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Author Topic: Mac "Big Iron" rumors  (Read 43532 times)

ziocan

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #40 on: June 12, 2012, 03:01:36 am »

Why does anybody need support for a desktop computer is hard to believe.
most of you guys are plenty tech savvy.
when something breaks, which is rare, you just replace the part.

i do not have an hackintosh, only genuine macs, but i can see how some people are comfortable using one.
I actually know a few who do use it successfully fr high end editing and PS work.
I have visited the Tony mac site a few times and it seems that building one is fairly straightforward.
plus when you buy the parts for building one, they all come with a minimum of 3 years warranty. that sound almost as apple care.

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hjulenissen

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #41 on: June 12, 2012, 03:08:15 am »

Not having to use a crappy screen that is better suited to doing one's make up than professional graphics work is the most obvious reason, not to mention that I use dual [and identical] monitors. I also have 6 hard drives in the machine and another 4 'internal' drives via an eSata card and will probably add another 4. Which probably works out cheaper than getting an iMac and adding expensive thunderbolt HDs, if you can even find ones you want. Not LaCie for example.
Did you consider using network attached storage? For a photographer, I would think that the security of RAID and additional backup would be even more important than the "access anywhere" property of such systems.

I have a mixture of stationary and laptop, mac and PCs. When working in any one application I don't think that the choice of OS matters that much. Some quirks with mouse buttons and keyboard shortcuts, and you are good to go.

-h
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jjj

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #42 on: June 12, 2012, 03:12:31 am »

Why does anybody need support for a desktop computer is hard to believe.
most of you guys are plenty tech savvy.
when something breaks, which is rare, you just replace the part.
Because when something goes wrong with computers finding the fault can be a complete and utter bitch. I had a flakey PC I put together some years back and eventually discovered a dodgy IDE cable caused all the problems. All my Apple kit bar my Nano has had to go back to Apple store for numerous reasons and although they certainly do not 'just work' as advertised, the aftersales is very, very good.
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jjj

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #43 on: June 12, 2012, 03:15:48 am »

Did you consider using network attached storage? For a photographer, I would think that the security of RAID and additional backup would be even more important than the "access anywhere" property of such systems.

Did you not consider that I already use RAID and have back up too? ;)
Beisdes LR does not run off the Network and the catalogue/previews are not on my Mac HD.
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hjulenissen

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #44 on: June 12, 2012, 04:02:22 am »

Did you not consider that I already use RAID and have back up too? ;)
It seems to me that you argue against laptops with:
1. You need a large amount of storage/drives
2. Thunderbolt HDs are expensive.

My suggestion was to get a NAS. Does a NAS + a MBP not fit with your requirements?
Quote from: jjj
I also have 6 hard drives in the machine and another 4 'internal' drives via an eSata card and will probably add another 4. Which probably works out cheaper than getting an iMac and adding expensive thunderbolt HDs, if you can even find ones you want. Not LaCie for example.
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graeme

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #45 on: June 12, 2012, 04:47:08 am »

Just out of interest, what does a Mac Pro do for you that a top of the line iMac doesn't? I run a Mac Pro at work - it's a couple of years old, as are most, I guess - and have a fully specced 27" iMac at home. My iMac far outperforms my work Mac Pro and is just as flexible as far as my needs go (as a part time photographer at home - I'm a web developer by day). This is a genuine question - what do you need from a Mac Pro that an iMac can't provide?

When my 2007 Mac Pros' main hard drive started malfunctioning recently I replaced it in 15 minutes. When a friends' 2007 iMacs' hard drive started malfunctioning recently it had to be sent away to have the drive replaced ( at much greater expense ). The Pro is much more convenient than an iMac in the sense that you can have 4 hard drives ( boot, files, PS scratch and a nice big Time Machine disc ) all packaged up in a neat beautifully cooled box which you can forget about: No ejecting external drives before you shut down - what's that all about?

Not interested in NAS or Hackintoshes - no disrespect to anyone using them, the Pro suits my needs I just don't want to spend any more time messing around with computer hardware. ( The software gives me enough headaches ).

I want to squeeze another year or two out of my Mac. If an all in one is the only Mac option available after that I'll replace it with a PC.

Regards

Graeme
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #46 on: June 12, 2012, 04:52:27 am »

Why does anybody need support for a desktop computer is hard to believe.
most of you guys are plenty tech savvy.
when something breaks, which is rare, you just replace the part.

i do not have an hackintosh, only genuine macs, but i can see how some people are comfortable using one.

plus when you buy the parts for building one, they all come with a minimum of 3 years warranty. that sound almost as apple care.

How about
- The time needed to debug?
- The possibility that at any point of time Apple might find a way to prevent OSX from installing on non Apple H/W?
- Possible compatibility issues between some H/W and OSX (lack of drivers,...)?
- The time needed to put together in the first place a machine that is silent, reliable and flaw free accross a wide range of scenarios and while using various peripherals?
- ...

Frankly, I see zero value of going through that on OSX. If you want to tinker, go Windows. Win7 is designed from the ground to deal with non certified H/W while OSX is absolutely not.

Cheers,
Bernard


« Last Edit: June 12, 2012, 07:20:44 am by BernardLanguillier »
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Farmer

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #47 on: June 12, 2012, 07:19:25 am »

Regarding Hackintosh, there's also the small issue of it being a violation of the licence terms.  Not everyone (particularly those running a business) is prepared to risk legal issues.
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Phil Brown

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #48 on: June 12, 2012, 08:11:28 am »

According to some sources like the french hardmac.com :
"
According to David Pogue, who is often well informed, the Mac Pro is not dead, new models are under way and will be released in 2013. Same thing for the iMac.
It's not much but it's probably enough to give back a little bit of hope to all pro customers that fear the disappearance of the Mac Pro, especially if you add to that the answer that Tim Cook provided to a worried customer who inquired about the Mac Pro:
Our pro customers are really important to us...don't worry as we're working on something really great for later next year."
"

So perhaps there is some light at the end of the tunnel- still, if it is true, it is not very professional to do upgrades that slow

Other sources claim Apple simply had to put in new processors because the old ones are not produced anymore....  so this also says something about the slow upgrade policy of Apple...

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mediumcool

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #49 on: June 12, 2012, 08:27:11 am »

Correct me if I am wrong, but I understand that Apple uses logic boards from Intel for the Mac Pro. Are boards incl. TB and USB3 that are suitable for a Mac Pro available yet?
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Craig Lamson

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #50 on: June 12, 2012, 10:06:35 am »

Correct me if I am wrong, but I understand that Apple uses logic boards from Intel for the Mac Pro. Are boards incl. TB and USB3 that are suitable for a Mac Pro available yet?

We are just starting to see the major board manufacturers offering IvyBridge boards with Thunderbolt...very recent.
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Craig Lamson

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #51 on: June 12, 2012, 02:37:31 pm »

HP should be able to provide support as well. Besides Sony, NEC, Fujitsu,... and many other companies do provide support to their customers still.

Cheers,
Bernard


For what its worth...

http://www.pcworld.com/article/244481/desktop_pc_reliability_and_satisfaction_dell_and_hp_home_pcs_get_poor_grades.html
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jjj

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #52 on: June 12, 2012, 05:00:46 pm »

It seems to me that you argue against laptops with:
1. You need a large amount of storage/drives
2. Thunderbolt HDs are expensive.

My suggestion was to get a NAS. Does a NAS + a MBP not fit with your requirements?
I have a MBP and I also have a NAS as well as lots of internal HDs.
MBP is OK when out and about, but not as nice or as fast to use as my MP.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #53 on: June 12, 2012, 06:18:22 pm »

For those who decide to believe and can afford to wait one year, this may be good news:

http://www.macworld.com/article/1167247/cook_apple_planning_professional_mac_for_2013.html

Cheers,
Bernard

Chris_Brown

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #54 on: June 13, 2012, 08:22:54 am »

http://www.macworld.com/article/1167247/cook_apple_planning_professional_mac_for_2013.html

This is great news! Let's hope it sticks.

I suspect they'll have USB 3.0 and Thunderbolt connectivity. And hopefully retain FW800 for those of us with legacy hardware.
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Ellis Vener

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #55 on: June 13, 2012, 01:12:03 pm »

I also saw in the keynote that Cook said an FW800 to Thunderbolt adapter is on the way.
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John.Murray

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #56 on: June 13, 2012, 07:16:50 pm »

Although a hackintosh sounds like a great idea - it is in violation of Apple's license agreement.  I don't think anyone offering professional services would be prudent putting themselves in that position, I certainly won't.....
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John.Murray

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #57 on: June 13, 2012, 07:26:35 pm »

Correct me if I am wrong, but I understand that Apple uses logic boards from Intel for the Mac Pro. Are boards incl. TB and USB3 that are suitable for a Mac Pro available yet?

Form factor is different, not ATX or eATX - even the power supply connectors are non-standard
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Steve Weldon

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #58 on: June 14, 2012, 01:08:36 pm »

Why does anybody need support for a desktop computer is hard to believe.
most of you guys are plenty tech savvy.
when something breaks, which is rare, you just replace the part.

i do not have an hackintosh, only genuine macs, but i can see how some people are comfortable using one.
I actually know a few who do use it successfully fr high end editing and PS work.
I have visited the Tony mac site a few times and it seems that building one is fairly straightforward.
plus when you buy the parts for building one, they all come with a minimum of 3 years warranty. that sound almost as apple care.



1.  I used to think this.  With computers being so easy to work with I found it hard to imagine others didn't find it as easy.  And then I realized I'd been on the first wave of PC's from way back so what was easy for me isn't easy for others.  I paid a big chunk of my way through college by offering custom PC builds along with set up and a few hours of instruction.  When I first started it was aimed at students and I was surprised when my main client based turned out to be professors and other academics.  This was my first exposure to people who just wanted a computer to work and to not think about anything else.  They wanted to put it in simple terms like "I want the latest best computer but not extreme" and then to trust the person building it for them to give them just that.

This is basically what people have been doing with Dell, HP, etc.. for years.  They catch a few buzzwords like "Pentium" and "VGA" and figure if their computer has these things then the rest of it must be good too.  But many have found out the "service" is lacking and that they really can't trust these companies to act in their (the customers) best interest.

So.. a career and a half later.. here I am offering custom build PC's.  Again.  Except now my clients are photographers and most recently day-traders who want 10+ screen configs.  Same mindset though "give me the latest and greatest but don't go overboard"  or  "go overboard, money is no object.."   I started off doing this for one workshop client as a favor, he told someone else who told someone else, and it didn't take long to turn it into a rather profitable use of my time.

I think what brings most of these clients to me.. is trust.  They've learned through years of experience the Dell, HP, etc, isn't their friend.  They think I am.  What I really am is 100% honest with them, even if I know I'll loose a client.  So it works.  They want someone else to think about the design, build it, and in some cases to set it up.  And they really like having someone a phone call away which has turned into extra income.

When I move back to Thailand in a few years I'm seriously thinking about offering a concierge service and corning the day-trader market.  These guys have a host of issues they're dealing with operating from their locations in a third world country, and most that I've met are really good at figuring out that even if they're tech savvy, their time is more profitable trading than it is fixing PC's.  Plus I've found I like these guys, mostly independent self-sufficient folks with a quick mind and who grasp the obvious faster than the average bear.  I've had more than a few offer to put me on "retainer" already.. they know it can break, but when it does they want the best insurance.  Me.

So ya, there is a lot of room for support services in the PC/Mac world.  And there are people more than willing to pay for real support they can count on.    Other companies have tried it with "gold support" type services, often charging $500 or more for a three year period. but they haven't got it yet.  The people willing to pay $500 and a lot more.. want to know the first name of the guy who fixes their computer (and his phone number).. When they need a custom workstation on their new 50 foot boat, or their vacation home set up, or what equipment is needed to get the most out of the area they operate in.. they do not want to call a company and talk to a guy earning $10 a hour for reading prompts from his screen to customers, and always get a new guy every time they call.  They really want their concierge computer guy.  I'm constantly surprised by just how much they're willing to pay for this service.  To them it's money well spent.


2.  They are.  And I don't think Steve Job's will be knocking on anyone's door mentioning the EULA's.. Assuming everyone actually owns the software they're operating with I just don't see enforcement happening.  First, I don't think it's high on their list of priorities or even on the top 1000.. and second, it would be extremely costly to learn just who decided to build and use their own Hackentosh.. what will they do, bug your phone?  Just don't see it.. 

I know the Mac guys want to think their hardware is special, and that Apple somehow buys their components from the same guy selling magic beans, or the electronics have some design edge that makes them special.. but they don't.  Apple learned (finally) that PC hardware was pretty damn good, and because there was such a huge market cheap too.  And by using Intel they could put all their resources into design (pretty boxes).  And marketing.  Their marketing is superb, the fanboy base is huge and they're dedicated.  The masters of Kool-aid..   
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lfeagan

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Re: Mac "Big Iron" rumors
« Reply #59 on: June 14, 2012, 11:43:38 pm »

Indeed, Apple is not going to come after any individuals building a hackintosh for their personal use using a paid-for copy of OS X. (Companies build them en-masse is another matter). Ignoring the legal issues, it would generate a fair bit of negative PR. Secondly, the court filing fees alone which are typically around $300, would add up rather quickly. Their damages would likely be the cost of the software (so, pay $300 to get $30 back = not a smart move). In terms of what actions they can actually take, as opposed to what the EULA claims they can do (which often times leads one to believe they can hold your first born child hostage), it likely would boil down to removal of the software from your system and forfeiting the media to Apple. On the whole, not such a big deal. Besides, they aren't going to do this. Hackintoshes simply do not impact them financially in any significant way as nearly all of the people who build them would not have ever purchased Apple hardware. They are generally built as a low-cost alternative, often times in a dual boot scenario to tinker with OS X while keeping Windows for gaming.

I have a hackintosh built from SuperMicro server components and am quite happy with it. It is far from low-end. Any notion that Apple has some special ability to make more reliable parts than other manufacturers targeting the workstation/server markets is untrue. Like most things with computers, it is all about how much you want to pay. If you buy a $50 motherboard it will not have the same features or thoughtfulness to its design and components used as a $400 motherboard.
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