Impeaching Donald Trump

[Alan Klein]

Happy New Year to everyone.  Let's shoot more and talk less. 

[Craig Lamson]

Happy New Year to everyone.  Let's shoot more and talk less.

Photos I assume.😎🍻

[Alan Klein]

Photos I assume.😎🍻

Hmmm.

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

... But seriously guys, do you really think it's ok for the President of the US to spread anti-vaccine nonsense?...

Once again, he didn’t say that.

[PeterAit]

Needless to say, no free gas has ever been dispensed.

[PeterAit]

Once again, he didn’t say that.

Slobodan is right on this one. Trump used to be a vaccine skeptic but has changed his tune. So, you can probably find some anti-vax quotes from his past, but he has changed his tune. I will add this to my list of good things he has done, which I keep on a post-it.

[Robert Roaldi]

Once again, he didn’t say that.

If you say so, but others may differ https://www.insider.com/how-donald-trump-became-an-anti-vaccinationist-2019-9.

Is there a notarized, signed and witnessed statement from the man himself saying those exact words, maybe not, but he's come pretty damn close, I'd say. Pretty damn close. I can't find that short video clip from the campaign (I think) where he talks about some poor baby he had recently seen who was autistic because of vaccines. Was there such a baby? Who knows. Could easily have been just a show he was puttin' on.

I'm not even saying he really believes it. What I asked was, are you comfortable with a POTUS acting like this? How is this helpful to anyone? How do to the citizens of USA benefit?

[Robert Roaldi]

Slobodan is right on this one. Trump used to be a vaccine skeptic but has changed his tune. So, you can probably find some anti-vax quotes from his past, but he has changed his tune. I will add this to my list of good things he has done, which I keep on a post-it.

Well, good then. I was not aware of that change of heart. I don't pay close enough attention to the daily news.

I'd still maintain though that it was not even close to ok to have held those beliefs in the first place or to have cynically used them to con gullible audiences.

[Alan Klein]

Actually,  Trump stands by most of his positions and takes the heat when he implements them.  It's one of his admirable traits.   He tells or like it is.  Of course often in an obnoxious unpolitical way.

[Peter McLennan]

   He tells or like it is. 

If I hear that one more time, I'm gonna puke.

That and "Don't listen to what he says, listen to what he means."

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

... I'm not even saying he really believes it. What I asked was, are you comfortable with a POTUS acting like this? How is this helpful to anyone? How do to the citizens of USA benefit?

Let me give you my perspective. For the record, I vaccinated my child, and believe in vaccinations. Autism, vaccinations, and anti-vaccination movement are all very serious matters alone, let alone in combination. The anti-vaccination movement, right or wrong (and I do believe they are wrong), can not be easily dismissed. What needs to be done is to dissuade them, not simply dismiss them. That starts by listening to and acknowledging their concerns. Humans are hard-wired to look for cause-consequence in anything new or bad happening (e.g., the rise in autism). In that anecdote about an autistic baby, I believe he ended it with “Is there a link? I don’t know” (citing from memory).

Trump is a laymen in many areas, bar real estate development. That puts him on an equal footing with many among his constituents. That’s part of his folksy charm. People can relate to that. So, when faced with a mother with an autistic child, he can react to that at the same layman level, acknowledging her concerns as a minimum. Or he could label her as an ignorant deplorable. Well, we’ve seen how the latter worked for a certain presidential candidate.

[Alan Klein]

If I hear that one more time, I'm gonna puke.

That and "Don't listen to what he says, listen to what he means."

He speaks colloquially like most human beings.  The anti-Trump press deliberately misinterprets much of what he says because it's politically expedient.   His comment about Obama tapping his phone is a perfect example. 

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

Actually,  Trump stands by most of his positions and takes the heat when he implements them.  It's one of his admirable traits.   He tells or like it is.

Wrong, it's not like it is, but it's the way he sees things. And from the looks of it, his vision is impaired.

[Robert Roaldi]

Let me give you my perspektive. For the record, I vaccinated my child, and believe in vaccinations. Autism, vaccinations, and anti-vaccination movement are all very serious matters alone, let alone in combination. The anti-vaccination movement, right or wrong (and I do believe they are wrong), can not be easily dismissed. What needs to be done is to dissuade them, not simply dismiss them. That starts by listening to and acknowledging their concerns. Humans are hard-wired to look for cause-consequence in anything new or bad happening (e.g., the rise in autism). In that anecdote about an autistic baby, I believe he ended it with “Is there a link? I don’t know” (citing from memory).

Trump is a laymen in many areas, bar real estate development. That puts him on an equal footing with many among his constituents. That’s part of his folksy charm. People can relate to that. So, when faced with a mother with an autistic child, he can react to that at the same layman level, acknowledging her concerns as a minimum. Or he could label her as an ignorant deplorable. Well, we’ve seen how the latter worked for a certain presidential candidate.

Fair enough. Reacting in a human way is a good thing all round. He (and others) should do it more.

Abetting superstitions is not a good thing and doesn't help anyone. Sympathy and pandering are not the same, you can do one without the other without insulting the poor mother. Others manage this all the time. When you have a public platform, you need to think before speaking or you can do real harm regardless of intention. In that "autistic baby" case, he wasn't just acting as a caring uncle at the kitchen table, he was at a political rally.

It's also a bit difficult to assign that kind of human sympathy to him, however, when during that campaign he mocked the physical disabilities of a journalist he didn't like at another political rally. And it doesn't say much about the audience members who cheered when he did it. People get things wrong when they speak off script, of course, who hasn't, but that was going a little far.

[Alan Klein]

Fair enough. Reacting in a human way is a good thing all round. He (and others) should do it more.

Abetting superstitions is not a good thing and doesn't help anyone. Sympathy and pandering are not the same, you can do one without the other without insulting the poor mother. Others manage this all the time. When you have a public platform, you need to think before speaking or you can do real harm regardless of intention. In that "autistic baby" case, he wasn't just acting as a caring uncle at the kitchen table, he was at a political rally.

It's also a bit difficult to assign that kind of human sympathy to him, however, when during that campaign he mocked the physical disabilities of a journalist he didn't like at another political rally. And it doesn't say much about the audience members who cheered when he did it. People get things wrong when they speak off script, of course, who hasn't, but that was going a little far.

Yeah, Trump is definitely not scripted.  All the other politicians stick their fingers up in the air to check which way the wind is blowing.  They're all phonies which is why people don;t like or trust them.  Yet, when Trump tells it like it is, we all get uncomfortable, itchy.  We don;t know what we want.   Truth is messy.  It forces you to look at yourself.

[faberryman]

Yeah, Trump is definitely not scripted.  All the other politicians stick their fingers up in the air to check which way the wind is blowing.  They're all phonies which is why people don;t like or trust them.  Yet, when Trump tells it like it is, we all get uncomfortable, itchy.  We don;t know what we want.   Truth is messy.  It forces you to look at yourself.

What nonsense.

[Alan Klein]

What nonsense.

What's nonsense.  That politicians are phoney?  Or that Trump makes you uncomfortable by telling things like they are? 

[RSL]

If I hear that one more time, I'm gonna puke.

Barf bag ready, Peter? Okay:     He tells it like it is.

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

What's nonsense.  That politicians are phoney?  Or that Trump makes you uncomfortable by telling things like they are?

Trump does make me uncomfortable. But that's not because he is "telling things like they are", but because he apparently thinks that his fictional world is real.

The man who thinks that e.g. Putin is a more reliable source of information than the CIA, he thinks that not Russia but Ukraine meddled in the 2016 elections, he thinks that he can pressure a foreign country into aiding in the 2020 elections by withholding Congressionally approved funds to a country at war (14000 people died already) coming from the man who cannot even fold an umbrella makes me uncomfortable, yes.

[Alan Klein]

Trump does make me uncomfortable. But that's not because he is "telling things like they are", but because he apparently thinks that his fictional world is real.

The man who thinks that e.g. Putin is a more reliable source of information than the CIA, he thinks that not Russia but Ukraine meddled in the 2016 elections, he thinks that he can pressure a foreign country into aiding in the 2020 elections by withholding Congressionally approved funds to a country at war (14000 people died already) coming from the man who cannot even fold an umbrella makes me uncomfortable, yes.

I think you better spend more for your own defense then since we're not that reliable.