Hasselblad HC new lens shutter compatibility with Fuji GFX and H1

[imagetone]

I have a repair quotation from Hasselblad to replace the lens shutter in my Mk 1 HC120 lens. They have said that it will be the latest version of the shutter, capable of 1/2000s.

I use it now mainly on a Fuji GFX50s I also have my old H1.  My understanding is that  the fastest shutter speed the new shutter unit will do on Hasselblad bodies prior to the H5 and H6 is 1/1000s. I have two questions:

Does anyone have practical experience of using such an upgraded HC lens, or an orange dot lens, with the GFX50S (or other GFX camera), and what is the fastest shutter speed achievable in lens shutter mode?

Is there a minimum version of firmware I'll need on the H1 to get the 1/1000s shutter speed?

I've already sourced another s/h Mk 1 HC120 which I'm using, but am trying to ascertain whether the repaired lens will be useable if I go ahead with the repair.

Thanks.

[BobShaw]

I can't comment on the GFX but read the ReadMe for the firmware update.
I have had two lens shutters repaired recently (not HC120) and they came back with v19.1.0 firmware so they will no doubt come back with the latest firmware.
They work at 1/2000S on the X1D.
Just ask Hasselblad for what you will get for H series cameras.

[Conner999]

I believe (don't quote me) the GFX H adapter won't allow > 1/800 lens shutter.  Of course you can go to 1/4000 using body shutter, but limited to 1/125 sync.

A new shutter with the right firmware on the X series will allow 1/2000.

[imagetone]

can't comment on the GFX but read the ReadMe for the firmware update.
I have had two lens shutters repaired recently (not HC120) and they came back with v19.1.0 firmware so they will no doubt come back with the latest firmware.

Thanks. Hasselblad have said I'll get 1/1000s on the H1 but what I want to be sure of is if the old H1 firmware is compatible with the new lens firmware and the release notes aren't very helpful. (I don't have a Hasselbad back to upgrade it, just P1) . Hopefully I'm close enough (9.5.0) to the latest H1 version for it to work but I have asked them the question.

I believe (don't quote me) the GFX H adapter won't allow > 1/800 lens shutter.  Of course you can go to 1/4000 using body shutter, but limited to 1/125 sync.

Thanks, that's interesting (and a bit disappointing). I was hoping someone would say they are actually using the newer lenses with the GFX.

[Conner999]

Bear in mind a 1 stop ND can change things.  I used some older HC lenses on our GFX and now on our X1DII, and I just pop-on a 1ND filter (or variable 1+ on it).  The 1 stop ND gets you the ambient knock-down of 1/1600 sync, doesn't impede manual focus and isn't a big drain on the average flash/pack. 

I also use Alter Filter (or knock-off) flip-up filter holders. Flip it down, ND in place, flip it up, it's out of the way. They come in various sizes and are also great for keeping lens caps handy. No use of hood however, so it's screw-in rubber hood or just use the lens cap in the holder and rotate it to block the light.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/295488155269?hash=item44cc776e85:g:bRsAAOSwntFjzsVw&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA4JcvQLrlVFQ8u64qFf0t6aPyMjBb6sqxd%2B8uoanyqtEzQlcKY5xormQ6IStDN5KtJ0NJTHAcjenspf2giULTxBrBPgzM1mEfSRfHZWaP9%2Bc%2FT6%2BYCY%2BDOxM0Qk%2BNEAe4zMgsaurXvafRfpNXe%2BaF5JeM%2FC6wSLPrbimN%2B1bnT%2FAw6%2FknICWyfW9pkyzP%2F3C%2F2R9RAVjJ8jqY%2B7RiHWSEWq1nwj1c00JqsPR%2BPuPmngSEfDXLVjhEB3kWTH02saLDJwGM6ug1QVPT8i4LCfgfMMSAZrbLqV9ELojXBLP%2FlEIH%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR9D36NHBYQ

[imagetone]

Bear in mind a 1 stop ND can change things.  I used some older HC lenses on our GFX and now on our X1DII, and I just pop-on a 1ND filter (or variable 1+ on it).  The 1 stop ND gets you the ambient knock-down of 1/1600 sync, doesn't impede manual focus and isn't a big drain on the average flash/pack

Thanks. That the upgraded lens will work at all on the GFX with the converter is my main concern. All my work with the HC120 is product work with studio flash so the faster shutter speed is just a nice to have.

[BobShaw]

H1 camera with v9.1.2 firmware and V19.1.0 lens (HCD35-90) gives 1/1000S.
I can't upgrade the body firmware or take a shot as I don't have a back.

[Conner999]

I never tried a 1/2000 lens on our GFX, but I see absolutely no reason why it wouldn't work. I've never seen anything out there saying you needed < 1/2000 shutter HC/D glass to use the adapter. Just that you'd be limited to 1/800 max (leaf) shutter speed if you did.

That said, if you need > 1/800, you could flip the GFX over to body shutter and use up to 1/4000 and Fuji HSS (if lights permit). Works fine with Hassy glass, Godox strobes  and Godox Fuji transmitter.

Thanks. That the upgraded lens will work at all on the GFX with the converter is my main concern. All my work with the HC120 is product work with studio flash so the faster shutter speed is just a nice to have.

[Steve Hendrix]

When you try an orange dot lens on the GFX 100s, and you have set the option to "Lens", so it engages the leaf shutter, the shutter speed maxes at 1/800th (then goes to Bulb). Same as with non orange dot lenses.

This is because the 1/800th leaf shutter max is a mechanical limitation. The ability to shoot at faster speeds (up to 1/2000th with orange dot) is via firmware trickery (same with some of the Phase One Schneider lenses) which at least at the moment is only viable when mounted to a Hasselblad H body. Whether Fuji can or will update firmware to enable this is unknown.


Steve Hendrix/CI

[UlfKrentz]

Thanks. That the upgraded lens will work at all on the GFX with the converter is my main concern. All my work with the HC120 is product work with studio flash so the faster shutter speed is just a nice to have.

Keep in mind depending on the power used studio flash may have a longer duration plus if you use a wireless trigger delay might also effect exposure. Not sure what benefits you expect with a faster shutter speed for studio work?

[imagetone]

H1 camera with v9.1.2 firmware and V19.1.0 lens (HCD35-90) gives 1/1000S.

Thanks Bob

When you try an orange dot lens on the GFX 100s, and you have set the option to "Lens", so it engages the leaf shutter, the shutter speed maxes at 1/800th (then goes to Bulb). Same as with non orange dot lenses.

Thanks Steve, thats given me the assurance I needed.

Keep in mind depending on the power used studio flash may have a longer duration plus if you use a wireless trigger delay might also effect exposure. Not sure what benefits you expect with a faster shutter speed for studio work?

Thanks Ulf. Checking the upgraded lens would work at all with the GFX (and the H1with old firmware) was my concern. No, in the studio the lens shutter speed isn't an issue. It would be nice outdoors but I don't do much if that.

[TechTalk]

H1 camera with v9.1.2 firmware and V19.1.0 lens (HCD35-90) gives 1/1000S.

When you try an orange dot lens on the GFX 100s, and you have set the option to "Lens", so it engages the leaf shutter, the shutter speed maxes at 1/800th (then goes to Bulb). Same as with non orange dot lenses.

This is because the 1/800th leaf shutter max is a mechanical limitation. The ability to shoot at faster speeds (up to 1/2000th with orange dot) is via firmware trickery (same with some of the Phase One Schneider lenses) which at least at the moment is only viable when mounted to a Hasselblad H body. Whether Fuji can or will update firmware to enable this is unknown.


Steve Hendrix/CI

As Bob indicates above, the newer 'orange dot' lenses have a top shutter speed of 1/1,000 when used on any of the Hasselblad H models (H1 thru H5D) made from 2002 until the introduction in 2016 of the H6D and new lenses with faster shutter speed capabilities. All H6D and X-system models which followed from 2016 forward offer a 1/2,000 top speed by combining delayed sensor activation synched with the top mechanical speed of the newer orange dot lens shutter of 1/1,000.

I don't know why Fuji GFX cameras don't recognize a faster speed than 1/800 with a faster 'orange dot' lens shutter, but I suspect that their firmware is simpler and only recognizes a Hasselblad leaf shutter is attached and treats all shutters as having the same range — without the ability to recognize additional information received from the lens, regarding its shutter type and available speeds, to which older Hasselblad H models can and do respond.

No firmware upgrades were required for older H-system cameras to recognize the new 1/1,000 shutter speed. It appears the ability to recognize and respond to wider shutter speed ranges in different shutters was designed into the H-system platform from the beginning.

My only (and very minor) difference with your reply is my understanding that the top mechanical shutter speed limit for an 'orange dot' lens is 1/1,000 rather than 1/800. Hasselblad cameras recognize the different shutter types and their available speeds, while Fuji GFX models appear to be unable to tell the difference. If there's something else of which I'm unaware, I'm always happy to benefit from your knowledge and expertise.

Best Regards to you.

[Steve Hendrix]

My only (and very minor) difference with your reply is my understanding that the top mechanical shutter speed limit for an 'orange dot' lens is 1/1,000 rather than 1/800. Hasselblad cameras recognize the different shutter types and their available speeds, while Fuji GFX models appear to be unable to tell the difference. If there's something else of which I'm unaware, I'm always happy to benefit from your knowledge and expertise.

Best Regards to you.

That could very well be the case, and I would take your word on that.


Steve Hendrix/CI

[imagetone]

An update on this now that the lens is back from repair by Hasselblad. It has the 19.1.0 firmware.

It gives 1/1000s as expected on the H1.

Interestingly, on the GFX50S, it also works at 1/1000 once the firmware in the H mount adapter is upgraded to 1.20. With 1.10 the lens doesn't work at all, just causes an error.

[douglevy]

Yep - when I had my 50-110 repaired last year for the h5x it went from 1/800 to 1/1000. Assume on the Fuji still no AF correct?

[imagetone]

Assume on the Fuji still no AF correct?

Yes that's right. No AF on the GFX50S. That would be quite a benefit, if it's technically possible (and I guess it might not be, but that's just a guess), and increase the usefulness and resale value of all those HC lenses. I rarely use the HC120 much in AF but it would be great with my HC150.