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Author Topic: Beware the price of fame when you court infamy  (Read 5660 times)

Gulag

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Re: Beware the price of fame when you court infamy
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2014, 02:17:27 am »

If you do not want to be described in such an uncomplimentary manner, then there's a simple solution. Do not behave in any way you would not wish to be described.
It's also tedious when people try to claim ad hominen as a way of distancing themselves from their unpleasant views. As if their views and themselves were separate entities.
You seem to think models/women are fair game for photographers to prey upon, because that is what they should expect. I think that's an appalling attitude and then you witter on about forum etiquette, which seems more important to to you than sexual assault or rape. Good to know where your priorities are.



I don't know whether you're a male or female member here. But I guess gender doesn't really matter if we can take a deeper look at how some women have expressed their views - I don't know whether or not that's unpleasant according to the indoctrination that you've received - on the issue. What occurs to me at the moment is what Andrea Dworkin wrote in her influential book Intercourse, and let me quote:

The normal f^ck by a normal man is taken to be an act of invasion and ownership undertaken in a mode of predation.

Women have been chattels to men as wives, as prostitutes, as sexual and reproductive servants. Being owned and being f^cked are or have been virtually synonymous experiences in the lives of women. He owns you; he f^cks you. The f^cking conveys the quality of the ownership: he owns you inside out. The f^cking conveys the passion of his dominance: it requires access to every hidden inch. He can own everything around you and everything on you and everything you are capable of doing as a worker or servant or ornament; but getting inside you and owning your insides is possession: deeper, more intimate, than any other kind of ownership. Intimate, raw, total, the experience of sexual possession for women is real and literal…

In the f^ck, the man expresses the geography of his dominance: her sex, her insides are part of his domain as a male… Women live inside this reality of being owned and being f^cked: are sensate inside it; the body learning to respond to what male dominance offers as touch, as sex, as love. For women, being possessed is the sex that has to meet the need for love or tenderness or physical affection; therefore, it comes to mean, to show, the intensity of desire; and being erotically owned by a man who takes you and f^cks you is a physically charged and meaningful affirmation of womanhood or femininity or being desired.
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jjj

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Re: Beware the price of fame when you court infamy
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2014, 10:15:19 am »

Then be the first to revise the standard dictionary definition and the very essence of ad hominem concept: "attacking an opponent's motives or character rather than the policy or position they maintain."
Still avoiding the fact that your views seem quite iffy I see. Also missing the point that if say for example, someone describe someone else as a racist bigot, because they express racist and bigoted views, that may be simply descriptive of them. The fact that is is not flattering does not make necessarily it an ad hominen attack and therefore their statement invalid. Which is a tactic people like to use in forums as a deflection away from unpleasant things they may have said. As indeed you have done here.

You are victim blaming and making excuses for rapists - not something to be proud of really. Now if your character or motives are misogynistic, then that is why you hold a position or policy that is anti-women. They are not separate entities.
A better example of an ad hominen attack would be calling another person devious and ugly, whilst debating the merits of the best racquet to play table tennis, as there is no connection between the debate and the personal comments. We are not talking about facts here like how many pixels can fit on the head of a pin or the best racquet, but attitudes which come directly from one's character. Your attitude comes across as either misogynist or naive. Hopefully the latter.
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jjj

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Re: Beware the price of fame when you court infamy
« Reply #22 on: June 20, 2014, 10:29:50 am »

I don't know whether you're a male or female member here. But I guess gender doesn't really matter if we can take a deeper look at how some women have expressed their views - I don't know whether or not that's unpleasant according to the indoctrination that you've received - on the issue.
Indoctrination!? What a pejorative attitude. Did it ever occur to you that I may have views that are all of my own.


Quote
What occurs to me at the moment is what Andrea Dworkin wrote in her influential book Intercourse, and let me quote:

The normal f^ck by a normal man is taken to be an act of invasion and ownership undertaken in a mode of predation.
What on earth is the point of writing 'f^ck'? It is obvious what you are writing and will be read exactly the same as an uncensored version will be, so why pretend you are not writing it? So if you are going to use it, use it properly, not in a weaselly way.
And no, Dworkin [and other similar folk] have certainly not 'indoctrinated' me in any way, shape or form. That's going too far in the other direction from Slobodan's stance, to the point where they possibly both end up being equally chauvinistic.
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