Calling All Digital Techs

[Esben]

Esben:

Let's just say you were the one to determine what back/software on a theoretical shoot, but it was fast MBP17/7200/mobile; not tower. Tethered, studio, client wants to tweak the contrast/WB/Hue as you're shooting, and see fast Previews, and wants it stable. No processing of the tiffs during the shoot; the only thing that matters is the capturing and the ease of the shoot, and watching the images come in. They might want to do things like compare one frame to another, later in the shoot, side by side. What's your overall first choice; what comes to mind first? In terms of the job, let's just say it's a portrait, or beauty. SKIN TONE ACCURACY is the main thing. Maybe the combo choices were:

* Aptus II-8, with LC 11.

* Phase P40+, with CaptureOne 5.

* H4d_40, with Phocus 2?

Thanks.

Gwhitf

I’m not going to put my head on anybody's chopping block         but the features you are asking for, are very elementary and all 3 will handle this scenario without any problems. Phase and Phocus will generate the jpegs faster than LC11.



Leaf has always manufactured very fast digital backs. The Aptus 54S is a fantastic back if you can live with the low ISO and 22mpix. I think it might still be the fastest DB around, with 70-76 frames per min. tethered. The software is rock solid and feels very lean. Its a great snappy feeling.  The same goes more or less for the Aptus 75S.


I’ve never used the P40+, but I would think that it would be very similar to the P65+ in regard to image quality.  I like all the features of C1 Pro. It’s the most feature rich application on the market. I just wish it was a bit more stable. On a side note, I wish that they haven’t charged me for the v.5 upgrade, when I’d just bought 2 more seats of v.4 a couple of months before they released v.5. - especially considering that v.4 never got anywhere close to being stable or considered as a final finished product. I understand that Phase needs to rush their versions in order to earn more money from all the users that bought v.3 with 2 free upgrades, but it left me with a very dissatisfied taste in my mouth.  I think they should have acted a little more like a US/international company and said; Hey, we know that v.4 was not perfect - here is a free upgrade for you guys that bought v.4 for full retail price. Secondly, I think they need to open a repair shop in the US. Shipping off your $36,000 DB to Denmark for repair is tedious. FedEx and UPS are not as commonly used as they are in the US. In fact, you rarely see them.  When I bought my first Leaf back, one of the main reasons was the stellar reputation of Leaf America and Rick Adshead, and the fact that they were located 30min north of NYC. Very conveniently, which is key in any professional operation. Being a Dane myself, I often get the feeling that Phase is too Danish in its attitude towards its US clients, but on the other hand, they make great products.


The high ISO files from the Hasselblad H4 40 seem very good, and combined with the new H4 body and the option of using the new HC 35-90mm zoom together with all the other great lenses, is a very strong combo.


In the end, if I were you, I would contact Doug and FotoCare in order to rent the backs for a real client shoot. If you fear a complete meltdown on the job, hire a tech (or I hear good things about BigCooter’s first assistant as well ;  ) for the day. He or she will also be able to answer so many more questions then I can write up in a post.




BJNY

Both the MBP 17” laptops released in 09 had a voltage of 9.93V. I haven’t yet got my hands on the latest MBP 17” from this year, but I would be surprised if anything has changed, since it seems to be just a CPU update.

[Guy Mancuso]

I have not seen any degradation on the Firewire port with the new MBP I have a 15 inch 2.66 I7 with 8 gbs of ram and two SSD drives. Right now with the loss of the express port I have a lot on the Firewire port. Drobo, External drive and card reader. All seem fine , I have yet to shoot tethered but will run it this week to be sure all is okay.

The P40+ is almost identical to the P65 + except for the crop and the image quality I find better than my old P25+, P30+ and a friends P45+. I'm dead serious you need to demo this back, it will do exactly what you are asking and than some. BTW it is faster than the P65+ in shooting speed. Use the newer CF cards and you won't hit a buffer even shooting hard. Tethered it is a dream with version 5 . Things have changed folks it is not what you have or what it used to be. Get some D lenses and I have yet to find one person not happy with the P40+ and our forum is loaded with P40+ users as well as here i would assume. Not to say the world is perfect but the improvements are much better shooting than the paper it is written on. I seriously doubted myself upgrading from the P30+ and tested the P40+ 3 times before I pulled the trigger. It's been better than I thought

[stewarthemley]

If your Phocus image browser is showing less then 25% enlargement, it will draw the information from the embedded jpeg in the raw file, but of course show the preview with the correct color look.
If you click on the file to show 25% or larger, it will render the information from the raw file.

But I think what you’re referring to is that the file first renders a little soft and then comes in sharp. This has to do with your computer and how fast it is.

No, what I'm referring to is the fact that the full size preview is not sharp, not on initial rendering, not ever. It only becomes sharp when you zoom in a little. It has absolutely nothing to do with computing power. If you're shooting tethered then you will have to zoom in on each and every shot to check for sharpness. It's a known shortcoming of Phocus and annoys quite a few users. Yes, it will show accurate color (depending on your settings and presets) but for checking sharpness/focus you will have to zoom in a little on each shot. I'm repeating that because it seems critical to the OP's needs.

[LynnNoah]

Use the newer CF cards and you won't hit a buffer even shooting hard.

Guy:  What card(s) do you find best for the P-40+?

Lynn

[gwhitf]

I’m not going to put my head on anybody's chopping block         but the features you are asking for, are very elementary and all 3 will handle this scenario without any problems.

Come on, Esben, it's just you and me sitting here drinking coffee, alone, in some diner on 8th Street. Who else would hear? Just whisper it in my ear.

You know that feeling when you're about to sit down at that Kart and start your workday? That feeling when you look over to the tripod, and you notice the camera body and corresponding back, and you think to yourself, "This day is gonna be a breeze -- error-free; fast; stable, effortless; and the files are going to look awesome".

Which body and back is on that tripod....?

And thanks for that other excellent information also, in your prior post. Thanks for the honesty.

[Guy Mancuso]

Guy:  What card(s) do you find best for the P-40+?

Lynn

I'm using the Sandisk Extreme 16gb 60MB/s . I would not use anything slower i did hit buffer doing a gig with fast shooting on some older 30mg cards. You can use the Pro Extremes also I believe but these are a good price and yet to hit buffer on them . More important solid as well. No issues

[jimgolden]

for me HxD hassie system w/phocus. works even better than my 5Dmk2...

[Esben]

No, what I'm referring to is the fact that the full size preview is not sharp, not on initial rendering, not ever. It only becomes sharp when you zoom in a little. It has absolutely nothing to do with computing power. If you're shooting tethered then you will have to zoom in on each and every shot to check for sharpness. It's a known shortcoming of Phocus and annoys quite a few users. Yes, it will show accurate color (depending on your settings and presets) but for checking sharpness/focus you will have to zoom in a little on each shot. I'm repeating that because it seems critical to the OP's needs.

Yes, you are correct: what I was trying to communicate, is that when Phocus renders a file from the embedded jpeg, the resolution will not be as sharp as when you render from the raw data. Without knowing, I would think Hasselblad chose to do so in order to speed up image browsing. Again, the file will render sharply when viewed larger than 25%, and less sharply, but more quickly, when viewed at less than 25%. Honestly, how much detail can you really see in a 50mpix file scaled down to 15% or less, on any monitor, whether the data is being drawn from the embedded jpeg or from the raw data?

I would think that If a photographer is working on only a few images on a job-to-job basis, like a still-life shooter does, then the unsharpness of the browser image, when viewed at less than 25% would/could be an annoyance. Otherwise,  if a photographer is working with hundreds or thousands of images a day, a quicker preview could be seen as a benefit.
Maybe a preference setting, similar to what you find in Bridge, could be a good idea - where you can choose the quality in which to render the preview.

P.S. You can browse your images while keeping the enlargement at 25%, to avoid to much clicking.

[David Grover / Capture One]

Yes, you are correct: what I was trying to communicate, is that when Phocus renders a file from the embedded jpeg, the resolution will not be as sharp as when you render from the raw data. Without knowing, I would think Hasselblad chose to do so in order to speed up image browsing. Again, the file will render sharply when viewed larger than 25%, and less sharply, but more quickly, when viewed at less than 25%. Honestly, how much detail can you really see in a 50mpix file scaled down to 15% or less, on any monitor, whether the data is being drawn from the embedded jpeg or from the raw data?

I would think that If a photographer is working on only a few images on a job-to-job basis, like a still-life shooter does, then the unsharpness of the browser image, when viewed at less than 25% would/could be an annoyance. Otherwise,  if a photographer is working with hundreds or thousands of images a day, a quicker preview could be seen as a benefit.
Maybe a preference setting, similar to what you find in Bridge, could be a good idea - where you can choose the quality in which to render the preview.

P.S. You can browse your images while keeping the enlargement at 25%, to avoid to much clicking.

In the next version of Phocus (currently in beta testing) the browser preview is much improved.  There is currently already a preference for preview size (check you are not set to small or medium if you are using a larger display) but in the next release there will be a further option for even larger previews!  This will also give you are fast JPEG output of more than 1500 pixels across.

Also in some cases the use of the distortion filter could also soften the preview a little.  This has also been corrected.

Earlier on in the year I conducted two sessions for a new Wet Hire company using Hasselblad.  A lot of the digital assistants on the books came from a Capture One background and had not had much exposure to Phocus.

While they were skeptical at first, after only a couple of hours induction we left them quietly impressed.  There are many features that they liked in the software, including the ability to export JPEG previews almost instantaneously.  Meta data support (IPTC), batch functions (especially renaming), The ability to save your workspace and export / import that on other machines, were all rated very highly.

It is also worth noting that as Phocus has no licensing, they were free to take copies with them and install multiple times, without the need for software keys and codes.

They were very impressed with the tethered capture speed which they thought would not be as good as Capture One.  Also being digital techs they tried to break the software, ie.  "While shooting tethered, try and do this, then export ten files, then adjust this one... and and... etc etc.

I also did a similar exercise at another London rental company considering more units so they assembled their digital assistants for a session.  One of the assistants always assumed that Capture One would be better at rescuing blown highlights - especially on over exposed skin.  I am happy to say he was proved wrong.

While I admit that Phocus V1 was someway behind a lot of the 'speed' features of Capture One, The current Phocus V2 and looking to the next release is a very different story.

David

[yaya]

Phase and Phocus will generate the jpegs faster than LC11.

Are you sure? The last time I've checked, 2,500pix FJEPGs were still much faster in LC11...

[stewarthemley]

David, thanks for your input. I'm glad the previews at full size are about to be sharp in Phocus.

As one of the main areas of concern when using a MFDB is getting the focus sharp (plenty of evidence from other threads in this forum!) I have always found it (being gentle and diplomatic here) surprising that you can't check this important aspect at full size. But when you can do this in Phocus I will save at least three steps in my workflow. On a batch of hundreds of files, that's worth having.

[David Grover / Capture One]

....surprising that you can't check this important aspect at full size. But when you can do this in Phocus I will save at least three steps in my workflow. On a batch of hundreds of files, that's worth having.

Can you explain what you mean exactly Stewart?

[stewarthemley]

Can you explain what you mean exactly Stewart?

Hi David. Happy to, but I'll preface my reply by saying that I have used Hasselblad for years now very happily, without many problems, either tethered or on location. Except for this deficiency in Phocus. (As I said, a view shared by quite a few users - hence your reply saying it would be sharpened up.)

Many people have problems getting focus right when using a MFDB. I certainly do. It seems to be hit and miss quite often even though we (me and all the others in threads on this forum) take great care to avoid this. Therefore, it's a required feature of any software that processes the files to allow you to check focus. And when you have many images to check, and a deadline that won't extend, you want to be able to check focus as quickly and easily as possible. You can't do that with the full size preview in Phocus without zooming in. If you disagree with that statement please 1) say so and 2) tell me (and a boatload of other users) how to do it.

Yes, I know if you zoom in you can get a sharper picture, or if you use the loupe feature you can check focus at 100%. But you can't get a sharp picture that allows you to check critical focus without doing that. And so my workflow when I have a lot of shots to check is to first load the files into Raw Developer, which gives an accurate and very sharp picture right away without any time-wasting fiddling, decide on the selects, and the rejects,  then go back to Phocus and work on the selects. Sometimes, alternatively, I will export the whole batch as jpgs then check for focus, etc, that way. But what I'd really like is to use Phocus to check focus!

Again, I'm not making these points facetiously. I like the cameras and Phocus but my comments were meant to help the OP make the right choice. Cheers.

[David Grover / Capture One]

Hi David. Happy to, but I'll preface my reply by saying that I have used Hasselblad for years now very happily, without many problems, either tethered or on location. Except for this deficiency in Phocus. (As I said, a view shared by quite a few users - hence your reply saying it would be sharpened up.)

Many people have problems getting focus right when using a MFDB. I certainly do. It seems to be hit and miss quite often even though we (me and all the others in threads on this forum) take great care to avoid this. Therefore, it's a required feature of any software that processes the files to allow you to check focus. And when you have many images to check, and a deadline that won't extend, you want to be able to check focus as quickly and easily as possible. You can't do that with the full size preview in Phocus without zooming in. If you disagree with that statement please 1) say so and 2) tell me (and a boatload of other users) how to do it.

Yes, I know if you zoom in you can get a sharper picture, or if you use the loupe feature you can check focus at 100%. But you can't get a sharp picture that allows you to check critical focus without doing that. And so my workflow when I have a lot of shots to check is to first load the files into Raw Developer, which gives an accurate and very sharp picture right away without any time-wasting fiddling, decide on the selects, and the rejects,  then go back to Phocus and work on the selects. Sometimes, alternatively, I will export the whole batch as jpgs then check for focus, etc, that way. But what I'd really like is to use Phocus to check focus!

Again, I'm not making these points facetiously. I like the cameras and Phocus but my comments were meant to help the OP make the right choice. Cheers.

Ok, I understand now.  

In the next version of Phocus (beta testing now) there is an addition to the preview size preference (embedded into the image on capture or import).  Currently there is small, medium and large.  Extra Large! will be added.

This will a) aid in judging focus on the preview  give you even larger Jpeg exports.

Also currently the distortion filter can soften the image a little, which is now corrected.

So good news for the future I feel.

David

[stewarthemley]

Hi David

Yes that's good news. Phocus is becoming a really useful program. I rate the shadow fill and recovery very highly. And the way it handles high ISO shots (re noise, etc) is impressive.

And thanks again for your participation here.

[Guy Mancuso]

Just for clarity sake and ignore the shot ( it's a throw away ) and i am also not tethered but point being in C1 you can have floating focus tools that you can have on main screen or on a second monitor which can be from 25 to 400 magnification and also as big or small as you want. Here it is just on one monitor but I can move the floating palettes anywhere you want and as many as you want. Now you can save this workspace and name it and when you go shoot a week from now you can have the same floating palettes setup. C1 the main preview always sharp without having to use any magnification tools. On a P40+ it takes around two seconds for a new shot to view in full preview. Also if I was tethered all the camera data would be showing with regards to settings and such. Again the floating palettes can also be a variety of things as well so your really only bound by screen real estate. But you can float any tool you want anywhere on screen. I may not have this many floating palettes myself but point being you are not limited that i know of on how many. Usually a digital tech would have one open floating palette fairly large at 100 percent on second screen right on the eyes of a model and letting you know you are hitting focus. They could just use there mouse to move image around also in the floating palette or right click and set to wherever the framing is and just move the box to that spot. That I can't do a screen grab of to show

[Guy Mancuso]

BTW just a side note since I touched on the new MBP laptops that I just got and I can confirm the speed increase in C1 for sure but here is some data on raw converters http://macperformanceguide.com/Reviews-Mac...ore_i7-Raw.html

It does not have Phocus in it but my bet is it got faster as well. I was pretty surprised by C1 myself something I was really hoping for and it worked out great. 30 percent is nothing to sneeze at

[Steve Hendrix]

It is also worth noting that as Phocus has no licensing, they were free to take copies with them and install multiple times, without the need for software keys and codes.



David

Phase One digital back users have no licensing issues, software keys or codes with Capture One either - just noting.  

Nor do Leaf Capture folks, nor do Sinar Exposure/CaptureShop lovers.... - just noting.  

In fact, no digital back software requires any codes or keys and all digital back software has unlimited licensing.


Steve Hendrix

[David Grover / Capture One]

Phase One digital back users have no licensing issues, software keys or codes with Capture One either - just noting.  

Nor do Leaf Capture folks, nor do Sinar Exposure/CaptureShop lovers.... - just noting.  

In fact, no digital back software requires any codes or keys and all digital back software has unlimited licensing.


Steve Hendrix

Can I get a full version of Capture One for free?  I didn't know that.

[Guy Mancuso]

You can certainly get a 30 day trial David. LOL