examples of Session setup

[Phil Indeblanc]

I don't do catalogs via C1, as I use LR or other dedicated DAM apps for this, and I am getting tired of cleaning up all the files C1 creates in every folder I come in contact with in C1.  

In order to make sense and keep things organized, I thought to make a "Generic" Session and then once done shooting into it, and processing the raw, I would move the raw images and settings to the server location.
My folder looks a bit like this:

Company name/Date&Project desc(contains the raw files) / Processed(contains the processed files) / Edited(contains the files to work on) / Jpeg(contains the delivery file)

I use a few different camera systems, and I never ingest files via C1, and only use it when I shoot with the Phase back. One of the reasons I don't use or even like using how C1 forces users to creatre folders.

So thats why I want to make a generic Session.

Anyone have suggestions or issues when moving? What files I need to move and what to delete? (proxy, settings, output, selects, trash). And since I use LR, where(what program) I have to make these moves.

thanks!

[David Grover / Capture One]

Why not just set up the folder structure you have described above as a Session?

 

[Phil Indeblanc]

Yes, that is the Generic Session, as there is no other choice, it creates that without a choice.
The attached image shows how I intend to set this up in C1. I will shoot to C drive, and then move all keep(not trashed) images to my servers.

C1 doesn't allow for hierarchy. i.e. I can't place all this under "Client name", or place "A_PROCESSED" in a subfolder of "Selects". So I won't be able to create a session for each client. Also this makes a mess of files in my folders, and unnecessary redundancy.

So my question is more to what files to move to my created client folders when I am done with shooting in C1(without losing dev settings).
I will likely be moving them in other browsers, dams, etc, not within C1.

[Doug Peterson]

C1 doesn't allow for hierarchy. i.e. I can't place all this under "Client name", or place "A_PROCESSED" in a subfolder of "Selects". So I won't be able to create a session for each client. Also this makes a mess of files in my folders, and unnecessary redundancy.

It does allow for hierarchy. It's not the default behavior for a new session but it would take <20 seconds to change a session to use that exact structure (and naming).

If the 20 seconds bothered you, then create a template session which already has this hierarchy, and use it to originate all future sessions. That would lower the time required to around 10 seconds, which is about the same as it takes to make the hierarchy manually anyway.

I've always believed that it's your belief that sessions are the antithesis of what you want which prevents you from discovering that, in all likelihood they could well be the solution to your problems.

[David Grover / Capture One]

+1

Doug's right Phil. The solution exists.

Why not spend some education time with Doug?

[Phil Indeblanc]

This certainly helps for making the generic session, Thank you.
I certainly can use some more education in how C1 works. Even after finishing the CaptureU sessions :-), and using C1 since its inception for about a decade.
And 10-20 seconds is certainly not much if I were simplifying things.

Doug, true that I am against programs creating/forcing things, instead of leaving those functions/advantages/disadvantages as options.

I don't always have the servers available when shooting, hence my question leaning towards the movement of files.

[Tim_Smith]

I'm barging in here, apologies. But the timing is appropriate since I've been encountering all kinds of error messages since changing to a new laptop. I should confess that even after using C1 for years (5+?) I have never taken the time to really study the tutorials and/or attend a seminar. It is therefore, probably all my fault that I suddenly have a mess of disconnected files and endless "unable to process" error messages.

But those problems can be solved and I'm not asking for answers in this (someone's elses thread). But I would like to state for the record that the session/catalog functions are in my opinion, one reason C1 is not more popular. The fact that one must endure tutorials and adhere to the software's notion of how I should work, is a negative aspect of an otherwise wonderful product.

There are (again, my opinion) too many options and boxes to fill that complicate what should be a simple process. An example of a minor frustration is the input/output naming process. Why, after filling out the job name during the initial import process, isn't that entry carried on all the way through to the output?

I should stop here. It's probably a bad idea to try and articulate any reasonable criticism whilst in the grip of frustration. Maybe what I really need is a version of C1 "for dummies".

[Doug Peterson]

There are (again, my opinion) too many options and boxes to fill that complicate what should be a simple process. An example of a minor frustration is the input/output naming process. Why, after filling out the job name during the initial import process, isn't that entry carried on all the way through to the output?

It is. By default C1 does exactly that.

File > New Session> [type in a name] > OK {two clicks}
Import Images > OK/Import
Process

The result will be an outputted file with the same name as the raw - "carried all the way through".

I should stop here. It's probably a bad idea to try and articulate any reasonable criticism whilst in the grip of frustration. Maybe what I really need is a version of C1 "for dummies".

I don't know you, and I don't know your needs so I can't guarantee it, but with the experience of teaching several hundred people, the chances are very good that a few hours worth of 1v1 training/consultation and 90% of your frustration and questions would go away, especially if most of them center around not quite understanding what a session is and why they are a useful tool for reducing the complexity of your organization.

Simplicity and Intuitiveness in software is a very positive attribute, especially when you don't need to use the software often. But for professional software, core to your workflow, which you use frequently, it makes sense to prioritize power, flexibility, and image quality, even if the cost is that, for some users, a few hours of training is required to become facile with.

It's a spectrum: iPhoto provides few serious imaging tools, but I'm fairly certain I could teach my grandma to use it, Iridient Raw Developer provides more corrective sliders and options than just about anything out there but requires a serious technical mind and a lot of learning to operate. Capture One and Lightroom fall somewhere in the middle. Especially with a knowledgable explanation of the principals/mindset behind Capture One it's a very simple and straight forward program to use assuming it's default workflow suits you and not all that hard to change to any other workflow.

[Tim_Smith]

Clearly I have somehow managed to break my version of C1-7. After your reply, I tried a test by starting a new session and importing some images. I was asked to name the session, then to name the job on import, and once the files were imported, when I picked one and hit "output" the name already in place in the "output file name" was the LAST job I output and did not match the current session naming.

Again, I'm perfectly willing to take responsibility for my lazy attitude towards learning the unique characteristics of the software. After all this I will at the very least view the tutorials available on the site. I'm not trying to be argumentative either, but I am certainly not the first to have difficulty grasping the logic behind the software's import/export pathway. With all the negative buzz about Adobe's CC, I read posts from folks looking for an alternative. I often find myself suggesting (at least to myself...) C1! Try C1! Then I remember how awkward it is to learn and realize that many won't make the hurdle, even if it is the finest rendering engine out there.

Tim

[Tim_Smith]

Thanks to Doug for helping me (offline) understand how my settings were influencing the output naming of my files. Apologies to the OP if I've inserted any chop into your otherwise calm water.

[Phil Indeblanc]

No prob..

I was hoping my initial question could be answered :-)...anyone?

As for Tim's thoughts and concerns....Which are welcome.

 I think Doug covered it rather well. and as much as I agree with you 100% Tim.
 C1 is not interested in being a mainstream raw developer. If you use it once a week, you are likely to forget the workflow, mixed in with the way the OS works you interact with regularly, (as other apps follow some sort of OS standard way of doing things), you are likely to struggle with C1. If you use it along another Raw developer or other file manager, again, you are likely going to get mixed up, or forget, perhaps shift major brain gears to mesh well. You can remain as frustrated as I am. C1's main focus is as Doug says. They rely more so on full time Digital techs that assist photographers.  The training to be a certified digital tech, and keeping C1 exclusive is something C1 sees as an advantageous asset. I think it is short sited, yet it is niche, and it hasn't bothered them to shift away from such a business model... yet.

At one time, I was using it more regularly, and I was getting to know C1 more. But then LR3 had launched. Since I was already using C1 with some struggle. I went to LR for most of my work. LR was so easy to work with off the bat (due to some OS standards, Photoshop transition) I was using C1 less, which made it harder to work with. (LR also uses GUI visual logic to help guide you). C1 is superior in processing certain subjects. At least the way I work in LR doesn't get me the detailed results as I get in C1. Maybe a LR training would get me equal results?  There are a good amount of raw processors these days. I really like how DXO handles files, but oddly enough, NO PhaseOne back support! None..No med format backs. Also, I'm not sure their level of quality compared to C1.

Anyway. If you plan to use C1 more so, I couldn't think of a better person to take C1 classes with. I have "known" Doug for maybe 8 years, and he has the methodology, the mindset approach to teach someone from all levels. And he too understands the frustrations people have. So, he knows how to approach it very well.
Even with training, what it comes down to is that you HAVE to use the software daily. In depth and/or "in and out" with it.
I simply don't use it daily. Funny enough still hit some bumps with fundamentals of the software. I know the developing stuff much better.

Back to the original question....(I know it maybe simple, but I want to make sure)....
Anyone have suggestions or issues when moving(IIQ image files)? What files I need to move and what to delete(what I can delete)? (proxy, settings, output, selects, trash, etc).

Thanks!

[Phil Indeblanc]

Really? No answer?  Is it that simple or not possible?

bump :-)

[Doug Peterson]

A raw file edited in Capture One has it's settings stored in a [Capture One / Settings] folder wherever the raw file is.

If you move or rename the raw file outside of Capture One without moving/renaming the settings file (.cos) then the adjustments you've made in Capture One to the raw file will be disassociated with the raw file. So if you open C1, crop a file and make it b+w, close C1, move the file, reopen C1 and browse to it's new location you'll see the raw file, but it will be unadjusted.

Simple answer is: move/rename the file from within Capture One (just drag and drop the file inside of Capture One from wherever it is to wherever you want it to be using the Library tool). When you do so Capture One will move/rename the associated settings file.

Two other answers that probably aren't appropriate for your current workflow are using EIP format and a Catalog (rather than a Session).

Note that if you don't care about the settings (you don't mind losing the adjustments to the raw you've made in C1) then you can do whatever you want.

[Phil Indeblanc]

Thank you Doug!