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Author Topic: New happy P30'er here  (Read 10814 times)

R_Medvid

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New happy P30'er here
« on: July 01, 2008, 07:05:38 pm »

Hi all,

Finally my refurbished P30 arrived to Kiev, Ukraine after more than 2 months of waiting (delivery in my country isn't exceptional   ) and I can share with you what I got. In the meantime while waiting I acquired used AFD body and a bunch of used lenses, so I rushed to try my new gear.

For the last 2-3 years I have used to rent a H1+P25 combo for my commercial work when needed. Against that experience, I have nothing bad to say about AF speed or image processing speed or ergonomics of my new Mamiya+Phase One. I like everything. I read about improvements in AFD II and AFD III here and there, but for now I'm fine with what I have.

Now about the quality of the images captured during a short field test:

  Well, that is something I could expect, this is a banned zone.



It also must be mentioned here that reasonable use of (local) sharpening and (local) contrasts makes the pictures technically amazing. Really.

So far my technical dream has come true. Now I'm eager to apply it in my next commercial project.

And I want to thank all of you, forum contributiors, for sharing your knowledge. During my looong waiting of the gear, I learned here a lot. Appreciate your open minds and warm hearts.
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Roman Medvid
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amsp

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« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2008, 07:19:31 pm »

High ISO performance has a lot to do with how you process the file in post, and in which program. Using C1 and the right settings is key with high ISO phase files, so you might want to play around with that before you dismiss it.
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samuel_js

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« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2008, 07:41:02 pm »

Your last (800 ISO) image is completely out of focus. Nothing to do with the ISO performance. 800 iso isn't banned zone at all.
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Graham Mitchell

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« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2008, 07:42:32 pm »

Two months? Must have been painful.
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R_Medvid

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« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2008, 03:27:55 am »

Quote
Two months? Must have been painful.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=204887\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Sure  
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Roman Medvid
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R_Medvid

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« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2008, 03:31:19 am »

Quote
Your last (800 ISO) image is completely out of focus. Nothing to do with the ISO performance. 800 iso isn't banned zone at all.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=204886\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Ok, I'll give ISO 800 a second try. But focused or non-focused, this picture demonstrates a lot of noise which is absolutely unacceptable for commercial photo. That's what I meant, not trying to downgrade the reputation of ISO 800 as it is in general )
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Roman Medvid
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etrump

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« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2008, 10:06:31 am »

I would agree with the ISO 800 being a little front focused.

Congrats on the P30, I used one for a few months while I waited on the P30+ production and really liked it.  The ISO performance on the P30+ is substantially better but if exposure and focus are there the ISO 800 looks pretty good on paper or downsized for web.

Did you sharpen these images?  

The 80mm shot looks very sharp while the 105-210mm seems a little soft.  I have found my 105-210mm a little on the soft side as well and was thinking about sending it for calibration.  Perhaps that lens is just a little soft in general.
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Ed Cooley
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R_Medvid

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« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2008, 12:07:10 pm »

Quote
Congrats on the P30...

Did you sharpen these images? 

The 80mm shot looks very sharp while the 105-210mm seems a little soft.  I have found my 105-210mm a little on the soft side as well and was thinking about sending it for calibration.  Perhaps that lens is just a little soft in general.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205002\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks.

No sharpening was applied whatsoever. When you apply sharpening, this 80mm 2.8 shot looks "scary" (quoting) sharp )))

I agree, 105-210 seems a bit soft wide open. I have two 105-210's, they both are....
« Last Edit: July 02, 2008, 12:10:28 pm by R_Medvid »
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Roman Medvid
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etrump

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« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2008, 02:50:26 pm »

Quote
Thanks.

No sharpening was applied whatsoever. When you apply sharpening, this 80mm 2.8 shot looks "scary" (quoting) sharp )))

I agree, 105-210 seems a bit soft wide open. I have two 105-210's, they both are....
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205013\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I have an 80mm on order this is good news.  

I am thinking about switching the 105-210mm out for the new 75-150mm but really not excited about losing the focal length.
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Ed Cooley
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R_Medvid

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« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2008, 03:10:27 pm »

Quote
I have an 80mm on order this is good news. 

I am thinking about switching the 105-210mm out for the new 75-150mm but really not excited about losing the focal length.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205044\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I was thinking about 75-150 but I constantly bump into bad news about this or that malfunctioning of the lens. Rare occasions, but still more often than about others.

Michael in his AFD III review mentions that. Here on the forum was a thread mentioning this. Myself was testing AFD II with all the lenses available at the local Ukrainian dealer -- 75-150 was the only lens which after a couple of shots disabled the shutter to work

I guess it's the firmware thing...  
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Roman Medvid
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Ken Doo

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« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2008, 10:19:30 pm »

Quote from: R_Medvid,Jul 1 2008, 04:05 PM
Finally my refurbished P30 arrived to Kiev, Ukraine after more than 2 months of waiting (delivery in my country isn't exceptional   )




When I ordered my Hartblei 45mm T/S Superrotator for my Mamiya----from your neck of the woods---it was delivered to me in California in about a week.

I just wanted to rub it in.

   


Congrats on your new camera and P30----it's a great set-up!

R_Medvid

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« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2008, 03:49:30 am »

Quote
Quote
Finally my refurbished P30 arrived to Kiev, Ukraine after more than 2 months of waiting (delivery in my country isn't exceptional   )

When I ordered my Hartblei 45mm T/S Superrotator for my Mamiya----from your neck of the woods---it was delivered to me in California in about a week.

I just wanted to rub it in.

   
Congrats on your new camera and P30----it's a great set-up!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205153\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I know, I know, we ship fast, but we are being shipped really slow

Thanks
« Last Edit: July 03, 2008, 03:51:50 am by R_Medvid »
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Roman Medvid
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etrump

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« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2008, 11:11:45 am »

Quote from: kdphotography,Jul 2 2008, 09:19 PM
Quote from: R_Medvid,Jul 1 2008, 04:05 PM
Finally my refurbished P30 arrived to Kiev, Ukraine after more than 2 months of waiting (delivery in my country isn't exceptional   )
When I ordered my Hartblei 45mm T/S Superrotator for my Mamiya----from your neck of the woods---it was delivered to me in California in about a week.

I just wanted to rub it in.

   
Congrats on your new camera and P30----it's a great set-up!
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205153\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


How did you do with the 45mm T/S?  I have heard it was too soft for serious work.
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Ed Cooley
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James R Russell

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« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2008, 12:32:56 pm »

Quote
How did you do with the 45mm T/S?  I have heard it was too soft for serious work.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205235\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I guess serious covers a lot of territory.

The Harteblei lenses are not pin point oh my god, Zeiss, Leica sharp but last time I looked in my official world photographe'rs handbook, I don't think that is always a necessary requirement.

If you shoot techical work, or landscape you probably won't like it, but for shooting faces, people, especailly with a classic view camera look it's beautiful.




In fact if my camera kits had not grown past the size of a grip truck I would buy every Kiev lens made with adapters for my Contax and use them for certain styles.

Not to really get off topic, but if you read these and other technically oriented forums you find that all people talk about is sharpness, detail and pixels and just because you can blow an image up to 200 % and stick your nose on the screen doesn't mean it makes the photo better or for that matter makes it anything other than detailed.

It's not that I don't like detail, or even work sometimes oversharpened for effect, but I can promise you I have few clients that look at the detail of a photo the way people on these and other forums do.

We have a series of work, shot a few years ago with an 8mpx Canon 1d-2 that has received a lot of acclaim and play through large books and posters and nobody I know of has walked over to a print and said, "where's the extra eyelash detail".





In fact this series was shot with a dcs 760 at 6mpx and I can promise you for a lot of projects I could still use that camera today and nobody would complain.




We all get caught up in this mostly because we all keep telling ourselves to get caught up in it.  11 to 18, to 21 to 31 to 39 mpx (probably going to 60) and we're told you just gotta have it, but trust me,  you don't just gotta have it, no matter what you shoot.

You may want it, you may even appreciate it, but you don't just gotta have it.

What a lot of photograhers gotta have, or better yet . . . want,  is cameras and lenses that let you get to a unique vision, or that don't keep you from doing what you want to do, that offer options in lenses and speed, software and file compatibiltiy  that allows you to process and deliver to deadline, even if your deadline is self imposed.

Everybody's different and my way works for me, (actually I don't really have one signular way I work), but even if I did, I'm aware that what I do won't work for everyone, but then again, I am also very, very aware what clients and even the genreal public looks at and rarely does anybody look at the megapixel count of an oversharpened pixel and get moved by the image.

Maybe that's why I'm pretty much non concerned about the H series being limited on a hasselblad only digital back.  From the moment I touched that camera I realized it only took one type of glass (well I know there is  a CF adapter) but basically unless it's a leaf shutter lense your limited, so the idea of a tilt shift, or some old pentax 6x7 lens is just not going to work and if you can keep your nose off the monitor and counting pixels, you'll really see some beauty in some of those old lenses.

I think Phase and the Mamiya have a great opportunity if they keep pushing the open format and not on the back end, but the front end.  Kiev, Pentax, Harteblei, Mamiya, Zeiss, and almost anything with an F stop ring should work on that camera.

If I was Phase I would show that camera on the front of the website with 5 different makes of lenses on it, but I guess if they did that somebody would post that they are making excuses for not have more Mamiya lenses. It's a shame a positive becomes such a negative so quick on the internet.

I think it's almost funny how we look at this stuff today.  Prior to digital it was the camera, lenses then the film/processing, usually in that order, but now it seems to be the tail is wagging the dog.

New isn't always better but a combination of old and new can be pretty cool.

JR
« Last Edit: July 03, 2008, 12:50:37 pm by James R Russell »
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etrump

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« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2008, 12:53:01 pm »

Quote
I guess serious covers a lot of territory.

The Harteblei lenses are not pin point oh my god, Zeiss, Leica sharp but last time I looked in my official world photographe'rs handbook, I don't think that is always a necessary requirement.

If you shoot techical work, or landscape you probably won't like it, but for shooting faces, people, especailly with a classic view camera look it's beautiful.




New isn't always better but a combination of old and new can be pretty cool.

JR
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205252\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Awesome photos. I am in love with the second one.

Regards,
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Ed Cooley
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Kumar

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« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2008, 01:21:58 pm »

Quote


New isn't always better but a combination of old and new can be pretty cool.

JR
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India? Old and new is India!

Cheers,
Kumar
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Bill Caulfeild-Browne

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« Reply #16 on: July 03, 2008, 10:16:31 pm »

Quote
I was thinking about 75-150 but I constantly bump into bad news about this or that malfunctioning of the lens. Rare occasions, but still more often than about others.

Michael in his AFD III review mentions that. Here on the forum was a thread mentioning this. Myself was testing AFD II with all the lenses available at the local Ukrainian dealer -- 75-150 was the only lens which after a couple of shots disabled the shutter to work

I guess it's the firmware thing... 
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=205051\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I have the 75-150 and it is clearly sharper than the 55-110 (mine was soft too) but I've had no firmware problems with it- not on the AFD II after the latest update, nor with the AFD III after four days of heavy use. (Mine is the one Michael borrowed in his test but as it has not acted up in either of my Mamiya's, I think it must be a glitch in the body he was using.)
Bill
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Bill Caulfeild-Browne

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« Reply #17 on: July 03, 2008, 10:20:06 pm »

Well said JR!
Bill
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Colorwave

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« Reply #18 on: July 03, 2008, 11:17:14 pm »

Gorgeous images, as always, James, and very well observed words as well.
Thanks for sharing,
Ron H.
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James R Russell

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« Reply #19 on: July 04, 2008, 02:24:35 am »

Quote
Gorgeous images, as always, James, and very well observed words as well.
Thanks for sharing,
Ron H.
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Thank you.

Keep in mind, I'm not suggesting any camera anyone uses is wrong, from Alex South's 8x10, to Salgado's Lecia, even to the guy that shoots catalog and needs 4 shots of perfect texture and color.

There is no wrong, but then again there is no reason to base a photograph only on it's technical merits, or how much detail it holds.

I shoot medium format as much as I can just because I like it, but then again somedays I just like other cameras so I shoot with them.

There is no right or wrong and I've had on line and off line comments from people that are just exactly sure I have some agenda to move to the world to some kind of pre conceived thinking.

That's just not my way, in fact that would be the very last thing I would like anyone to do.

I would like to see a world of more beautiful photographs and for this forum a lot more talk about work like Alex Soth's, over how many pixels we'll be offered to buy in the next year.

In fact I most often find the camera that seems traditionally wrong for a subject makes for more interesting photographs.

I shot this with a leica and a 28mm, something I'd usually not  think about doing for a beauty image, but it worked for me, for a lot of other photographers, they wouldn't like to do this.


 



JR
« Last Edit: July 04, 2008, 11:23:40 am by James R Russell »
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