Topic: HP Z3100- printing continuous gradient tones (Read 3995 times)

kers · « **on:** December 01, 2007, 05:47:01 pm »

Using the HP Z3100 printer for some time now it just occurred to me that it is impossible for me to print a perfect gradient from say : white to black
I allways get some kind of striping in the gradient-.
It is- I can understand - difficult to make a perfect gradient for an inkjet printer bulding this gradients from dots, but I guess it should be possible.

In the example I use HP Hahnemuele smooth fine art . The profiles that I used are 4:

the official HP profile- and 3 APS-profiles I made myself with the Z3100:
easy -medium -and large.
In the given example below attached I made the original gradient in photoshop adobe rgb.300dpi using the gradient spot tool.

Using the profiles I allways get rings when printed and they are exactly predicted in the softproof on my screen- so I dont have to print it to know what will happen. I am especially disappointed in the large APS profile. ( all ICC conversions are made relative colorimetric - perceptual gives other - but not better - results)
Is there something wrong with my equpment/ method or is it something I have to live with?
Does somebody has a better profile for me.?
Hope to get some awnsers from all of you ...
regards,

Pieter Kers

Ernst Dinkla · « **Reply #1 on:** December 02, 2007, 08:55:06 am »

Quote

Using the profiles I allways get rings when printed and they are exactly predicted in the softproof on my screen- so I dont have to print it to know what will happen.
Pieter Kers
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Ever tried to add some noise to the image 1-3% gaussian ?
I have not looked in that Zip but base it on the tezt.

Ernst Dinkla

try: Wide_Inkjet_Printers@yahoogroups.com

kers · « **Reply #2 on:** December 02, 2007, 06:16:20 pm »

Hello Ernst thank you for responding.
Although putting noise tot the image is only a medication for the symptom but not a real solution I noticed I have to put 7% or more to my with large APS profiled image. So that is a lot.

Looking at all the ICC profiles I have for printers- using preview in photoshop - I see it is almost a common problem.

Wayne Fox · « **Reply #3 on:** December 02, 2007, 08:37:49 pm »

Quote

Hello Ernst thank you for responding.
Although putting noise tot the image is only a medication for the symptom but not a real solution I noticed I have to put 7% or more to my with large APS profiled image. So that is a lot.

Looking at all the ICC profiles I have for printers- using preview in photoshop - I see it is almost a common problem.
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Not sure what you are expecting. Kind of typical with radial gradations like this.

If you really want to feel bad, download Bill Atkinson's 28 Balls test from his download folder.

Even using averaged readings of several 5200 patch targets on a Canon ipf6100 and an Epson 11880, I still see rings like this in several of the balls printing that test image.

That being said, not sure how practical it is for judging profile/printer performance.

dkeyes · « **Reply #4 on:** December 03, 2007, 01:52:53 am »

I've never seen a perfect gradation from a computer program. Square pixels making up circular gradations will always have trouble at some point in the gradation. There may be a computer programmer out there that would disagree. One way to get it smoother would be to create the file at higher resolutions like 1200. This is standard in the design industry when scanning/using gradations and line art. I vaguely remember years ago when creating images like this in Freehand or Illustrator that the best output was acheived by matching number of steps to output device resolution. There was some formula for doing this but don't remember what it is.
I'm sure Photoshop has figured this out though.

Another way to get it smoother might be the fact that your in RGB instead of greyscale.

It is odd that the stock ICC profile would be different than your large patch profile. I would assume HP would be using APS to make the stock profile as well. Either way, unless you produce these kinds of images, I can't imagine you'll ever notice a correlation to everyday use/images.

- Doug

kers · « **Reply #5 on:** December 03, 2007, 06:50:21 pm »

thank you all for the comments- it was all very helpful.

The bill atkinsons balls indeed make me feel said, but the I blamed the (too) large prophoto space for that...

The official profiles use about 780 patches the large APS uses over 900...so, no they made not the same way I presume...

ciao PK

neil snape · « **Reply #6 on:** December 05, 2007, 02:38:46 am »

The printer resolution, your gradients, and the media all will show areas of discontinuity, no matter what printer you use. If you had a perfectly created gradient, and you ran with LUT only in the driver or rip it could be perfectly smooth outside end points but in no way colour corrected.
The Z printer shows fine gradients globally, and as with all printers will show less fluid step differences on matte paper than glossy.

kers · « **Reply #7 on:** December 05, 2007, 06:48:13 am »

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The printer resolution, your gradients, and the media all will show areas of discontinuity, no matter what printer you use.
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Neil,- as you probably have seen there is a topic addedby Paul called "problems with gray scale transitiion" wich is about the same problem. Sometimes you have these images that show this imperfectness. My solution now, is to find a ICC profile that fits best.

Would you say that a Lambda printer does not have this 'smooth gradien' problem because of its different printing technique?

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