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Author Topic: Without Prejudice  (Read 477939 times)

WalterEG

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #520 on: November 12, 2011, 02:13:07 pm »

Thank you gentlemen for your kind and interesting words,

Film indeed Rob - 4x5 T-Max 400.

I am not sure, exactly, as to the censorship rules on this site and so I played safe by a couple of nudes for when you are not having a nude.

I'll push the envelope with another pair (8x10s this time):

« Last Edit: November 12, 2011, 02:14:39 pm by WalterEG »
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #521 on: November 12, 2011, 02:35:07 pm »

I'm not sure whether there really is any specific rule about nudes; I'd imagine it to be very difficult to arrange, because all these judgements are so subjective. I do recall Michael once posted a b/w (I think) shot of two girls getting rather close; it caused some anger in certain circles, but I seem to remember that the solution was self-motivated: the offended party left the scene. Which is fair enough.

I'd imagine that the best guide to this is the thought that if you wouldn't mind your wife/girlfriend/boyfriend/mother seeing it, then it's probably okay! I accept that some relatives are weird.

Anyway, I'm sure that the images would be pulled by Admin. if they caused real concern, which I doubt these will.

Rob C

P.S. Just ran a test print of a colour shot. After so much time not printing anything, I found the process and the look of paper prints to be rather a disappointment. I wonder if it's possible to turn into a totally virtual photographer? Close to being in love with the lightbox, if you see what I mean.

« Last Edit: November 12, 2011, 02:40:19 pm by Rob C »
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Jeremy Roussak

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #522 on: November 13, 2011, 03:39:05 am »

I am not sure, exactly, as to the censorship rules on this site and so I played safe by a couple of nudes for when you are not having a nude.
I don't think there's a firm policy: have a look at Michael Ezra's posts. They are nudes but I defy anyone to find them pornographic: they are art.

Jeremy
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #523 on: November 13, 2011, 06:09:54 am »

"They are art."

Ah, Jeremy! That's something that I have been thinking a lot about lately; I don't mean Ezra in particular, just the entire photographic oeuvre and how it fits within this vague definition of stuff that gets defined as such.

In fact, having observed a large number of documentaries on various painters, including, quite recently, da Vinci, I am being drawn ever closer to the conclusion that 'art' doesn't exist at all, that it's nothing but a fabricated definition for things that are, in general, perfectly useless but nonetheless pleasing to one or two of the senses. Do nimble fingers create art?

Hanging off this thought are the various genres within photography seen across this website and others. Broadly, it's about various forms of landscape, peoplescape, news and practically anything else at which you can point a camera, but where the art?

We like to soothe ourselves with claims to having a grand eye, an enquiring mind and an acute sense of observation of the passing world and even, where possible, of the past via nostalgia (one of my own addictions). But art? Really? It seems to me that perhaps, if there actually is art, then it resides in music by virtue of it being unseen, lives in the mind, is wholly pervasive and able to cross time and distance at the flick of a switch. How else can one be transported back to the 50s, 60s or any other time that was personally important? Yes, the movies, but even there the accent comes from the soundtrack without which even the Detroit chrome loses some of its glow. Speaking of which, perhaps the car, just a mechanical buggy that has, however, come to represent so much more to its owners (and to those who see it) is another emblem of grand design and, at times, a higher art?

The suspicion is that we are in a state far from grace; that we grasp at anything in the wan hope of finding salvation from both ourselves and the very nature of life.

Rob C

Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #524 on: November 14, 2011, 10:14:03 am »

"P.S. Just ran a test print of a colour shot. After so much time not printing anything, I found the process and the look of paper prints to be rather a disappointment. I wonder if it's possible to turn into a totally virtual photographer? Close to being in love with the lightbox, if you see what I mean."

I used to scan the occasional Reader's Digest in the late 40s/early 50s... in the spirit of their Quotable Quotes, I reference my rash comment of a day or two ago.

In the event, the print worked very well indeed, gaining much when it was safely stored within its crystal archival sleeve! Does anyone know, first-hand, of a glossy paper that works well with the HP B9180 printer and its pigment inks? Difficult combination, I know, but no way I seek another printer. I think Michael has one such machine in his attic...

Anyway, I risk enclosure of another couple of shots that the Tourist Board wouldn't think of buying, which means they must have merit if only because of that.

Rob C
« Last Edit: November 21, 2011, 09:30:50 am by Rob C »
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Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #525 on: November 14, 2011, 02:05:43 pm »

Given that this thread (and some other posts in the forum) meandered recently into "what's art" debate, allow me to contribute my own artwork (or "artwork"), aptly named:

An Eye for Art

A bison, refreshing in the Yellowstone lake, appears to admire an impromptu stone sculpture:


An Eye for Art by Slobodan Blagojevic, on Flickr

You see, even a bison "gets it"  ;)




 

RSL

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #526 on: November 14, 2011, 02:12:15 pm »

Splendid, Slobodan. You should be doing installations. Stuff the bison, build the rockpile, put the whole thing in a tub of water, and you've got another modern museum winner sure to sell in the millions.
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #527 on: November 14, 2011, 02:17:54 pm »

And all I see is another bullfight...

;-)

Rob C

Riaan van Wyk

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #528 on: November 17, 2011, 02:21:19 pm »

Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #529 on: November 19, 2011, 05:18:17 pm »

Don't always rain on the plain, in Spain.

Rob C
« Last Edit: November 24, 2011, 04:47:18 pm by Rob C »
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RSL

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #530 on: November 19, 2011, 06:01:16 pm »

Fine shot, Rob. And there's the hand of man right in the middle of the bay.
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Jeremy Roussak

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #531 on: November 19, 2011, 06:41:39 pm »

In fact, having observed a large number of documentaries on various painters, including, quite recently, da Vinci, I am being drawn ever closer to the conclusion that 'art' doesn't exist at all, that it's nothing but a fabricated definition for things that are, in general, perfectly useless but nonetheless pleasing to one or two of the senses. Do nimble fingers create art?
My own view, for what that's worth (since I'm not an artist, despite my pretentions) is that something nimble, other than the mind, has to create art; there has to be some skill as well as some vision. Otherwise, we have at best philosophy and at worst, simple self-aggrandisement. The idea that something is art because an "artist" says it's art seems to me to be no less absurd than the idea that potato peel is toast because a "cook" says it's toast.

I find the elaborate explanations from artists of what their installations mean and are meant to convey almost as absurd as the extensions of those interpretations by critics. Of course, it could be simply that I'm too aesthetically challenged or simply too stupid to understand why an unmade bed, or a shark in formaldehyde, or a few pieces of wood and a bit of brownish paint, carry any significance, or should inspire in me anything other than open-mouthed admiration for the confidence trickster who's made himself (or herself) rich by peddling what seems to me to be worthless garbage.

Knowledge of background, of intent, of the artist's thoughts (if any) might enhance or augment my appreciation of a work but if the work itself can't speak to me unaugmented, it has no voice worth hearing. Before a performance of Shostakovich's fifth symphony recently the conductor spoke about the work, pointing out how it had been influenced by Carmen and how it quoted from that opera's themes. I thought I knew the symphony well - and I love it very much indeed - but this was entirely new to me and I heard that performance in a new way. However, it didn't need that explanation to move me greatly.

I've drifted off whatever the topic was. Too much wine, allowing my inner Philistine to break through, perhaps.

Jeremy
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #532 on: November 20, 2011, 04:25:39 am »

Fine shot, Rob. And there's the hand of man right in the middle of the bay.



Thanks, Russ, and yes, it's that that attracted my making the exposure at all. The same weather was all around, but only with some other sort of focal centre than the clouds did it make any sort of sense.

I've stated before that I usually - almost always - see landscape as backdrop to a model; that's probably why I'm willing, out of desperation, to swap that for the 'hand of man' in the manner of one of his constructs!

Without the human element, there seems little sense to it, not a lot more than documentation of God's artistry rather than one's own; as for the taboo about graven images, I believe that's just misreporting by the artistically challenged: why would God want us to refrain from exercising his given abilities to admire/create beauty? It's one more thing that makes us human, though I can't really speak on behalf of the other species, as none of us really knows the truth about how they perceive things.

Jeremy - yes, you share my position; I've always felt the art of the Saatchi school/collection to be about money rather than a lot else. I'm willing to be wrong about that, and could I have afforded to so do, I may also have indulged in the buying and selling of the stuff as a hedge against all sorts of financial woes that seem to surround us today and yesterday. In effect, it's the reason I believe that those large Teutonic photographs do so well...

Rob C
« Last Edit: November 20, 2011, 04:30:17 am by Rob C »
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Eric Myrvaagnes

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #533 on: November 20, 2011, 08:51:02 am »

I will readily grant that there are some situations in which the "hand of man" adds to the quality level of the image, and this is one of them.

Eric
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #534 on: November 20, 2011, 10:26:15 am »

I will readily grant that there are some situations in which the "hand of man" adds to the quality level of the image, and this is one of them.

Eric



Hmmm... Eric, are you referring to the little yacht or to the effects of global warming, in this instance?

Some warming of another sort, dear to my heart, is here: it symbolises the very last employed job that I had. I recall wandering down the streets of central Glasgow of a lunchtime with the other couple of guys who toiled there too, attempting to sound like that; the others were not bad, but I usually ended up just clicking my fingers. I wonder what they are doing now? Goodness, so very long ago...

http://youtu.be/GzNNE8JKX10

Rob C

Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #535 on: November 21, 2011, 12:58:04 pm »

I've just been struck by another thought: is there a power to weight ratio between viewings and resulting replies?

If you take the 'Trees' thread, there are currently .....530 posts per 44,844 readings (I trust!);

Take the 'Without Prejudice' one, and you get...........535 posts per 25,764 readings.

Does that indicate a third factor hiding in the bushes awaiting analysis?

Conveniently, time for an evening snack!

Rob C

popnfresh

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"Without Prejudice" should be its own category
« Reply #536 on: November 21, 2011, 03:06:24 pm »

Given the popularity of the "Without Prejudice" thread, and the fact that it's not for critiquing anyway, I think the Admin should make it a separate section within the Art of Photography forum. A place where people can just show off their latest work without inviting a barrage of criticism. Just my two cents.
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Eric Myrvaagnes

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Re: "Without Prejudice" should be its own category
« Reply #537 on: November 21, 2011, 09:46:29 pm »

Given the popularity of the "Without Prejudice" thread, and the fact that it's not for critiquing anyway, I think the Admin should make it a separate section within the Art of Photography forum. A place where people can just show off their latest work without inviting a barrage of criticism. Just my two cents.
Plus philosophical comments like Rob C's that aren't meant to praise or insult anyone or to start a technical battle or a "my ...'s better than your ..." type of remark.

Eric

P.S. and a special thanks to Rob C for seeing the need for this in the first place.
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #538 on: November 22, 2011, 06:00:43 pm »

Spent much time tonight watching BBC tv which has taken on a distinctly American flavour, what with Fry doing all the States (over several programmes) and then after that, a Bragg docu on Steinbeck.

I’m not sure Fry was the best choice for this, but I suspect it would be difficult for the writer to be displaced! On the one hand I enjoy some of his observations, but also, on the other, I feel he tends to be a little dismissive, somewhat too flip… whatever the truth, that’s one hell of a country out there! I suppose that credit should really be given to the unseen people who map/flesh out the story, the fixers behind the scenes who find the people and locations and create the canvasses upon which the ‘stars’ leave their mark.

I’m not sure how much I’d enjoy being out there in the wild in the company of wolves (literally, no puns intended), with just space and a tiny car. Neither am I sure how confident I’d feel stopping off in some of the small towns or, rather, ribbon developments that seem to make up a lot of the landscape. I guess that’s a hangover from Psycho and the many motel room murders that constitute much of film/tv drama. There’s always this feeling that one could just vanish without trace, victim of some impulse fun slaying or robbery gone wrong, though the latter would be most unlikely as I’m fairly sure I’d offer up all the visible worldies at first threat! Of course, a film team probably creates some safety in numbers, and even its own wall of craziness that might keep the possibilities of violence a little further away. Or maybe it might just offer the prospect of more to loot.

I remember a conversation I had with a designer who was responsible for a Mintex calendar shot out in the California desert; I recall him saying that it was rather a tense situation, shooting  vaguely dressed models in cars, motel carparks and in lonely locations out in the nowhere. There seemed to have been a constant sense of anxiety caused by the characters drifting around the places they worked… pin-ups and rednecks and bikers - explosive mixture, I’m sure!

Which reminds me: better take that reflex glass for another walk… maybe tomorrow.

Rob C

P.S. Which also reminds me of the problems associated with writing late at night when fatigue has already set in. The purpose of this note was to say, in fact, that the people who film these travel features seem to have a far keener, if not fresher, eye than do stills photographers. Or is it just a product of movement?  
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 03:49:39 am by Rob C »
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Rob C

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Re: Without Prejudice
« Reply #539 on: November 24, 2011, 04:51:38 pm »

Another shot of the Bay during the brewing of a storm that I managed to evade by the simple expedient of running away. Well, that's an exaggeration: I drove away.

Rob C
« Last Edit: November 28, 2011, 04:04:12 am by Rob C »
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