CFi, 150/4 CT and CF and 180/4 CFI).

Unfortunately, the Hy6 is now longer with us, as DHW went insolvent. Clearly, DHW may have deserved a better destiny, but we live in a harsh world where any company needs to earn enough cash to survive.

What the worlds best camera system is may depend on the needs of the user. For a photojournalist a "professional" camera like Nikon D4 or Canon D1X may be the best. For some photographers a high resolution Nikon or Sony may be the best choice. If a wide variety of T&S options are needed the Sony A7 variants may be hard to beat. For 50 MP, the Canon 5Ds just arrived with those excellent T&S lenses and the new 11-24 zoom.

For some users a technical camera makes a lot of sense. A technical camera with a built in shutter like the Alpa FPS or the Hartblei H-CAM may be the ideal combo with a CMOS based MFD offering excellent live view. But, present generation CMOS from Sony has 1.3X crop and doesn't play well with large amounts of shifts, specially not with non retrofocus wide angle designs.

Very clearly, the new Phase One XF is a major step forward for the Phase One system.

I would also make the point that the main competitor to Phase One is Hasselblad and to some extent Pentax 645Z and Leica S2. Phase one was always a bit lacking on the camera body, and the new body is a major step forward.

Personally, I would think that my future may be with the Sony FE mount. Zeiss makes some nice lenses for that mount, and I guess that Sony may build an A# series camera worth my money. Some Canon wide angles, a Mirex T&S adapter for my Hasselblad lenses and some Zeiss primes is where I may end up before going into retirement.

Best regards
Erik

As an Hy6 user with 80MP Leaf back, I wonder what XF has over Hy6 to make it the "worlds best camera system"?

Specifically, what makes it better for me and my photography than my Hy6 already is?

How does its waist lever finder work in portrait mode? Plus never mind high tech gadgets which are not what I need (or wish spend $$ on), what I specific value is camera helps me set up to frame and capture image pre visualised in my mind.

What would be reason to spend how much $$ to switch and what advantage would bring to my photography of landscape and models??

Can rotate sensor??

Why when Leaf owns rights to Hy6 and thus the superb Rolleiflex lenses not simply further the superior Hy6 is beyond my belief....

Is any reasonable answer to a photographer and loyal Leaf customer such as I Phase One/ Leaf???

Just my 2c...

Anders
I