Thanks for the review Michael, I've been waiting for it.
So, it looks like an amazing camera from the spec sheets and certainly everyone who's review it seems pretty impressed.
The recent lenses to be released from Sony and Zeiss are also reading up pretty well - particularly the 90 macro.
In short, Sony is a very tempting proposition now.
But I can't get past the single SD card slot having had dual CF/SD card slots in my cameras for many many years now.
Though I've only had a few card problems since the start of digital, those problems have all been with SD's
Does this worry anyone else ?
Personally, I can't imagine shooting something important without that back-up, though maybe I'm overly cautious or even paranoid.. lol
Personally, I can't imagine shooting something important without that back-up ..
I dont really think the A7 series are professional camerasno need to think at all
The rendering of greens, green yellows and browns is completely different between the Pentax and the Sony.how did you exclude raw converter + whatever camera profile was used here (that is not to say that they certainly have different CFA properties) ?
how did you exclude raw converter + whatever camera profile was used here (that is not to say that they certainly have different CFA properties) ?
Give Michael his dueif he is trying just to reflect what an average Joe is getting then it is not interesting (or rather inspiring) at all... due withheld :D
Pentax its due, *in these pictures* it shows better color discrimination in the greens, giving more depth to the forest. Possibly a better lens or a different Raw processor on either camera would change that. There is also probably Jpeg on both, to set a baseline.
Did a discussion recently not point out the value of monitoring the channels closely and using a CC filter for the heavy green channel if necessary and that the WB had a major role in colour, particularly green, discrimination?
Michael does point point out that in the tower test both were set to daylight (although that point could differ between the cameras ? ) and the colour "rendition" was very different, (as was the contrast) I assume he used the same RAW processor or perhaps OOC Jpegs, does he say? but of course in RAW the profiles will vary so his comment is perhaps not helpful.
The rendering of greens, green yellows and browns is completely different between the Pentax and the Sony. The Sony has "global green".
Look at the image for a few minutes, and the differences will start to pop out, and make the Pentax image go "3D" as the forest acquires depth.
Edmund
The Sony color look (probably their Bayer filter choice) is cold-looking. Tough to correct easily in post. And it seems to be across their line of mirrorless cameras. Same in the NEX series I am most familiar with, and that issue is not minor in my book. The look of my 10-year-old EOS 5D still wins everyday over any Sony shot I have seen.
Now is the RII a pro camera. Yes, in the right hands. My friend Brian Smith http://briansmith.com/photography/ uses it and doesn't see any major issues and he makes his living with a camera in his hand, he's very successful, and probably knows more about Sony still cameras than any working photographer in the western hemisphere. You don't shoot imagery that debuts in the Library Of Congress, with sub par cameras.
IMO
BC
How many more times, it's not the camera it's what's in front and behind it.
Did a discussion recently not point out the value of monitoring the channels closely and using a CC filter for the heavy green channel if necessary and that the WB had a major role in colour, particularly green, discrimination?
Michael does point point out that in the tower test both were set to daylight (although that point could differ between the cameras ? ) and the colour "rendition" was very different, (as was the contrast) I assume he used the same RAW processor or perhaps OOC Jpegs, does he say? but of course in RAW the profiles will vary so his comment is perhaps not helpful.
Hi Chris,
You may have not followed Iliah Borg a long time as I have.
Best regards
Erik
Hi Chris,
Only up to a point.
Cheers,
Bart
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That's where I read it, thank you Erik.
I fact out of 150 TB's of raw data we've produced the only corrupt files I've seen are about two dozen 1ds2 files because the processor on some cameras couldn't keep up with the chimping (so Canon slowed the camera down) and one RED 1 file that went totally funky because we kept the camera running on set to drag in and shoot some pickup on a hot day for way too long.
If one card slot turns you away, so be it, but i've shot a billion still images with cameras that do and do not support two cards and never thought about duplicating the images in camera.
We usually have a tech, we're checking as we go in the selected processor because that's the ONLY way to be sure. If not I'll personally check it as I go and I never shoot a card to full anyway.
And for the record we're not sipping mai tai's waiting on the results of what the tech says, as today every still session for commerce allows about 11 minutes of shooting time.
I fact out of 150 TB's of raw data we've produced the only corrupt files I've seen are about two dozen 1ds2 files because the processor on some cameras couldn't keep up with the chimping (so Canon slowed the camera down) and one RED 1 file that went totally funky because we kept the camera running on set to drag in and shoot some pickup on a hot day for way too long.
No problem with 9 models of canon, 3 phase, 4 nikons, 2 leicas, 1- sony video, 3-REDs (except mentioned), 2- Olympus, 3-Panasonic and 1-Kodak/Nikon.
But to make sure we don't have issues we rigorously match cards or ssds to cameras, format three times, then test, then format again.
When tethering have clean computers, make sure all connections are viable including backups and test those in the "try to F*&$ it up" process, so we're prepared for any issue.
In other words we go out 100% prepared and since we own our own stuff we know it's right and have backups for everything.
We also pay close attention to card readers, drives, and cards, only using lexar, sandisk and RED SSDs.
I've tried three transcends and had all three go glitchy and if we have a card that doesn't test well we either return it, or throw it in the rubbish bin.
Early on in digital I would get calls from guys that just bought a leaf, a phase, a canon or something screaming they can't download, or tether, but they were using older machines, not enough power, cheap drives, computers loaded with their "social" and web software and having some semi learned assistant doing the dumping and copying.
In other words they had already invented the perfect storm.
Now is the RII a pro camera. Yes, in the right hands. My friend Brian Smith http://briansmith.com/photography/ uses it and doesn't see any major issues and he makes his living with a camera in his hand, he's very successful, and probably knows more about Sony still cameras than any working photographer in the western hemisphere. You don't shoot imagery that debuts in the Library Of Congress, with sub par cameras.
Look I'm not selling Sony cameras, heck, I'm not selling anything, but most equipment is only as good as the people using it and the levels they go to, to protect their imagery is much more than having a camera with dual slots.
IMO
BC
I agree that dual card slots would be ideal, but my take is that SD cards are extremely reliable so it's not much of worry. When using my D600 I use the second slot for overflow, not backup. In many years of shooting I have never had a single SD card error or problem. My approach is to buy only brand name cards and replace them every year or two. And use common sense - don't swap cards while standing on a sewer grating, keep your full cards in a safe and protected place, and so on.
If one card slot turns you away, so be it, but i've shot a billion still images with cameras that do and do not support two cards and never thought about duplicating the images in camera.
We usually have a tech, we're checking as we go in the selected processor because that's the ONLY way to be sure. If not I'll personally check it as I go and I never shoot a card to full anyway.
And for the record we're not sipping mai tai's waiting on the results of what the tech says, as today every still session for commerce allows about 11 minutes of shooting time.
I fact out of 150 TB's of raw data we've produced the only corrupt files I've seen are about two dozen 1ds2 files because the processor on some cameras couldn't keep up with the chimping (so Canon slowed the camera down) and one RED 1 file that went totally funky because we kept the camera running on set to drag in and shoot some pickup on a hot day for way too long.
No problem with 9 models of canon, 3 phase, 4 nikons, 2 leicas, 1- sony video, 3-REDs (except mentioned), 2- Olympus, 3-Panasonic and 1-Kodak/Nikon.
But to make sure we don't have issues we rigorously match cards or ssds to cameras, format three times, then test, then format again.
When tethering have clean computers, make sure all connections are viable including backups and test those in the "try to F*&$ it up" process, so we're prepared for any issue.
In other words we go out 100% prepared and since we own our own stuff we know it's right and have backups for everything.
We also pay close attention to card readers, drives, and cards, only using lexar, sandisk and RED SSDs.
I've tried three transcends and had all three go glitchy and if we have a card that doesn't test well we either return it, or throw it in the rubbish bin.
Early on in digital I would get calls from guys that just bought a leaf, a phase, a canon or something screaming they can't download, or tether, but they were using older machines, not enough power, cheap drives, computers loaded with their "social" and web software and having some semi learned assistant doing the dumping and copying.
In other words they had already invented the perfect storm.
Now is the RII a pro camera. Yes, in the right hands. My friend Brian Smith http://briansmith.com/photography/ uses it and doesn't see any major issues and he makes his living with a camera in his hand, he's very successful, and probably knows more about Sony still cameras than any working photographer in the western hemisphere. You don't shoot imagery that debuts in the Library Of Congress, with sub par cameras.
Look I'm not selling Sony cameras, heck, I'm not selling anything, but most equipment is only as good as the people using it and the levels they go to, to protect their imagery is much more than having a camera with dual slots.
IMO
BC
But my house has never burnt down either but I still pay the insurance premium every year.
For the RED Dragon, filtering does help with a color issue (http://www.newsshooter.com/2015/06/06/achtels-trueblue-optical-filter-for-red-dragon-and-red-epic-cameras-removing-unwanted-magenta/):
Hey Edmund,
I always thought that the RED in RED Dragon was a nickname chosen for its over the top red CFA response, unrealistic as it is compared to the human visual system's response to it. However, the RED Dragon has virtually nothing to do with Sony's CFA choices.
I appreciate your subjective, color-consulting, ICC-belonging opinion but until someone produces an absolute QE, spectral power distribution or similar measurement for the a7RII showing it to be much different from current Nikon and Canon DSLRs', it remains just that. Can you produce such comparisons?
Until then,
Jack
Thanks for the review Michael, I've been waiting for it.
So, it looks like an amazing camera from the spec sheets and certainly everyone who's review it seems pretty impressed.
The recent lenses to be released from Sony and Zeiss are also reading up pretty well - particularly the 90 macro.
In short, Sony is a very tempting proposition now.
But I can't get past the single SD card slot having had dual CF/SD card slots in my cameras for many many years now.
Though I've only had a few card problems since the start of digital, those problems have all been with SD's
Does this worry anyone else ?
Personally, I can't imagine shooting something important without that back-up, though maybe I'm overly cautious or even paranoid.. lol
The single card slot is the number one reason many professionals (that I work with...)will not seriously consider the Sony A7 range.
It was an obvious and easy addition for Sony to add to the A7RII, the fact they didn't says a lot about who they aim the range at.
The battery life is the second biggest issue for me.
The lack of repair services is the final hurdle, it's not a cheap camera by any measure, who's going to fix it when it breaks?
The insurance premium won't prevent your house burning down ...
Well said.
I use cameras with two card slots for the same reason, the possibility of a card failure, not neccessarily the expectation.
Now, I am however a bit of a smartass. And so I'll turn the question round: Why should such a revolutionary product, with such a fast sensor, be similar to those that came before? Can *you* produce the graphs?
I asked first, therefore I get to ask the first follow-on question :) What are your thoughts on the color of their other recent products (A7x and/or A9x)?
People in my industry lose two pints and blood and keep working, so no we don't fail, unless we're dead so then I guess then it doesn't matter.
BC
Hi Edmund, was there an associated image with this post?
"Look at the image for a few minutes, and the differences will start to pop out, and make the Pentax image go "3D" as the forest acquires depth. "
Was curious to see it, but I don't see the referring images.
I think you misread - my point is I DISAGREE with the meme of "only with 2 slots is it Professional" meme of the OP . Once it is a large shoot, a camera is just one more component in the mix. Camera works, great. Camera or any other hardware breaks at the last minute, there's some backup solution.While I agree with your disagreement (there's plenty professional camera's that only hold one card and/or one film) the problem with failing memory cards cannot just be solved with a backup in the field. There have been many cases where the card worked fine in the field but once at the computer back in the office the pictures could not be retrieved. Most other components in the chain can be replaced in at the instant they fail (and should be available for a professional shoot) but in case the card fails like I described you're toast.
While I agree with your disagreement (there's plenty professional camera's that only hold one card and/or one film) the problem with failing memory cards cannot just be solved with a backup in the field. There have been many cases where the card worked fine in the field but once at the computer back in the office the pictures could not be retrieved. Most other components in the chain can be replaced in at the instant they fail (and should be available for a professional shoot) but in case the card fails like I described you're toast.
A lot of the journos I know, and single shooters, keep changing cards to make sure all their imagery isn't only on one.
That helps, as does shooting with two cameras on everything, but I've found the most peace of mind with the second card.
Also, FWIW, on a lot of shoots, even big ones, I don't need to bring a computer and that frees up a lot of time for shooting.
I always have my Canon and Nikon cameras setup writing the RAW files to two cards. I load the images from the SD card into my MacBook Pro when I'm back from every shoot and one 32GB card is plenty always for me. I gives me peace of mind that I have a backup on the second card in case of card failure. I have experienced one other situation not mentioned (I think as I did read all posts in the thread) and was one time I reformatted the SD card and I realized that I had not loaded the images!! Then I could load them from the CF card. Well that should never happen, of course, but I was tired after days of workshops and my normal routine is to load the images the evening before and I had not done that and I realized after I did the formatting in the morning. A stupid mistake and the second card saved from using recovery software to find the pictures on the formatted card. I has only happened once, though ;D
I always have my Canon and Nikon cameras setup writing the RAW files to two cards. I load the images from the SD card into my MacBook Pro when I'm back from every shoot and one 32GB card is plenty always for me. I gives me peace of mind that I have a backup on the second card in case of card failure. I have experienced one other situation not mentioned (I think as I did read all posts in the thread) and was one time I reformatted the SD card and I realized that I had not loaded the images!! Then I could load them from the CF card. Well that should never happen, of course, but I was tired after days of workshops and my normal routine is to load the images the evening before and I had not done that and I realized after I did the formatting in the morning. A stupid mistake and the second card saved from using recovery software to find the pictures on the formatted card. I has only happened once, though ;D
Interesting. This is a feature I never thought about a lot, and people feel very strongly about it.
My own pet feature is weather sealing, and most here don't seem to care.
Edmund
I wonder, how many of you shot with two rolls of film in the same body? ;D
I know of one instance (and thankfully only one) where I kept shooting and finished what I thought was the roll of film only to rewind, process, and find out later that the film was not advancing at all. One complete roll of film completely wasted and all those images lost. Lost pics are not the exclusive domain of digital.
Kelly
Shooting with empty camera happened a couple of times in 25 years, wondering if the film was going to never end…I just did that last week with my 5d2. Thankfully I realized about 30 minutes in and could just reshoot right there. I see that my A7RII actually has a custom setting to disable shooting when there's no card. I'm going to activate it.
I just did that last week with my 5d2. Thankfully I realized about 30 minutes in and could just reshoot right there. I see that my A7RII actually has a custom setting to disable shooting when there's no card. I'm going to activate it.
I just did that last week with my 5d2. Thankfully I realized about 30 minutes in and could just reshoot right there. I see that my A7RII actually has a custom setting to disable shooting when there's no card. I'm going to activate it.
Film transport issues were a constant irritant with 35mm cameras - and in fact the old box camera I bought a year ago had the transport of 120 film lock up half through the roll.