Pages: [1] 2 3 4   Go Down

Author Topic: do you believe in obscenity  (Read 10965 times)

wmchauncey

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 793
do you believe in obscenity
« on: November 23, 2013, 08:40:28 am »

I'm gonna speak from personal experience mind you...as a hobbyist.

 Were you to total up all the monies that I have invested in this photography hobby thingy...camera/lenses/and associated whatnot, along with high end computer and monitor, then add in the post processing software with training to use that software...the total would be staggeringly obscene.

 But, what is worse is, when you consider that I've printed a grand total of four prints, that were donated to friends...then it becomes increasing oblivious that I'm stretching the credible boundaries of the term obscene.

 Does anyone else out there come close to my level of insanity?
Logged
The things you do for yourself die with

Christoph C. Feldhaim

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2509
  • There is no rule! No - wait ...
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #1 on: November 23, 2013, 08:49:26 am »

Stop this self destructive throwing yourself in the mud!
Go on, take images, post, print and share!
We are all crazy here - more or less.
Its just normal.
:D


EDIT:
Addendum: Life is short!
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 09:05:53 am by Christoph C. Feldhaim »
Logged

B-Ark

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 102
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2013, 08:51:07 am »

Cameras: $5000
Lenses: $5000
Computer+Monitor: $2000
Software: $1000
The enjoyment, fulfillment, satisfaction: Priceless
Logged

petermfiore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2705
    • Peter Fiore Fine Art
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2013, 10:15:31 am »

Take note that Van Gogh sold one painting in his life. He was an artist because he had to be.
There was more than money considerations at play in his world.

Somewhere a balance can be had.

Peter

wmchauncey

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 793
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2013, 10:46:59 am »

My children, all nine of them threaten this...     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnzHtm1jhL4
Logged
The things you do for yourself die with

WalterEG

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1155
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2013, 10:57:21 am »

I can't help feeling I'm surrounded by folk who know the price of everything and the value of nothing.
+1
Logged

KirbyKrieger

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 422
    • Kirby Krieger Pictures
"Obscenity" obscures the issue
« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2013, 11:23:46 am »

Take note that Van Gogh sold one painting in his life. He was an artist because he had to be.
There was more than money considerations at play in his world.

The Van Gogh story is, like most, much more complicated, and in its complexity defies easy categorization.  It is easy and damaging to simplify it.  (The same can be said of his paintings.)  The concept of "artist", as we now understand it, did not exist at the time.  Van Gogh came from a reasonably well-to-do family.  He was trained professionally as an art dealer, and was successful at that as a young man.  He came to drawing and painting as an adult, after a protracted religious crisis.  He painted because he wanted to.  He lived off his brother's generosity, and was bothered by his dependency.  As a painter, he was among a group of upstarts working in a new, little known, style.  Within that group, he was widely and completely recognized as doing excellent, ground-breaking work.  Unfortunately for him then, and for his social legacy, he suffered from mental illness, and died at 37 from an infection caused by a self-inflicted gunshot wound.  (The Wikipedia entry on Van Gogh is excellent.)

From his life's story, I want to emphasize two things relevant to this thread: 
 - He wanted to make paintings.  His desire to have materials to work with, and his need for money to pay for them, were driven by the end product, which was paintings.
 - Painting is not photography.  The slow accretion of thoughful work that goes into a painting (even de Kooning spent hours planning his next "moves") has no real equivalent in photography.  And the hunter's joy — "shot", "captured", "Got it!" — that is for many a central part of photography has no equivalent in painting.

I see in the above, facets of an important difference: the over-riding egotism in photography is different from the over-riding egotism of photography.  The OP has stated — I can't tell with what degree of seriousness — that his/her photographic egotism is obscene.  I concur (but need more information).  Our current practice of photography invites a substitution of (the relatively easy) "I bought this" in the place of (the difficult) "I made this".  That substitution could not occur in painting. 

I think photographers and photography could learn much from painting.

(NB: I am aware that I have run as rough-shod over the OP as I have implied Peter trampled Van Gogh.  I welcome corrections, etc.)

AFairley

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1486
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #7 on: November 23, 2013, 12:08:16 pm »

Cameras: $5000
Lenses: $5000
Computer+Monitor: $2000
Software: $1000
The enjoyment, fulfillment, satisfaction: Priceless


+1
Logged

petermfiore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2705
    • Peter Fiore Fine Art
Re: "Obscenity" obscures the issue
« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2013, 12:11:44 pm »


(NB: I am aware that I have run as rough-shod over the OP as I have implied Peter trampled Van Gogh.  I welcome corrections, etc.)


I hardly think I trampled Vincent in any way. Just an example. He has been long dead and as such I never got the chance to meet him....Sadly.


Peter

Slobodan Blagojevic

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18091
  • When everyone thinks the same, nobody thinks
    • My website
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2013, 12:15:53 pm »

Take note that Van Gogh sold one painting in his life...

I heard he never sold any. Which one is it?

mezzoduomo

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 349
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2013, 12:19:18 pm »

Stop this self destructive throwing yourself in the mud!
Go on, take images, post, print and share!
We are all crazy here - more or less.
Its just normal.
:D


EDIT:
Addendum: Life is short!

+1, especially the addendum.
Logged

Alan Klein

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 15850
    • Flicker photos
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2013, 12:23:31 pm »

Take note that Van Gogh sold one painting in his life. He was an artist because he had to be.
There was more than money considerations at play in his world.

Somewhere a balance can be had.



You could cut off your ear to feel better.

petermfiore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2705
    • Peter Fiore Fine Art
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2013, 12:24:14 pm »

I heard he never sold any. Which one is it?



The only painting that Van Gogh sold was 'Red Vineyard at Arles', and it is currently at the Pushkin Museum in Moscow.


Peter

KirbyKrieger

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 422
    • Kirby Krieger Pictures
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2013, 12:41:43 pm »

I heard he never sold any. Which one is it?

Peter has answered below.  I think it's important to know that, dispite the lack of sales, his work was well-known and very highly regarded among his peers.  From Wikipedia:
Quote
His work was praised by Albert Aurier in the Mercure de France in January 1890, when he was described as "a genius."[128] That February he was invited by Les XX, a society of avant-garde painters in Brussels, to participate in their annual exhibition. At the opening dinner, Les XX member Henry de Groux insulted Van Gogh's work. Toulouse-Lautrec demanded satisfaction, while Signac declared he would continue to fight for Van Gogh's honor if Lautrec should surrender. Later, while Van Gogh's exhibit was on display with the Artistes Indépendants in Paris, Monet said that his work was the best in the show.[129]

Van Gogh died at the end of July that year.

Eric Myrvaagnes

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22813
  • http://myrvaagnes.com
    • http://myrvaagnes.com
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2013, 01:59:03 pm »

Wmchauncy,

Since your main concern seems to be the obscene ratio of dollars spent to equipment to number of prints made, the solution is obvious: Make more prints!
Logged
-Eric Myrvaagnes (visit my website: http://myrvaagnes.com)

Rob C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 24074
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2013, 02:36:08 pm »

It all depends on how much money you have to chuck around, where you want to get to, and, as importantly, why.

How many street-races did anyone win in their red Ferrari, in their BRG Jaguar or even in their Corvette? Were they even dumb enough to participate?

I don't think Vincent had wheels.

Anyway, I don't think you can define someone an artist just because he owns brushes and/or cameras; unfortunately, it goes rather deeper than that. Basically, that person - the artist - is born that way and has little option but to follow his star. As Peter said, there is more at play than money in those choices... often, you follow the route because you can't deny it.

Rob C

Slobodan Blagojevic

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18091
  • When everyone thinks the same, nobody thinks
    • My website
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2013, 05:16:08 pm »

The only painting that Van Gogh sold was 'Red Vineyard at Arles', and it is currently at the Pushkin Museum in Moscow.

Was it him selling it or his brother did it?

David Sutton

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1345
    • David Sutton Photography
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2013, 06:54:43 pm »

It all depends on how much money you have to chuck around, where you want to get to, and, as importantly, why.

How many street-races did anyone win in their red Ferrari, in their BRG Jaguar or even in their Corvette? Were they even dumb enough to participate?

I don't think Vincent had wheels.

Anyway, I don't think you can define someone an artist just because he owns brushes and/or cameras; unfortunately, it goes rather deeper than that. Basically, that person - the artist - is born that way and has little option but to follow his star. As Peter said, there is more at play than money in those choices... often, you follow the route because you can't deny it.

Rob C

Yes, that sums it up.
At heart the question of how much money we've invested is plainly the wrong question.
We could look at what folks spend on their cars or houses compared to their real needs, but the the real question is how much time we have invested.
Our time is our most valuable resource, and it is most telling how much of that we invest in our art.
David
Logged

michael

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5084
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2013, 07:06:49 pm »

Which brings us back to the "10,000 Hour Rule", which I am firmly convinced is a good yardstick.

To master any art, craft, or profession it takes about 5 years of concentrated full time study and involvement. To whit, the time it takes to become a doctor, a lawyer, an airline pilot, or dare I say a photographer.

After spending much of my life teaching photography, lecturing, writing and working one-on-one as a mentor, I have seen first hand countless times that the only people who really become masters (even if they never sell a single print, or earn a single dollar's commission) are those who read, study and practice daily. Month after month. Year after year.

Good, even great gear is nice, but has little to do with mastery of ones art or craft. It simply takes time, and of course some innate talent doesn't hurt.

Michael
Logged

RSL

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16046
    • http://www.russ-lewis.com
Re: do you believe in obscenity
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2013, 07:22:07 pm »

Hear, hear, Michael, but I'll go a step beyond that and say that as near as I can tell, in any art, no matter how hard you work, innate talent is what takes you beyond good to unforgettable. I think I've mentioned this before on LuLa, but my wife and I had a friend who was a concert pianist. She'd worked at it for decades, and technically she was flawless, but to me there always was something missing in her ability to interpret, and I find I'm not alone in that evaluation. I always think back to Oscar Levant. He wasn't a very good mechanic. When he played Gershwin he'd sometimes miss notes, but the way he played it always could bring me to tears. I think visual art is like music. To be absolutely tops you have to have a particular gene -- one that's pretty rare.

And yes, equipment has absolutely nothing to do with it. Think back to the kind of equipment people like HCB and Kertesz were using. Nowadays there's nothing out there that comes close to being that awkward and difficult.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 07:24:16 pm by RSL »
Logged
Russ Lewis  www.russ-lewis.com.
Pages: [1] 2 3 4   Go Up