Problem with Valeo 17 Fire Wire port

[Bernd B.]

I got "my" used Valeo 17 today. I wanted to test it with my Hasselblad 500. Didn´t work well. The Back didn`t release. First I checked the trigger cable from the lens to the back, but this was ok. The back connected to my old powerbook with Leaf Capture 8.4.6 as well as to my Mac Pro with Leaf Capture 10.0.4 and I could do configurations like speed, choose the directory for saving the .mos files and so on. But it wouldn´t release. When I connected a flash sync cable to the back the flash fired permanently. After a while I tried do push the (original) Fire Wire cable in the port of the back a bit in the one or the other direction. The back released a few times. I called Calumet in Duesseldorf to ask about the use of foreign (non Leaf certified) Fire Wire cables: that was ok, I just would have to cut a bit away off the socket of other cables, as the original ones are a bit slimmer. I gave it a try with a cable I normally use with an external HD, but it didn´t help, the back wouldn`t release. Finally I thought the error was a defective Fire Wire port of the back and I sent it back to the seller for a check.

Has anyone of you experienced something similar with a valeo? Is the Fire Wire port sensitive?

Thanks,

Bernd

[erikhillard]

What do you mean by "released" ??  Is that meaning released from the camera body?  Or does that mean a shot is recorded.

Most of the problems we encounter with Hassy 500 cameras are related to lens/back sync.  The cable from lens to DB must be in excellent shape and so does the sync connection on the lens.  DBs are very sensitive to this lens sync connection.  Did you try different lenses?

[Bernd B.]

What do you mean by "released" ??  Is that meaning released from the camera body?  Or does that mean a shot is recorded.

Most of the problems we encounter with Hassy 500 cameras are related to lens/back sync.  The cable from lens to DB must be in excellent shape and so does the sync connection on the lens.  DBs are very sensitive to this lens sync connection.  Did you try different lenses?
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Released means the back wouldn`t react at all when I released the camera. In the few cases I was successful the green light turned from green to orange and the software on the computer started to receive the picture. It seemed as if the back didn`t get the impulse from the lens. But I tried three lenses. I checked the connection cable between lens and back with a meassuring device. I twisted the cable in the pc socket of the lens and in the baby jack connection of the back. After that I checked the function of the cable again by leaving it connected to the lens and directly meassuring on the contacts of the little jack connector: the impulse must have been there.

The only few successful releases I got when I pushed the Fire Wire cable a bit in a certain direction.

The strangest thing happened when I connected the flash cable to the back: the flash started to fire permanently. Another version of this: I had the FireWire cable coming from the back not yet connected to the computer but the flash already connected to the back. When I connected the Wire Wire cable to the computer then the flash started to fire permanently (faster than one second intervallls). But most tests I did without flash.

The seller told me he tried it once again with his studio camera before sending it to me and that is was working without problems.

I sent it back to the seller for a check. But I liked the colors and the look of the only shot I kept so much that I definitely would like to buy it, if the problems could be solved.

[Dustbak]

As far as I can tell you are probably mixing two things.

1) Your strobes continuously firing when attached to the sync from the back. This problem/issue sounds familiar. I have had this with some of my strobes (Elinchrom RX). Even mentioned this last year on the Leaf forum. Sofar I have not been able to solve this. Fortunately the camera I use most often has its own sync out and I do not need to sync from the lenses. When using the 503 I use a different strobe that doesn't have this (Many times the Elinchrom FX).

2) Firewire port issue. Firewire has 6 pins, 4 of them are data and 2 of them are power (6pins version). When some of them would be not connected either the back doesn't start up or you loose your connection with Leaf Capture. Apparently neither of this is happening leading me to believe it is not the firewire port that is wrong. Stop wiggling the thing before you really break it.

3) Have you tried different versions of camera in the Leaf Capture software? Mostly I use the 'large format' setting in the software. This tends to work best. Some versions of the 500 when selected in Leaf Capture actually do not work that well.

My guess is that you have to search in that direction, certainly when you have already tried several lenses and sync cables.

My experience is that if the back starts, light is green, the thing is working. Period.

I have used, C-Most, Valeo11 and Aptus17.

[Rick_Allen]

You might want to give us a step by step of how you set-up the camera/back telling us what cables and when you connected them.

Do you have experience with this version of camera/back combo?

[Bernd B.]

As far as I can tell you are probably mixing two things.

1) Your strobes continuously firing when attached to the sync from the back. This problem/issue sounds familiar. I have had this with some of my strobes (Elinchrom RX). Even mentioned this last year on the Leaf forum. Sofar I have not been able to solve this. Fortunately the camera I use most often has its own sync out and I do not need to sync from the lenses. When using the 503 I use a different strobe that doesn't have this (Many times the Elinchrom FX).

Ok. I tried it only with a Balcar Jet 3200.

2) Firewire port issue. Firewire has 6 pins, 4 of them are data and 2 of them are power (6pins version). When some of them would be not connected either the back doesn't start up or you loose your connection with Leaf Capture. Apparently neither of this is happening leading me to believe it is not the firewire port that is wrong. Stop wiggling the thing before you really break it.

Ok. No more wiggling.

3) Have you tried different versions of camera in the Leaf Capture software? Mostly I use the 'large format' setting in the software. This tends to work best. Some versions of the 500 when selected in Leaf Capture actually do not work that well.

My guess is that you have to search in that direction, certainly when you have already tried several lenses and sync cables.

No, I haven`t tried anything else but "Hasselblad 500". If I had the thing still here I would try it, but I sent it back to the seller already. Now I wait, what he experienecs in his environment (=large format camera). Maybe I`ll drive the 200km to him and we try it together, using my Hasselblad.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate it. Wished the guy at Calumet yesterday would have gone so much in depth.

[Dustbak]

With the 500 you can also use the setting large format in the Leaf Capture software. You should drive the 200Km. Probably the guy you bought it from can show you some other stuff as well. It will be a cheap and fast way to get up to speed with the Valeo.

I consider their dealer network to be Leafs achilles heel in some countries.

[Bernd B.]

With the 500 you can also use the setting large format in the Leaf Capture software. You should drive the 200Km. Probably the guy you bought it from can show you some other stuff as well. It will be a cheap and fast way to get up to speed with the Valeo.

I consider their dealer network to be Leafs achilles heel in some countries.
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I think the purchase was within a difficult constellation: a people photographer working mostly on location buying a back from a stills photographer who never leaves the studio. There is not much knowledge to transfer. There are simply two completely different working profiles.

The guy at Calumet can`t be blamed as well, as he was just in between two sales conversations, when I finally got him on the phone (after calling five times within two hours). And: he hasn`t earned a cent in this deal, so he is not respondsable for anything. But I doubt his answer was different if I recently had bought the back from him.

After all I was a bit too exited about my first back to stay cool and wait for some help from here.

[Dustbak]

I work both on location as well as in the studio.

The Valeo is not the most ideal solution for a people photographer. I used it for people with the digital magazine. Route the firewire through your shirt and put the disk (magazine) in a pocket and you are more or less portable. I have worked this way for about 2 years.

When I bought the A17 it was a world of difference compared to the Valeo not so much in IQ but in ease of use.

You did get a digital magazine with your Valeo?

No worries about getting exited  Every time I buy a new back, I run into all sorts of trouble the first weeks. Even when buying the same brand of back.

[Bernd B.]

I work both on location as well as in the studio.

The Valeo is not the most ideal solution for a people photographer. I used it for people with the digital magazine. Route the firewire through your shirt and put the disk (magazine) in a pocket and you are more or less portable. I have worked this way for about 2 years.

When I bought the A17 it was a world of difference compared to the Valeo not so much in IQ but in ease of use.

You did get a digital magazine with your Valeo?
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No, I didn´t get a digital magazine. My budget is a bit limited. From an economical point it would be more reasonable to work with my 5D. But even if the rawshooter engine in PS CS3 changed things dramatically (colors from DPP and C1pro were a nightmare for me, profile editing helped a bit for portraits, but still the pictures looked flat) I`m looking for something different. I used to shoot with Pentax 67 for a long while and to process the stuff in my own color lab. Today there is hardly any magazine client whom I can still sell this. Now I`m looking for a way to bring the look of my Pentax 67 pictures into the digital world.

I want to find out if the valeo is the right thing for me. I payed EUR 3.500,- and think this is an acceptable price for an entrance in the world of MFDB. If I get along with the back I might look for a digital magazine and an Ipaq. A Hasselblad H-mounted Aptus 17 sold for EUR 5.300,- on ebay two months ago.

As I mentioned before the only picture I got from a sun lit wall on the opposite of my studio looks beautiful to me. Very film like. Appealing natural colors. I exposed it with ISO 100. The digital exposure meter reads -1,3 and I had to "push" it in ACR 4.1 until "0,75" (does that mean f-stops like in C1?)). There is still very very little noise visible.

[bclyde]

I got "my" used Valeo 17 today. I wanted to test it with my Hasselblad 500. Didn´t work well. The Back didn`t release. First I checked the trigger cable from the lens to the back, but this was ok. The back connected to my old powerbook with Leaf Capture 8.4.6 as well as to my Mac Pro with Leaf Capture 10.0.4 and I could do configurations like speed, choose the directory for saving the .mos files and so on. But it wouldn´t release. When I connected a flash sync cable to the back the flash fired permanently. After a while I tried do push the (original) Fire Wire cable in the port of the back a bit in the one or the other direction. The back released a few times. I called Calumet in Duesseldorf to ask about the use of foreign (non Leaf certified) Fire Wire cables: that was ok, I just would have to cut a bit away off the socket of other cables, as the original ones are a bit slimmer. I gave it a try with a cable I normally use with an external HD, but it didn´t help, the back wouldn`t release. Finally I thought the error was a defective Fire Wire port of the back and I sent it back to the seller for a check.

Has anyone of you experienced something similar with a valeo? Is the Fire Wire port sensitive?

Thanks,

Bernd :unsure:you need to used the hass 555 with this back
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[Bernd B.]

you need to used the hass 555 with this back
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No, you can use every Hassi 500. Dustbak told me to use "large format camera" as setting in Leaf Capture 8. That worked. No more connection problems since then. IT WASN´T A FIREWIRE PROBLEM AT ALL.

The next problem is focus accuracy: with my Acute Matte D screen I did some test shoots of people this weekend and they are all out of focus. It shot aperture open with CF80 and CF150. First I thought the Hasselblad lenses are not good enough but then I made a test with trial and error focussing with the powerbook next to me and once I had the focus pictures were incredibly sharp. Seems as if the Acute Matte D I bought as an occasion a year ago isn´t´ok. I took an older Acute Matte and got better results, but still have difficulties to focus if the point of interest was above the center with my old WLF. Will try to get a HM2 loupe finder for better focussing. I don´t use my PME45 at the moment as I doesn`t ease working precisely.

I feel like beeing a novice photographer who has to learn everthing from the beginning.

I got a digital magazine today, but without accus (otherwise complete). Does anybody know which camcoder accus will fit?

Will try to get an Ipaq 2210 this week and then try the "Leaf Portable Solution" with the DP-67 application.

[Dustbak]

You need to get Sony Videocam batteries. I will look in my closet to see whether I can get you the exact number. Replacement batteries will work fine. Try to get the big blocks (appr. 4000Mah). The Digital Magazine does draw quite a bit of juice.

Good to hear the 'problem' was as expected and is solved now. I am sure you will enjoy the Valeo.

BTW, you should be able to use LC11 as well.

Have a look at Iridient Raw Developer to develop your files. It does a great job on Leaf images.

[Bernd B.]

You need to get Sony Videocam batteries. I will look in my closet to see whether I can get you the exact number. Replacement batteries will work fine. Try to get the big blocks (appr. 4000Mah). The Digital Magazine does draw quite a bit of juice.

Good to hear the 'problem' was as expected and is solved now. I am sure you will enjoy the Valeo.

BTW, you should be able to use LC11 as well.

Have a look at Iridient Raw Developer to develop your files. It does a great job on Leaf images.
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Thanks a lot, I appreciate your helpful hints.

I couldn`t imagine a better back for my first steps into the world of MFDB. A pity to know that most of them are taken out of the market after trade in deals.

I planned to use ACR 4.1 for the Leaf files, because my first trials were good. Whats so special about Irident Raw Developer?

[Dustbak]

It is fast, it has a lot of possibilities, it also has similar profiles as LC, it renders skin very beautiful. Did I mention it is fast.

I use it very often for people. I use ACR for products (so I can run droplets and actions over the files).

Have you checked in on the Leaf forum?

[Bernd B.]

It is fast, it has a lot of possibilities, it also has similar profiles as LC, it renders skin very beautiful. Did I mention it is fast.

I use it very often for people. I use ACR for products (so I can run droplets and actions over the files).

Have you checked in on the Leaf forum?
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Yes, I finally checked in on the Leaf forum. I like it. There are lots of interesting points, especially for a beginner like me.

I´m ok with shooting in LC 8.4.6 and I´m pleased with developing in ACR 4.1 so I don´t try other software at the moment. The hardware problems are so bad (FOCUSSING with my 500 ELX), I want to get these things working first. My Acute Matte D (bought it used) seems to be misaligned and my non "D" Acute Matte is not so comfortable to work with.

Do you also take pictures of people with your 503? Open aperture? How does it work for you? Do you get the focus correctly with a prism finder or will you have to use the WLF?

I didn´t use my Hasselblad very much during the last years and when i did it, I used in in the studio stopped down. Now I try to copy my personal "open aperture" style I developped with Pentax 67 with a Hasselblad. I do´t know, if it will work.

[Dustbak]

I have severe difficulties focussing with the 503. The turn of the lens while focussing is large & it is very difficult to see where exactly the point of focus is. I don't use the 503 very often and when I do I have to concentrate really well to get it right. Wide open remains difficult.

I use my Digiflex II most of the time (about 80% of my work). Initially I found that difficult to manually focus as well but after some exercise am was able to consistently get it spot on. Even with f1.4 I can put the focal plane exactly where I want.

The DF with Zeiss ZF lenses is absolutely great and much easier to use than the 503. The DF is meant for 24x36 sensors but covers a bit more. On my Aptus 17 I got around 13MP in total (on the CF39 I get around 22MP). The rest of the image is a nice black border.

I planned to have the DF initially as a fun complementary system but it is so nice and easy to work with it became my primary body to use.

[Bernd B.]

I have severe difficulties focussing with the 503. The turn of the lens while focussing is large & it is very difficult to see where exactly the point of focus is. I don't use the 503 very often and when I do I have to concentrate really well to get it right. Wide open remains difficult.
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Do you use a prism or a WLF?

I probaly bought my back for the wrong camera system.  

I use my Digiflex II most of the time (about 80% of my work). Initially I found that difficult to manually focus as well but after some exercise am was able to consistently get it spot on. Even with f1.4 I can put the focal plane exactly where I want.

Sounds impressive. But: do you wear glasses? The finder of the Digiflex looks so small. I can´t imagine to see the whole finder image with my glasses.

The DF with Zeiss ZF lenses is absolutely great and much easier to use than the 503. The DF is meant for 24x36 sensors but covers a bit more. On my Aptus 17 I got around 13MP in total (on the CF39 I get around 22MP). The rest of the image is a nice black border.

I planned to have the DF initially as a fun complementary system but it is so nice and easy to work with it became my primary body to use.
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What´s the price of a digiflex? I´ve got more than 20 Nikon lenses here. I should go somewhere to play a little with it.

Next week I´ll hopefully get my adapter (calumet clearance) to mount the valeo to my RZ. 110/2,8 is a nice lens for a 43x32 sensor. The Finder of the RZ looks much clearer and sharper than the one on the Hasselblad V. Only the RZ is a bit bulky for such a small sensor.

I find it a pity that one can´t change the other adapters for the valeo easily. I´d like to see how it performs with my 645 AFD. I´ve got way to many cameras. I should open a camera store.

[Dustbak]

I used to use a WLF with the 503. Recently I bought a PME finder. I have not yet used that with my 503.

I do not wear glasses but know several people that do which use the DigiFlex as well. I have not heard they find it impossible to use the finder. I can tell you that the finder is not that big, it vignettes in the corners. I hated it when I just started using it but grew into using it.

Prices vary on the DF. A vendor on Ebay has one now for 2200USD. I have one for sale as well (I have 2 of them) that I am willing to let go for a lot less.

I know the camera store feeling very well as well, I have several systems myself (still not as much as some equipment idiots or gear-sluts I know). I like working with multiple systems which is why I have invested in the Hasselblad CF.

But don't kid yourself. Every choice comes with a price. There is still not something as a free lunch  

The choice for the V-system is by no means 'wrong'. There are a lot of things you can use it with. You only need to learn how to get up to speed with it.

[Bernd B.]

I used to use a WLF with the 503. Recently I bought a PME finder. I have not yet used that with my 503.

I do not wear glasses but know several people that do which use the DigiFlex as well. I have not heard they find it impossible to use the finder. I can tell you that the finder is not that big, it vignettes in the corners. I hated it when I just started using it but grew into using it.

Prices vary on the DF. A vendor on Ebay has one now for 2200USD. I have one for sale as well (I have 2 of them) that I am willing to let go for a lot less.

I know the camera store feeling very well as well, I have several systems myself (still not as much as some equipment idiots or gear-sluts I know). I like working with multiple systems which is why I have invested in the Hasselblad CF.

But don't kid yourself. Every choice comes with a price. There is still not something as a free lunch  

The choice for the V-system is by no means 'wrong'. There are a lot of things you can use it with. You only need to learn how to get up to speed with it.
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How are the colors, especially the skin tones with the CF39? What I read between the lines in this forum is that the Dalsa chips have better skin tones. That´s why I bought the Leaf and I´ve not been disappointed so far.

Do you use your H2 mostly AF or MF? How is MF working with open aperture with it anyway?

I read about your offer of the Digiflex for EUR 1.250,-. The only problem is, that I have a 5D and get along with it quite well. I bought the valeo to check out MF digital photography will all the problems I have now to make my personal experiences and not to go back to a 35mm based system after two weeks. That would be a bit like cowardice for me.