Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: fredjeang on November 13, 2010, 01:29:00 pm
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Interesting review, aimed to the photographer.
(but a brick wall could not fail...)
Well, just to say that my experience with Pentax digital is very good indeed. I think that since the K20, the brand got it pretty much spot-on and never stopped to improve.
Surprisingly, I find myself liking the Pentaxes more than the Canons and saying that a 35mm FF is still missing in their product's line, but their cameras are just right.
They are not exciting but deadly efficient, easy, as the reviewer said, you just forget about the gear.
They are not made to dream but to take pictures in the more direct way. In short, no hassles.
It's very simple: if Pentax would come with a 35mm FF I would stop immediatly to use any Canon. But they don't so I thank the 5D2.
I find the Pentax politics very healphy: the same treatment for all their products. Just looking at the 645, it is an inflated K7 or K5. So costs are reduced.
And this lcd...they finally did it! Sure that it will force the big MF boys to bring a decent lcd very soon.
It seems to be a great product, and considering the crisis panorama, it might give nightmares to others very soon. Because if they hardly listen to the claims in all the world's forums, they will listen beleive me to the sales curves.
The only downside to me is that it does not have the flexibility of the backs and this is very important IMO. Just for that reason I won't personaly look after it.
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Superb review, Nick. Thanks for sharing your expertise.
As a long-time 67 user, I WANT ONE. ;D
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Does someone know about the sync flash capabilities?
(gosh, I had to edit once again my english because I wrote first does someone knows ...)
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I hope Keith doesn't see those published test images...
Rob C
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You'd love to see a review of a medium format camera where everything really fell into place.
Obviously this sounds like a pretty good camera.
iso . . . check
lcd preview . . . check
inexpensive . . . check
inexpensive lenses . . . check
tethering . . . ?
Something broke and I gotta send it to Japan . . . ?
Sync Speed . . . ?
For the intended market which I assume is well heeled amateurs it sounds great. For the professional market that has to tether, needs every lens to be sharp, every part to be bulletproof, rentals and fast turnaround on repairs . . . ?
IMO
BC
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For us amateurs, I think the joy of seeing a "big four" small format manufacturer move into medium format is the extremely high chance of finding significant reductions a year or two down the line. $5k 645Ds in 2012? Here's hoping!
As far as the review's concerned, i'd have liked a little more information on the flash sync too. I know little about their small format TTL flash system, but if the 645 is capable of off-camera wireless TTL triggering that would be another major coup d'etat for Pentax.
(edit: according to dpreview's announcement of the spec & press release, x-sync is 1/125, and wireless TTL IS possible)
Martin
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I had the chance to play with one a couple of weeks ago at a photo show and while it was far from real world shooting I have to agree with everything Nick says especially on the handling and operation side of things. I never worked with a Pentax before but this one just fall into your hand and works intuitively.
THe one thing that I found lightly irritating is that it took several seconds of 'processing' before the image showed up on the rear screen and it took several button presses to bring up a histogram. But that could have been a) that I am not used to MF 'processing' times and b) that the camera wasn't configured properly to bring the histogram up right away - I don't know.
All in all I have to agree that at the price-point, features, handling and image quality this camera is disruptive.
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You'd love to see a review of a medium format camera where everything really fell into place.
Obviously this sounds like a pretty good camera.
iso . . . check
lcd preview . . . check
inexpensive . . . check
inexpensive lenses . . . check
tethering . . . ?
Something broke and I gotta send it to Japan . . . ?
Sync Speed . . . ?
For the intended market which I assume is well heeled amateurs it sounds great. For the professional market that has to tether, needs every lens to be sharp, every part to be bulletproof, rentals and fast turnaround on repairs . . . ?
IMO
BC
tethering . . . Lightroom, IME more reliable than Capture One
Something broke and I gotta send it to Japan . . . If it's sold in USA it'll be repaired in USA
Sync speed... yeah, that can be a problem.
Every lens to be sharp... Haven't seen a camera with every lens sharp, give me the 3-4 lenses I need sharp and I'm set.
I don't see this camera as an amateur toy at all.
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Regarding synch speed: Pentax made several 645 lenses with leaf shutters, which I assume would synch at 1/500 second?
I'm in line to buy one....tons of experience with 645, 645N and 67 film cameras, but a novice with MFDSLR.
I have a number of legacy 645 lenses (manual and auto focus).
Dave
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Hi,
Are you sure about the lenses? I got the impression that there are a lot of bad samples around of every possible make.
This article is quite sobering: http://www.josephholmes.com/news-medformatprecision.html
In case some really believes the situation is better in DSLR land, please read this: http://www.lensrentals.com/news/2010.03.06/this-lens-is-soft-and-other-facts
Other than that, thanks for good comments!
Best regards
Erik
You'd love to see a review of a medium format camera where everything really fell into place.
Obviously this sounds like a pretty good camera.
iso . . . check
lcd preview . . . check
inexpensive . . . check
inexpensive lenses . . . check
tethering . . . ?
Something broke and I gotta send it to Japan . . . ?
Sync Speed . . . ?
For the intended market which I assume is well heeled amateurs it sounds great. For the professional market that has to tether, needs every lens to be sharp, every part to be bulletproof, rentals and fast turnaround on repairs . . . ?
IMO
BC
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Thanks a lot for the report Nick, it does totally confirm the spec sheet of the camera.
As far as image quality goes, it appears to be totally outstanding. Is it as good as a P40+? Well, we need to agree on what "good" is. Would it be fair to assess the detail without considering how well it handles moire? From what I have seen elsewhere, it appears to be superior to other backs in moire handling, which most probably results from in camera signal treatment. It would seem that Pentax has prioritized usability and lack of digital artifacts over the very last 0.1% of [possibly false] detail.
My personal view is that most MFDB photographers will prefer the time saved in not having to check moire issues over those 0.1%.
Cheers,
Bernard
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Hey Bernard,
It just so happens that I am formatting the P40+ vx Pentax 645D mini shoot-out as we speak. And no, I'm not giving it away. I will tell you that the M9 and the 1DSIII were the on the under-card.
And yes, more brick-wall abuse is in store (same damn wall). It is such a compelling variety of tones and textures that it tells us what we want to know.
Btw: sync is 1/125th, and Pentax has three L/S lenses: a 75mm and a 135mm for the 645m and a 165mm for the 67 that's usable with an adapter.
- N.
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Hey Bernard,
It just so happens that I am formatting the P40+ vx Pentax 645D mini shoot-out as we speak. And no, I'm not giving it away. I will tell you that the M9 and the 1DSIII were the on the under-card.
And yes, more brick-wall abuse is in store (same damn wall). It is such a compelling variety of tones and textures that it tells us what we want to know.
Btw: sync is 1/125th, and Pentax has three L/S lenses: a 75mm and a 135mm for the 645m and a 165mm for the 67 that's usable with an adapter.
- N.
While your at it how about throwing both on a computer and doing a quick (really quick) tethered test.
Thx.
BC
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I'm afraid this camera does not allow tethered shooting. I hope I'm wrong though.
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While your at it how about throwing both on a computer and doing a quick (really quick) tethered test.
Thx.
BC
Would also be good to see the burst speed and the capture-to-preview speed on the LCD after a burst
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It currently doesn't, but Pentax mentioned a few months back that support for tethered shooting was to be added later. I'd be surprised if the performance were impressive though, this clearly isn't the core target application of the 645D, this is a camera designed by landscape shooters for landscape shooters.
Cheers,
Bernard
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It just so happens that I am formatting the P40+ vx Pentax 645D mini shoot-out as we speak.
And yes, more brick-wall abuse is in store (same damn wall).
Cool, that is for sure a nice piece of wall! :)
Cheers,
Bernard
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@yaya:
Burst speed is good. About 1.5 fps for about 8 frames with a class 6 card. Haven't re-tested with the new Class 10.
Capture to preview is a bit slower than the rest of the pack. I haven't timed it because, embarrassing confession, I don't have a watch. My estimation is it's in the 4 second range. Just long enough to be mildly annoying, but not that slow as to really bother me.
I will cover these in a future episode of the review.
@BCOOTER: right now it doesn't tether, as far as I know, except for remote control of the camera. I have an idea, however, that might present a novel solution that is 90% of what the others offer at the moment. Give me a week - I have some studio time planned next weekend.
- N.
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Thanks, Nick--a great review that told all about what we really wanted to know from this camera! I look forward to your future episodes!
As a nature photographer, I took a good, long look at this camera before going with the HyFi. Just love how they've put it all together, with the ergonomics, weather sealing, an ultrasonic lens and even multi-point AF--wonderful! :)
Unfortunately, I've not had good luck in MF with long lenses and focal plane shutter vibration. Serious enough that it was a real struggle to get a critically sharp shot at 350mm at typical 1/2s - 1/60s shutter speeds. If you happen to bump into any Pentax tele's, it would be nice to hear how the system is damped in the around 1/15s range.
Great work, Nick!
Take care,
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Nick
Posted my thanks in the Pentax forum and this question: At what focal length does the 80-160 lose image quality? And as per focus problems , couldn't you simply manual focus? And does this lens have an infinity stop?
And thanks in advance for the comparison test with the 40+. The brick wall is the perfect test subject.
And based on the samples I've seen, the performance of legacy lenses with this camera/sensor/system is not 100% spot on. Some great and others so/so. The Leica S2 has the glass, hands down.
Claude Fiddler
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The 80-160mm doesn't lose IQ per se. Rather, it simply isn't in focus. This happens only at 160mm, as far as I can tell, which is where the lens stops focusing properly much of the time and just hunts and flashes. It's either a lens-specific firmware or communications problem, or a camera/lens firmware problem. Best I can tell, this is not an IQ problem at all.
@Bradley: It's virtually impossible to get a sharp shot on a 300mm Phasemiya, either, so I will be anxious to see what can be done on the 645D. This will be part of my further review(s). I will take a couple of 300mm lenses into studio next week, to see whether they are IQ or vibration limited.
- N.
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Thanks for the review, Nick.
Please please please please please please please please please please please (I typed all those pleases longhand - no cut and paste here sir!)
- do some long exposure tests with the 645D.
1) Can the user switch dark frame subtraction on and off?
2) What's the longest exposure it will do? On "bulb", does it go forever or does it cut off at some point?
3) With the lens cap on, in darkness, and with dark frame subtraction disabled (if that's indeed possible), take a 30 second dark exposure (note the temperature as well please) and make it available to us in RAW format. (I am presuming that it can be opened in standard RAW converters?). Let's quantify the dark current and see the extent of hot pixels.
4) Is there a sensor temperature readout in the camera, or is it written to the EXIF - like there is in some MFDBs and DSLRs? It would be great if we could see if/how the sensor heats up with prolonged long exposure use.
5) Stick it on a tripod, lens wide open at f2.8, infinity focus, ISO 1600, and take a 30 second star trail, again in RAW please. Doesn't matter if you live in a light polluted location; but a dark rural one would be smashing.
Thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks thanks
Ray
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:)
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Re: tethering, there's a video on YouTube of a guy demoing (in Japanese) a 645D with an EyeFi card, shooting into LR's auto import function, it looks like. Takes about 15 sec to come up in LR. I think I heard him say "jpeg".
-Tim
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Nick and Mark,
Thank you immensely for your shootout review. Very interesting, helpful, enjoyable.
I'd like to see a critial IQ showdown on fine, infinite detail foliage in soft light, like you get in a landscape at medium to far distances. I know of no other situation that is so difficult for a Bayer matrix sensor to handle.
Coming from decades of LF film (mostly 8x10), that is my biggest disappointment about digital. The scanning backs seem to handle infinite-detail foliage very well. So the problem seems to be with the Bayer matrix approach and not with "digital" per se.
Anyway, brick walls and bicycles are a piece of cake to make look good. Infinite-detail, low-contrast foliage is torture. If you could, please show us some. I would greatly appreciate it!
-jd
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Anyway, brick walls and bicycles are a piece of cake to make look good. Infinite-detail, low-contrast foliage is torture. If you could, please show us some. I would greatly appreciate it!
+1
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I'd like to see a critial IQ showdown on fine, infinite detail foliage in soft light, like you get in a landscape at medium to far distances. I know of no other situation that is so difficult for a Bayer matrix sensor to handle.
Hi Josiah,
I agree that would be interesting. However, I think it has a lot to do with capture sharpening. Afterall, digital has a relatively high MTF for the spatial detail that gives human vision the impression of sharpness, but it will drop faster near the limiting resolution. Use of a proper lens hood can already make a difference. How much of that limiting resolution is visually affected by the Bayer CFA remains to be seen.
Cheers,
Bart
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Anyway, brick walls and bicycles are a piece of cake to make look good. Infinite-detail, low-contrast foliage is torture. If you could, please show us some. I would greatly appreciate it!
-jd
I'd like nothing more, but it's late November in Ontario...we have neither foliage nor still air :(javascript:void(0);
- N.
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I'd like nothing more, but it's late November in Ontario...we have neither foliage nor still air :(javascript:void(0);
- N.
So that rules out the trees test...and with the time you've saved you can do the long exposure tests, right?! :D
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Forget it.
Unless you can be absolutely sure that both of the images from both cameras are made at precisely the same moment in time the test would be meaningless. How can you possibly be sure that foliage at distance isn't moving or to what degree it is moving?
You could fire 2 cameras from one pocket wizard, and ensure that the photos have no movement problem by taking both photos with the same flash... then you would have to try to simulate soft ambient light.
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So that rules out the trees test...and with the time you've saved you can do the long exposure tests, right?! :D
Your offer hasn't gotten sweet enough yet :-)
I have played a little with long exposures, and the camera does do a dark-frame subtraction, so it's not an enterprise for the faint of heart of impatient. I have so much night time illumination around my house, that it's hard, but I will come up with something for the next installment of the review.
- N.
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Thanks for the review and product comparison, Nick.
I'm interested in the long exposure performance of the Pentax sensor. Nighttime landscape images typically require at least 30 seconds - more often several minutes.
The Phase One P45+ handles long exposures extremely well. How does the Pentax 645D compare?
Thanks again,
-Brent
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Nick: Thank you for your review and "shoot out". I have pre-ordered the camera, hopefully for delivery sometime in December. Did you get a chance to shoot with some legacy manual focus lenses? I have five (35, 45, 55, 75, and 80~160), and am very anxious as to focusing ability. There have been posts here regarding certain MF cameras being almost impossible to get correct manual focus with. On the other hand the reviews talk about the large bright viewfinder image. Also the specs say AF lenses will apply auto-corrections for distortion, CA etc..have you tried this?
Thanks again for all the work you put onto this for our benefit...I appreciate it immensly.
Carpe Diem! :D :D
Dave Gurtcheff
Beach Haven, NJ
www.modernpictorials.com
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In a recent Mike Johnston interview of Ned Bunnell, President of Pentax USA ( http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2010/11/interview-with-ned-bunnell.html#more ), he specifies a 28mm f4 lens for the 645D to be released early next year (of course in Pentax time units that might really be two years) :D
N.B. Nick, in any future 645D reviews please don't test it against any other popular cameras, e.g. Nikon and especially not a Canon with a zoom lens.
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I think Pentax is on the right track, but it lacks digital weather sealed lenses (and that is true in the dslr's line also) and some parts of the chain are nor very clear yet (tether, dedicated software like Capture one, accesories...). I think that there are compromises to date that I'm not sure will be welcome for a big part of the pros, included the landscapers.
Now, you can have a "cheap" Hassy entry system for not that much more and with a removable back that can be used on view cameras and an already matured system.
Being a Pentax owner, I really have difficulties to understand why a lot of people are seeing in the 645D a revolution, a game changer ?!? :o I just see a nice alternative that needs to mature more. But it's just me.
I won't give up a Phase or Blad for a 645D, and I think nobody will.
Does it have live view? No
Does it tether? it seems it does not
Can we change the focusing screen to use legacy lenses with more acuracy? It seems yes and that's a good news
Are all their new lenses also weather sealed like the body? don't know
What's the sync speed? seems low
Is there a dedicated software that fully comunicate with the lenses? don't know, it seems that lenses correction is done in-camera only
Can we use the back on other cameras? No so stucked in 40MP forever in a 10.000 euros investment wich means upgrading will cost about the same each time.
Does the DNG format will be importable in Capture One? I think it will not be but not sure
How is the speed of visual lcd operation? refresh seems slow
How is the speed of connection? don't know
The camera looks unbalanced. How is the handling? seems good according to users but really, this body looks unbalanced.(gravity point on the left)
and many more questions I think.
Just my 2 euros thoughts as you say here.
In my opinion, from a photography point of view, your analysis is correct. If we factor all the missing bits from a system point of view (compared to the hasselblad by example) it even stronger. But the machine is a game changer because of all the people that will buy the system instead of the Hasselblad /Phase one-leaf and even the D3x.
Resource depletion will impact the bottom line and the research budget of the MF companies (ceteris paribus). That, for me is the real game changer. A H4D-31 & 80mm f2.8 cost about 14000 US$, but it will never get the coverage that the Pentax will. That means the Pentax is about the get the mind-share, just like the Leica did.
Hasselblad needs to react. So does Phase one, maybe less, because they appear to be focusing, and doing very well in the High end. If Phase succeed at total control over the high end they will be able to sell the low end as a natural step in the right direction.
Pentax and Leica can finance ASICs with the 35mm line. Meaning they can finance performance and high iso logic on the camera. On the other hand this could do an iPhone effect and trigger in the minds of the people, maybe I should buy medium format, and that could be good instead of doom for the MF people and the ones that simply love them. What is clear, is the this are very interesting times in the medium format market. Not sure if it will play as a Chinese curse or as and English proverb.
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There is a lengthy review here:
http://www.photoradar.com/reviews/product/pentax-645d-review-0
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Keith and jduncan, I think you are right in the middle and I join your analysis about why it's a game changer.
By the way jduncan, for not having a native english lenguage, I'm very impressed by the way you express yourself really. I wish I could express myself in english the half good you do it.
Dave, thanks for the review link, that was interesting and goes in the sense of the Lu-La field review.
Cheers.
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Hi,
I'd suggest that many of the MFDB buyers are landscape shooters and need neither tethering or high sync speeds. So I certainly think there is a marketplace for P645D like systems. There are of course benefits to modular systems, but a monolithic system may have advantage in accuracy, less parts involved.
The points you mention are valid, of course, but different customers have different needs. The original 645 was quite popular with outdoor shooters, especially in Japan.
Best regards
Erik
I hope the 645D will be as good on that respect than the aps Pentaxes with legacy lenses. The compatibility is total, included you can mount 645 lenses on the dslrs. Manual focusing is accurate with the green light confirmation, it does not use the same system as Canikon so you can't compare. Pentax with legacy lenses is excellent and reliable, but of course the lack of live-view on the 645 might be another story to get it right. We also knows that more the sensor is big more critical the focusing is so I imagine that it could be much more problematic.
If you use C1 it will not allow lens correction, actually I don't know what software will be used that fully take into consideration their new digital lenses. Tether is not supported...well, that's a good and a bad news. With no live view how can focusing be 100% acurate without tether with legacy lenses? Big question. The thing is a lot of 645D buyer will already have the old system and would like to use it.
It seems to me that is a product that needs to evolve, and it will I'm sure.
Anyway, if you buy the 645, you can also buy the 16MP K5 as a back-up and uses your 645 pentaxes on it. It will work just fine.
Also, the weather sealing is certainly not to criticize and I can tell you that when Pentax claims weather seal it is really sealed...but then lenses has to be ws also to make it sense.
I think Pentax is on the right track, but it lacks digital weather sealed lenses (and that is true in the dslr's line also) and some parts of the chain are nor very clear yet (tether, dedicated software like Capture one, accesories...). I think that there are compromises to date that I'm not sure will be welcome for a big part of the pros, included the landscapers.
Now, you can have a "cheap" Hassy entry system for not that much more and with a removable back that can be used on view cameras and an already matured system.
Being a Pentax owner, I really have difficulties to understand why a lot of people are seeing in the 645D a revolution, a game changer ?!? :o I just see a nice alternative that needs to mature more. But it's just me.
I won't give up a Phase or Blad for a 645D, and I think nobody will.
Does it have live view? No
Does it tether? it seems it does not
Can we change the focusing screen to use legacy lenses with more acuracy? It seems yes and that's a good news
Are all their new lenses also weather sealed like the body? don't know
What's the sync speed? seems low
Is there a dedicated software that fully comunicate with the lenses? don't know, it seems that lenses correction is done in-camera only
Can we use the back on other cameras? No so stucked in 40MP forever in a 10.000 euros investment wich means upgrading will cost about the same each time.
Does the DNG format will be importable in Capture One? I think it will not be but not sure
How is the speed of visual lcd operation? refresh seems slow
How is the speed of connection? don't know
The camera looks unbalanced. How is the handling? seems good according to users but really, this body looks unbalanced.(gravity point on the left)
and many more questions I think.
Just my 2 euros thoughts as you say here.
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Hi,
I'd suggest that many of the MFDB buyers are landscape shooters and need neither tethering...
Erik
I was thinking I would use MF tethered for landscape, as it would allow me to raise the camera on my 10m tripod to eliminate unwanted foregrounds... but this would be difficult (but not impossible) without daylight live-view... but I might me in a minority.
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I was thinking I would use MF tethered for landscape, as it would allow me to raise the camera on my 10m tripod to eliminate unwanted foregrounds... but this would be difficult (but not impossible) without daylight live-view... but I might me in a minority.
Actually, since the 645D has an HDMI output, you could run a cable down to an external monitor, and have a very functional live-view equivalent. No quite as good as live-view, granted, but since I doubt you can adjust the camera much atop the pole, it would seem to be a solution.
Do you have any pictures of this beast, btw?
- N.
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Fred
In order to see the Pentax as a game changer you’ll need to see it through the eyes of those who make up the intended market.
If you’re an amateur landscape photographer currently using the best of the small format DSLRs, need a half decent degree of weather proofing, don’t need view camera options, tethering, live view, or anything larger than a 1.3x sensor then the Pentax will have a certain appeal.
The Hasselblad and Phase One offerings are different beasts with different features, but be prepared to pay for those differences.
If you are from the USA, Japan - or anywhere else that has fair pricing – the Pentax is a game changer precisely because of the price.
It's not for you, it's not for me, but there will be plenty of credit cards waiving about out there proving that it is a game changer for the intended market.
Just to underline your post, the samples of the Pentax 645D are on Dpreview. That means the machine is marching towards the mainstream.
I understand that other medium format companies don't have the leverage that Pentax can have on sites like Dpreview for multiple reasons.
So even if they could match the price the exposure will be less. I am not trying to imply foul play from Dpreview. It's a target market and the familiarity with press releases etc.
So let see how it plays out.
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Wow, a lot of posts to justify the lack of a feature that should be a no brainer: tethered shooting. ;)
I understand that a lot of amateur photographers, who does landscapes when their day job allow them to, do have a check book or a CC, but a simple feature like tethered shooting, would make this camera appealing to a lot of business that have much deeper pockets and would buy it in triplicate.
I believe the little K Pentax series at 1500$ do tethered shooting.
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Hi,
The Pentax 645 is a feasible camera for anyone shelling out for a Nikon D3X and buying Zeiss primes for that camera. It seems that there is a lot of 645 stuff around in wardrobes and on EBay. DPReview has also tested the Nikon D3X.
It wouldn't be easy for DPreview to test a camera like the P65+, it's a different animal and doesn't fit in their reference frame.
Best regards
Erik
Just to underline your post, the samples of the Pentax 645D are on Dpreview. That means the machine is marching towards the mainstream.
I understand that other medium format companies don't have the leverage that Pentax can have on sites like Dpreview for multiple reasons.
So even if they could match the price the exposure will be less. I am not trying to imply foul play from Dpreview. It's a target market and the familiarity with press releases etc.
So let see how it plays out.
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The Imaging Resource has also published 645D photos and telling comparisons to D3x and 1ds MkIII:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/645D/645DA.HTM
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Wow, a lot of posts to justify the lack of a feature that should be a no brainer: tethered shooting. ;)
Really is not just that. The other systems have tons of extra features. From GPS, TS, more modern lenses (in term of number), more adapters. Different sensor sizes, tethered control with microfucus (a delight for macro). If I have to choose I will peek the H4D over the Pentax with easy. Of course I do have the nikon system, so when is raining I know my bag have the tool for the moment. Others are in a different position. If pentax succeed in terms of volume the "lacks of the system" will be fill very fast. If they don't, we don't how they will react. This point to other advantage to phase/hasselblad : Maturity.
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The Imaging Resource has also published 645D photos and telling comparisons to D3x and 1ds MkIII:
http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/645D/645DA.HTM
The light conditions are very favorable. We now that when high iso can be tested is when light is dim. But the performance looks very good at ISO 1600.
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On a Blad (and I guess it's the same with Phase products), when I pushed the images to some limits, for ex underexposing 2stops in capture and + 2 EV in Phocus with pushing the recovery to 80 and filling the shadows... in short, pushing the files, the image keeps incredibly clear and do not fall appart, something that is just impossible to acheive with a 35mm without bad compromises. I would like to know how the Pentax files are doing in that aspect.