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Author Topic: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool  (Read 767317 times)

Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #540 on: June 13, 2015, 05:56:46 pm »

OK, N/A... on the other subject - I compared a new black velvet sample measuring with i1pro2 and spectrolino : i1pro2 gives L* = ~2.9-~4.0 on various spots and spectrolino ~2.9-~3.5 on various spots... so I guess if both of them do measure noticeably lighter black patches on SG and their data is similar then so it is... new targets do have the black patches lighter... I did not hear back from X-Rite so far... so will be trying to remind them again, albeit w/o big hope.

Yes, it seems they need to publish a new reference for SG. Or recognise bad batches and either replace, or publish references. One other thing - if you have polarasing filter for Spectrolino, try measuring with the filter on, using MeasureTool from ProfileMaker 5.0.10. It should not make a difference, theoretically, but does not hurt to try.

Very sorry I confused you with Spectrolino / ColorPort.
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #541 on: June 13, 2015, 08:16:55 pm »

One other thing - if you have polarasing filter for Spectrolino, try measuring with the filter on, using MeasureTool from ProfileMaker 5.0.10. It should not make a difference, theoretically, but does not hurt to try.

it actually makes hell lot of difference, while w/ U filter it gives L* = 11.x, w/ P filter it gives L* = ~1.8-1.9 (???!!!)

Very sorry I confused you with Spectrolino / ColorPort.

n/p - some knowledge gained
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #542 on: June 13, 2015, 08:19:51 pm »

> it actually makes hell lot of difference, while w/ U filter it gives L* = 11.x, w/ P filter it gives L* = ~1.8-1.9 (???!!!)

Was it with MeasureTool? Does the resulting CGATS say pola filter is in use?
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #543 on: June 13, 2015, 09:04:39 pm »

> it actually makes hell lot of difference, while w/ U filter it gives L* = 11.x, w/ P filter it gives L* = ~1.8-1.9 (???!!!)

Was it with MeasureTool? Does the resulting CGATS say pola filter is in use?


you asked to use ProfileMaker MeasureTool, so it was it...  yes, filters were detected

Quote
INSTRUMENTATION   "Spectrolino"
MEASUREMENT_SOURCE   "Illumination=D50   ObserverAngle=2°   WhiteBase=Abs   Filter=Pol"

strangely MeasureTool does not output spectal data - LAB/XYZ only
« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 09:06:27 pm by AlterEgo »
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #544 on: June 13, 2015, 09:21:43 pm »

> strangely MeasureTool does not output spectal data - LAB/XYZ only
It should, if asked to - click on Configuring and choose spectral.
What L does it show for white patches with pola filter? What does it show on black and white patches without a pola filter?
« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 09:28:14 pm by Iliah »
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #545 on: June 13, 2015, 09:54:35 pm »

> strangely MeasureTool does not output spectal data - LAB/XYZ only
It should, if asked to - click on Configuring and choose spectral.
but it does not... checkbox is on, but it does not save the spectral data (I am talking about the mode when it measures Test Chart).

white patch, L* = 98.*

grey patch L* = 48.*

black patch L* = 1.9

PS: for example I measured some 3 patches again (white-grey-black) and here is the output... no spectral data

Quote
LGOROWLENGTH   1
Measurement_mode   "patch"
CREATED   "6/13/2015"  # Time: 21:58
INSTRUMENTATION   "Spectrolino"
MEASUREMENT_SOURCE   "Illumination=D50   ObserverAngle=2°   WhiteBase=Abs   Filter=Pol"
KEYWORD   "SampleID"
KEYWORD   "SAMPLE_NAME"
NUMBER_OF_FIELDS   8
BEGIN_DATA_FORMAT
SampleID   SAMPLE_NAME   XYZ_X   XYZ_Y   XYZ_Z   LAB_L   LAB_A   LAB_B
END_DATA_FORMAT
NUMBER_OF_SETS   3
BEGIN_DATA
1   A1   91.25   94.85   75.05   97.97   -0.36   2.71
2   B1   16.33   16.98   13.81   48.24   -0.25   0.53
3   C1   0.21   0.21   0.18   1.89   0.30   -0.15
END_DATA
« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 10:00:06 pm by AlterEgo »
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #546 on: June 13, 2015, 09:58:07 pm »

but it does not... checkbox is on, but it does not save the spectral data (I am talking about the mode when it measures Test Chart).

white patch, L* = 98.*

grey patch L* = 48.*

black patch L* = 1.9

Nice measurements, overall. Do you save data explicitly, File - Save As; or do you use "save measurements"?
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #547 on: June 13, 2015, 10:02:49 pm »

Nice measurements, overall. Do you save data explicitly, File - Save As; or do you use "save measurements"?
the dialog window says : "export lab"




PS: got... it - there is a difference between that option and what is done through : File - Save As ... RTFM !


« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 10:06:08 pm by AlterEgo »
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #548 on: June 13, 2015, 10:04:35 pm »

Nice measurements, overall.

well white and grey may be - but black ?
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #549 on: June 13, 2015, 10:05:54 pm »

the dialog window says : "export lab"

Please try File - Save As. You have "spkt" mark, so it should be saving spectral data, 'cause this mark indicates the measurements were taken in spectral mode.
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #550 on: June 13, 2015, 10:07:30 pm »

As to black, take measurements of those 15 neutral patches in the middle and let's check how linear they are. I would also measure the whole target and check deltaE with the reference.
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #551 on: June 13, 2015, 10:07:35 pm »

Please try File - Save As. You have "spkt" mark, so it should be saving spectral data, 'cause this mark indicates the measurements were taken in spectral mode.
yes, I found that File->Save As indeed saves the spectral data... thank you, I was thinking that both options are the same and did not bother to try.
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #552 on: June 13, 2015, 10:08:59 pm »

yes, I found that File->Save As indeed saves the spectral data... thank you, I was thinking that both options are the same and did not bother to try.
No, they are quite different. It was mentioned in manual somewhere, but not in the Help file they have with the program.
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #553 on: June 13, 2015, 10:09:26 pm »

As to black, take measurements of those 15 neutral patches in the middle and let's check how linear they are. I would also measure the whole target and check deltaE with the reference.
OK, I will do this now and post then
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #554 on: June 13, 2015, 10:59:09 pm »

As to black, take measurements of those 15 neutral patches in the middle and let's check how linear they are. I would also measure the whole target and check deltaE with the reference.
here is the full target, taken with P filter
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #555 on: June 13, 2015, 11:19:48 pm »

here is the full target, taken with P filter
It looks like the instrument needs cleaning, after all.
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torger

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #556 on: June 16, 2015, 12:31:36 pm »

Got my Solux lamps working finally by powering them properly. Look at plots in the neighboring thread:
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=100698.msg830255#msg830255

I think the Solux 4700K looks good for simulating D50 and even D55 when pushed into overdrive.
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Iliah

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #557 on: June 16, 2015, 12:44:07 pm »

Got my Solux lamps working finally by powering them properly. Look at plots in the neighboring thread:
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=100698.msg830255#msg830255

I think the Solux 4700K looks good for simulating D50 and even D55 when pushed into overdrive.

I had Solux bulbs powered from their own power source, and they do not simulate D50. When powered to a higher voltage through a high grade stabilized variable voltage power supply, the time drift of SPD is quite significant. Once I measured the SPD with 2nm resolution, and it was spiky.

Solux 4700/36, measured with i1Pro, 4 times, averaged, 10nm, beam integrated over the surface:
380   1.16572925E-3
390   1.91144715E-3
400   2.50905682E-3
410   3.10437335E-3
420   3.64064472E-3
430   4.19029733E-3
440   4.51817922E-3
450   5.01060858E-3
460   5.41420793E-3
470   5.68507239E-3
480   5.91422338E-3
490   6.13182224E-3
500   6.40437938E-3
510   6.66856067E-3
520   6.87941955E-3
530   7.24500837E-3
540   7.71248853E-3
550   8.06061924E-3
560   8.29440542E-3
570   8.48474540E-3
580   8.45067855E-3
590   8.48383829E-3
600   8.30854755E-3
610   8.03543720E-3
620   7.96562620E-3
630   7.86271039E-3
640   7.66951498E-3
650   7.79212918E-3
660   7.72498781E-3
670   7.72686955E-3
680   7.82623328E-3
690   7.64010241E-3
700   7.34899333E-3
710   7.22256443E-3
720   7.06195412E-3
730   6.93874108E-3
That is less than 4300K CCT.
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #558 on: June 16, 2015, 12:50:22 pm »

When powered to a higher voltage through a high grade stabilized variable voltage power supply, the time drift of SPD is quite significant.
what might be the source of the drift then... assuming that you have some lab grade power supply and voltage then can be assured within what ? like < 0.1% or something like this ?
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AlterEgo

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Re: DCamProf - a new camera profiling tool
« Reply #559 on: June 16, 2015, 12:52:44 pm »

beam integrated over the surface
does it mean that you were illuminating some surface (like styrofoam) and measuring off the reflected light ? or something else ?
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