Phase One Plus MFDB Xpose+ Technology

[jmboss]

To all,

I have been searching though the features and specifications of all the MFDB manufacturers and only Phase One with their "XPose+ technology" claims noise-free exposures of up to 1 hour in duration.  This feature is available with all of their current Plus series backs and also the older P45 model.

Why does Leaf, Hasselblad, and Sinar seem not to be interested in matching this capability with their MFDB products, as this is a significant improvement by Phase One in exposure time and image quality compared to all previous models by any company.

Even though my Leaf Aptus back has a maximum exposure time of 30 seconds,  the images taken with it progressively gain a lot of digital noise as exposure times go beyond 1 second. The same result also occurs with my old Kodak Pro Back and a friend's older Phase One back.

For Architectural photographers in particular, I would think there would be more requests of the 3 other brands for a longer exposure and noise free capability, as it is a really desirable feature, IMO, for those evening or nighttime shots, or just when you need that extra f-stop and are unable to supplement with additional lighting.  It seems that most photographers who specialize in this field use Phase One.

I also note that only the Phase One Backs support the new Kapture One Multishot and Long Exposure Device for multiple sequential strobe lighting.

While I really, really like my Leaf MFDB (especially with that wonderful 6x7 LCD screen), w/o an upgrade model to compete with the Phase One Plus series features, I suppose I will have to jump ship to satisfy my photography needs.

Anybody have any news developments on competing upgrades by Leaf or by any of the other MFDB companies?

Joe Bossuyt

[pixjohn]

Is this the devise you are talking about? link

This is a kapture group made device. I spoke with Kapture Group the other day about this item and it is available for Leaf backs. I also spoke with them about a more custom unit that will allow you to
start the devise with the first exposure. They have a unit for fuji camera's that they will try and  modify for me to test. It will allow  set preset times 5, 10 , 15, 20, 25, 30 sec exposures or use a switch to end the exposure.  

I am very interested in this device, and hope  to gain 1 -2 stops of light.

TI also note that only the Phase One Backs support the new Kapture One Multishot and Long Exposure Device for multiple sequential strobe lighting
Joe Bossuyt
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187798\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[rethmeier]

The long exposure is certainly an issue with the Dalsa sensor backs(Sinar&Leaf).
They both state 32 seconds as their maximum times.
Phase certainly is a winner in that department.
However I'm not sure wether this is a software thing or it's the design of the Dalsa sensor.
I did see some long Phase images and yes there was little or no noise,but the shadows looked
very fake.like a painterly effect.
I still have to test my eMotion-75LV for long exposures.
For what I know is that some people who use this back get good results at 32 seconds and other don't.
Happy shooting,
Willem.

[Dustbak]

I believe Phase & Hasselblad both use the same sensor in some of their backs at least. One would think Hasselblad should be able to achieve long exposures similar as Phase.

A ~60sec. exposure has been promised in the future which is still very far behind the ~60min. of Phase. Apparently Phase had this figured out really well.

[Murray Fredericks]

YES I AGREE!!!

This lack of long exposure capability is the single biggest drawback with my Sinar eMotion LV (architectural and interior work).

The noise is evident from 1 sec exposures in certain tones and by 25sec, most of my shadows are so full of noise they require lengthy re-touching sessions to fix to reach a 'client deliverable' state.

I did know this in part prior to purchase and the phase one shadows in long exposures were to me (like Willem) uninviting - it seemed as though the noise was there just blurred??

When I purchased the eMotion 75LV, the LV was just released and the tests I performed on the shop's eMotion75 showed bad noise problems low down. I was encouraged to spend an extra $5000 for the LV which I did as it was supposed to fix the noise problems.

It did not!

I am actually considering testing the Canon 1ds III with a view to upgrading my old 1Dsto  see if this camera has better long exposure renditions.

But after you already spend $$$$KKK it's a bit annoying to say the least when you expect much more...

Saying that, out of the realm of long exposures, the quality is mind blowing and with Brumbaer, the Alpa etc etc, the results are great.

But, FIX OUR LONG EXPOSURES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[rethmeier]

Now the Nikon D3 is the long exposure KING!
If that camera had a 24MP sensor ,that would be my no1 choice for long exposures.
Still using a medium format camera,like the Hy6 is such a joy compared to the DSLR's.
My 2cw.

Yes,Sinar and Leaf,please do something to the long exposures.

[eronald]

I did some minute-long exposures with the 1Ds2 *at high ISO* and they were very good. A used 1Ds2 might be an alternative for you, they're trading cheap. On the other hand the lenses ...

Edmund

I am actually considering testing the Canon 1ds III with a view to upgrading my old 1Dsto  see if this camera has better long exposure renditions.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187877\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[rethmeier]

N.B.
Have any of the Sinar users tried long exposures with the new eXposure software from Sinar?
According to Sinar it would have sorted things out!
Cheers,
Willem.

[Graham Mitchell]

Willem, I just did a little test for you. This is a 30" exposure at base ISO with a linear response curve and no tweaking whatsoever. I used a 54LV back, so not the same as yours, but I am using Exposure:

Scene:
[attachment=6010:attachment]

Crop:
[attachment=6009:attachment]

I also suspect that Phase has some automated noise reduction. Would be interesting to test and confirm either way. Perhaps someone can test a Phase back with different levels of ambient light on the subject. If the fine details look the same at both long and short exposures then maybe the back is noise free. If details start to look smudged and painted then I suspect there is some background NR coming into play.

[Murray Fredericks]

Certainly looks better than my current 30sec exposures...

[Murray Fredericks]

I did some minute-long exposures with the 1Ds2 *at high ISO* and they were very good. A used 1Ds2 might be an alternative for you, they're trading cheap. On the other hand the lenses ...

Edmund
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187885\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Edmund,

I saw you wrote a review on the 1DS MkIII  - did you also test long exposures? How did they compare with MFDB? How is the general rendition (contrast separation etc) of the blacks in dark situations as compared with MFDB?

Murray

[snickgrr]

Very interesting.   I had immediately given up hope for a Leaf product after reading the post from the Capture Integration person saying it was only for Phase.  
Looks like I'll be giving Kapture Group a call myself, especially for that modified one shot solution idea they have.

Is this the devise you are talking about? link

This is a kapture group made device. I spoke with Kapture Group the other day about this item and it is available for Leaf backs. I also spoke with them about a more custom unit that will allow you to
start the devise with the first exposure. They have a unit for fuji camera's that they will try and  modify for me to test. It will allow  set preset times 5, 10 , 15, 20, 25, 30 sec exposures or use a switch to end the exposure. 

I am very interested in this device, and hope  to gain 1 -2 stops of light.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187847\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[eronald]

I have no idea how the 1Ds3 compares to a back at long exposure; the general rendition is a bit more murky as usual with CMOS was my impression.

Edmund

Edmund,

I saw you wrote a review on the 1DS MkIII  - did you also test long exposures? How did they compare with MFDB? How is the general rendition (contrast separation etc) of the blacks in dark situations as compared with MFDB?

Murray
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187909\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[pixjohn]

The more people that call and ask, they would put more time into making the right product.

Very interesting.   I had immediately given up hope for a Leaf product after reading the post from the Capture Integration person saying it was only for Phase. 
Looks like I'll be giving Kapture Group a call myself, especially for that modified one shot solution idea they have.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187952\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[snickgrr]

I emailed this morning and Keith called and we spoke at length.  He told me he like to hear from other photographers for a wish list of sorts of other implementations.
That way he could plan for a more complete product offering.

The more people that call and ask, they would put more time into making the right product.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=188040\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

[jmboss]

Is this the devise you are talking about? link

This is a kapture group made device. I spoke with Kapture Group the other day about this item and it is available for Leaf backs. I also spoke with them about a more custom unit that will allow you to
start the devise with the first exposure. They have a unit for fuji camera's that they will try and  modify for me to test. It will allow  set preset times 5, 10 , 15, 20, 25, 30 sec exposures or use a switch to end the exposure. 

I am very interested in this device, and hope  to gain 1 -2 stops of light.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=187847\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Any updates on this possible Kapture Group long exposure timer device for use with Phase One or Leaf Aptus digital backs?

Joe Bossuyt

[Mitchell Baum]

Hi Graham,

Was this shot tethered to Exposure or just processed in Exposure?

Thanks,

Mitchell

[Graham Mitchell]

Hi Graham,

Was this shot tethered to Exposure or just processed in Exposure?

Thanks,

Mitchell
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=214234\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

It was some time ago but I'm pretty sure it was tethered.

[rainer_v]

for willem and murray i just shot also  some 30sec exposures.
e75lv
untethered.
konverted with brumbaer and opened in adobe raw 4,5 with its standard settings.


30sec, iso100
[attachment=7866:attachment]
30sec, iso200 ( pushing exp +1 )
[attachment=7867:attachment]
30sec, 400   ( +2 )
[attachment=7868:attachment]
30sec, 800   ( +3 )
[attachment=7869:attachment]