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Author Topic: Recent Professional Works  (Read 1612235 times)

haefnerphoto

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2900 on: February 26, 2011, 08:56:08 am »

What I'd like to ask Jim if you see that post, is that if you noticed in the case of car, that the differences in philosophy and design between the european market and the US require different solutions in the lightning and retouching.
The product esence is the same but not the envelope. Does that affect the way you think the pictures and the AD's needs?

What I try to do is define the vehicle.  There are a lot of different ways to approach the lighting to accomplish that and I don't have one that I use more often than another.  Quite often I'll light the car with kenoflos, then bring my flats in and light it with reflective light and then try some direct light too.  We then assemble the various captures that do the best job of defining the vehicle's shape.  Keep in mind that many times what you don't see is just as important as what you do see.  I think there is a difference between the styles of American and European photographers but then there are differences in style between every photographer.  I like European car design better than American for the most part and think that the manufacturers notice the difference too.  Both Ford and GM are bringing in European products and rebadging them for the American market.  Examples of this are the Ford Fiesta and Buick Regal, I sure there are others I've left out.  There are plenty of US designs I love and the American manufacturers in many segments of the market are producing vehicles that are now the industry standard.

In terms of the amount of post done on a car shot, I think that most photographers who don't work in advertising would find the amount of retouching to be far beyond what they've ever experienced in Photoshop.  The post work is reviewed by not only the agency now but the vehicles designers, as well as, brand managers etc.  It takes longer to retouch the image than to take it (by far).  I'm pretty digitally inclined and can accomplish what I think is necessary for my own work but because of the amount of time the process takes I rarely am involved in the post work after I turn over my assembled files (what I call director cuts). 

Jim
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Frank Doorhof

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2901 on: February 26, 2011, 11:55:43 am »

Thanks guys, sometimes I'm so glad I can play around a bit.
LOVE the look in your files BC, great "analogue" look if you know what I mean.
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fredjeang

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2902 on: February 26, 2011, 12:26:27 pm »

What I try to do is define the vehicle.  There are a lot of different ways to approach the lighting to accomplish that and I don't have one that I use more often than another.  Quite often I'll light the car with kenoflos, then bring my flats in and light it with reflective light and then try some direct light too.  We then assemble the various captures that do the best job of defining the vehicle's shape.  Keep in mind that many times what you don't see is just as important as what you do see.  I think there is a difference between the styles of American and European photographers but then there are differences in style between every photographer.  I like European car design better than American for the most part and think that the manufacturers notice the difference too.  Both Ford and GM are bringing in European products and rebadging them for the American market.  Examples of this are the Ford Fiesta and Buick Regal, I sure there are others I've left out.  There are plenty of US designs I love and the American manufacturers in many segments of the market are producing vehicles that are now the industry standard.

In terms of the amount of post done on a car shot, I think that most photographers who don't work in advertising would find the amount of retouching to be far beyond what they've ever experienced in Photoshop.  The post work is reviewed by not only the agency now but the vehicles designers, as well as, brand managers etc.  It takes longer to retouch the image than to take it (by far).  I'm pretty digitally inclined and can accomplish what I think is necessary for my own work but because of the amount of time the process takes I rarely am involved in the post work after I turn over my assembled files (what I call director cuts).  

Jim
Thanks for those lines Jim.

I also see the heavy retouching you describe in areas like fine arts. The last ARCO was cristal clear on that aspect. Tomorrow I finally have a personal shooting with a girl. It's been ages since I haven't got the time to focus on my personal work because the assisting is very demanding and for other peripherical reasons. The shooting in location will last about 6 hours and I do my best to get closer to what I have in mind with the lightning available and my current skills but I know right now that the post prod stage is gonna be by far the longuest in order to acheive the precise look I want. It will be dozens and dozens of layers, masks and preparing the files for the plotter. It's going to be at least a week of work because I do all by myself (because I can not yet delegate and supervised for a simple matter of cost).

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Patricia Sheley

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2903 on: February 26, 2011, 01:57:04 pm »

Fred
Leap your walls and fences!!! Bonnes chances!!!
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bcooter

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2904 on: February 26, 2011, 09:38:41 pm »



when you say double page from the Red, is it the file with the reso right out the box or an upsampling was needed (like with a Genuine Fractal kind of stuff)?



Fred,

Slightly uprezzed with photoshop, though RED Cine-x makes a still frame in 16 bit Tiffs and also makes a nice deep, rich frame.  Not as sharp as medium format, heck not as sharp and detailed as probably a Nikon D3, but you raise a subliminal question that most of us are already being asked to answer.

Sorry to take this off topic, but sometimes show and tell requires a little more tell.

Can a motion image be used or stills?  We'll obviously it can, but should we offer it, even try to compare a motion image from a camera like the RED to anything that is a dedicated still camera, medium format down to a 5d2?

I guess it depends on the use, or the image.

It's interesting that most of the large printed materials any of us get the opportunity to place our noses on and pixel stare are movie posters, and in-store fashion/cosmetic advertising.   I do it, most photographers I know do it to some extent and I find the results interesting.

Last night at a movie theatre, while waiting for my wife, I looked at about 8 posters.  7 of them looked like either still grabs or shot very high iso as noise/grain was very pronounced and even added to the image.  The one movie poster that was shot with a dedicated still camera and flash looked somewhat out of place, (though that poster was for a celebrity ensemble movie) and it was obvious that it was probably shot on different days to fit the talent's schedule.

Even comparing cosmetic advertising in the higher level retail stores, we've all seen some retouched images that were baby butt smooth and pin sharp, while others looked like they were shot from a section of a 4mpx camera.  Without knowing the specifics it's impossible to guess why, but the results are if the image is compelling, then the detail that everyone obsesses about on these forums is really not that important.  In fact now that we are marketing our own production, I find the RED frame grabs sometimes more relevant than the dedicated still images and we are working the still images to match the slight softness and grain of the RED instead of the other way around.


Though this screen shot is not a work of still photography art, at 26mb in it's 8bit natural state this will do quite well for some forms of publicity.
The subjects are not tack sharp due to shutter speed and panning, though in testing with the red going from a slightly frenetic 250th to a smooth 30th makes very little difference in the motion image.

But, back my original question, would I ever market the RED capture as a one size fits all camera, for stills and motion and that answer is probably not.  At least not for advertising.

But, do I think the time is coming where one camera will be able to capture a pristine still and motion image at the same time, though I do believe that will depend more on the orientation and format of the frame than any real technical advantage or disadvantage.

IMO

BC
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ChristopherBarrett

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2905 on: February 26, 2011, 10:08:37 pm »

Nice Dusk in Boston today... straight outta camera.

CB

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Abdulrahman Aljabri

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2906 on: February 26, 2011, 11:59:14 pm »

Nice Dusk in Boston today... straight outta camera.

CB



Beautiful especially for straight out of the camera. I think I am starting to understand why you take so many lights with you to a shoot. Are you aiming lights at many different areas and shadows to bring the overall luminosity of the scene to a consistent level?

« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 12:13:28 am by Abdulrahman Aljabri »
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MichaelEzra

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2907 on: February 27, 2011, 12:03:05 am »

Nice Dusk in Boston today... straight outta camera.

CB



Looks great!  Interesting to see this office, I wrote an e-Billing interface to these guys some time ago.
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fredjeang

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2908 on: February 27, 2011, 11:28:17 am »

...But, do I think the time is coming where one camera will be able to capture a pristine still and motion image at the same time, though I do believe that will depend more on the orientation and format of the frame than any real technical advantage or disadvantage.

IMO

BC
Thank you James.

Well, I do think that we are indeed very close to reach that point. It's just a matter of a few years and that is going to affect dramatically the "how". It may sounds like speculations but it's there, in its way and to be honest, I'm quite surprise to see that the photographic community is sort of doing the ostrich's politic because this is not a little change. Resistance, lack of interest, conservatism or whatever might be the reasons.

Will come the time that MF will propose dedicated video backs with 4K or more, systems like Red, new generation of Canons? But the needs are there in commercial. I have the feeling that this will not be the needs that will dictate the shape of the gear but the camera evolutions that will dictates the needs.

Cheers.

Some quick B&W convertions from a session in oct or november, can't remember. High isos (1600-3200) and I blowed the highlights on purpose. (no sharpening added on those pics, I rarely use extra capture sharpening)
first pic with the make-up artist is a reduced video frame right out the box appart from the convertion.
Second and third pics are snaps I did at the end of the session. Third pic is out of focus, but why should I be in focus?
The video is not ridiculous at all. We are not yet where I'd like the industry to be but it will come. But right now, if the first pic would have been done with a Red camera or an Arri (lucky-guys-I-want-one), it would have been much closer to the first still.

I'm not far from thinking that despite being obviously the still more clean and detailled, I prefer the render of the video still.

That bring also question BC pointed in between lines, because I'm asking (please do not misinterpretate me) if this race of details, DR, and all the circus is not in the end driving us towards a surgical kind of imagery. The video being extremely limited compared to the still is actually transmiting something more organic, vibrating, to a human scale. Closer to old fast film maybe.



« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 03:02:01 pm by fredjeang »
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Frank Doorhof

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2909 on: March 04, 2011, 03:57:41 pm »

Just having some fun.
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HarperPhotos

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2910 on: March 04, 2011, 07:47:20 pm »

Hello,

Did a fashion shoot the other day and decided to use the new Pocket Wizard Mini TT1 and 3 Flex TT5 units with Nikon SB900 flash units.

Shot over 500 images with my Nikon D3x and Sigma 100-300mm, these Pocket Wizards didn’t skip a beat the whole day with shutter speeds from 60th sec to 1000th sec.

Stats:

Nikon D3x camera
Sigma 100-300mm f4.0 Lens (150mm@F5.6)
Nikon SB900 with Pocket Wizard FlexTT5

Cheers

Simon

   
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Simon Harper
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feppe

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2911 on: March 04, 2011, 08:20:25 pm »

Hello,

Did a fashion shoot the other day and decided to use the new Pocket Wizard Mini TT1 and 3 Flex TT5 units with Nikon SB900 flash units.

She's positively glowing!

Dick Roadnight

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2912 on: March 05, 2011, 06:45:51 am »

Hello,

Did a fashion shoot the other day and decided to use the new Pocket Wizard Mini TT1 and 3 Flex TT5 units with Nikon SB900 flash units.

Shot over 500 images with my Nikon D3x and Sigma 100-300mm, these Pocket Wizards didn’t skip a beat the whole day with shutter speeds from 60th sec to 1000th sec.

Stats:

Nikon D3x camera
Sigma 100-300mm f4.0 Lens (150mm@F5.6)
Nikon SB900 with Pocket Wizard FlexTT5

Cheers

Simon

Hi, Simon.

Sigma and Nikon have come a log way in the last 40 years... or the lighting makes the most of the camera and lens.

The picture looks very low-contrast until blown up 100%.

I did not think that Sigmas or Nikons could resolve hair in a full-length portrait... or did you cheat fix in in PP? (the PP round the head and shoulders is quite evident.)

This might be enough to persuade some people not to bother with MF, but I have been thinking of doing high-res full length with shift-and stitch, using 2 P3s and 2 eShutters.
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bcooter

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2913 on: March 05, 2011, 10:43:12 am »

Fred,

This will be more information than you want.

My test for checking digital digital use to be if I could shoot a full length person in a standard magazine vertical format crop of 8 3/8" x 11" and read the detail in the eyelashes then I was fine.

The original 1ds did that, the next generations of Canons all did that.

Then as pixel count moved up I changed that standard to if I could shoot a full length person in a horizontal format and hold eyelash detail then that was fine.

The original 1ds sometimes got close, my 1ds3's do this well , the 5d2 really does it better, the p21+ does, the p31+ does easily, the aptus 22 did,  my Leica M8 uh sometimes, depending on focus.

Then the next thing I looked for was skin tone color.

The Phase's are very color sensitive and see almost every color and tonal change on a face, the Aptus was much nicer on skin, though nearly all faces go through some kind of photoshop work so that's not the most important thing in the world.  Actually the Phase backs hold so much color you can go almost anywhere with them, but I've always had to do some kind of paint to make corrections on their sensitivity.
This image is from the p31+ 

and took a little more correction than this image from a Canon that was shot during the same session.  Both were shot with tungsten.

Out of all the cameras I presently own, the best skin tones with studio profoto flash are 1.  Leica M8 (which is kind of strange because its not really made for studio flash),

2. my Canon 1ds3, then the brief time I tested a Hasselblad 39 #3.       With C-1 V6 skin tones for my phase backs is much better than the previous versions of c-1.

Nikon loaned me D3's that I used for a period that were great for low light though I always fought color, regardless of the color.   I found them very difficult to work, unless I was at very high iso.  Funny thing is they held detail well and hair would always look sharp, actually gave the impression of more sharpness than was actually there.

I was going to buy d3x's when they came out, but didn't because everything I owned still worked fine and I didn't like the fact that if you tether a D3x I believe the camera lcd goes blank and nearly all the new equipment we now buy is for motion.

I do know a good number of very good photographers that moved from medium format to the d3x's and are more than happy for commercial work, so I assume the D3x is probably the 35mm equivilent to medium format.

__________________________________________


In lenses all my contax 645 Zeiss lenses, 35, 45, 55, 120, 140, 210, hasselblad 110, are all razor sharp, the Canon 85 1.8 (non L) razor sharp, same with the canon 50 1.2 and the 35mm 1.4.  Most Nikors are sharp, with the 200 f2, steller, same with the sigma 50mm and with all the leicas, though I rarely if ever use anything but the 28mm on a leica.

On the Red I have a mess of lenses that all have different results.  The Zeiss 35mm is beautiful, the Nikon 14 to 70 is almost as sharp  http://ishotit.com/double_page_from_red.jpg   and very good for motion as it has very little breathing and no jump as you change focus.    I've tested the Zeiss Compact Primes vs the still primes and found no difference in sharpness and speed.

The only thing about the ziess still lenses on the RED is they are tiny and looks kind of funny,

but they work amazingly well are very smooth to track focus and the price is 1/2 of the compact primes.

But all in all most modern equipment is very, very good with few bad lenses or cameras unless you're micro viewing the corners.

As far as any real difference.  It's always subject, light, dependent and probably just how I feel the moment I push the button.  If I think it's pretty then "that's" the right equipment. 

Tomorrow it can all change.

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JoeKitchen

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2914 on: March 05, 2011, 11:25:49 am »

Now that's nice Chris!
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JoeKitchen

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2915 on: March 05, 2011, 11:31:13 am »

Here's a few from a recent shoot.  Not the highest budget design, but I had fun.  
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fredjeang

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2916 on: March 05, 2011, 11:39:41 am »

James,

Thank you very much for your post, as always very informative.

Thanks also for the beautiful images. Pic 2 is stunning and pic 3 is capture exactly at the perfect instant, the face expression of the talent is beautiful.

Interesting what you noticed about C1 #6. I still run the 5 saga and another upgrade did appears to me useless, it's good to know what's been gained.

The Zeiss lens on the Red pic looks totally disproportionate, almost a toy, I can imagine that they work brillantly.

What you point on the M8 is surprising, but I remember the testing you did here, pics in a Paris café and I was very delighted by the tones.

On the movie part, the old Takumars (the radioactive ones) primes are stunning.

Thank you for sharing your experience.

Cheers.
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haefnerphoto

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2917 on: March 05, 2011, 11:42:53 am »

Nice Dusk in Boston today... straight outta camera.

CB



Chris, Nicely done!!
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fredjeang

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2918 on: March 05, 2011, 12:40:32 pm »

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Michael Nelson

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Re: Recent Professional Works
« Reply #2919 on: March 05, 2011, 02:39:20 pm »

This is from my series of nudes, shot on film. RZ67 - Ektar color negative. Scanned with my ol' Umax PowerColor 3000.
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Michael Nelson
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