Z3200 printhead problem - no ink output.

[NackJich]

Hi again.
Bit of a worrying problem. MK and R cartridges have been problematic for a while. Six months ago I gave up trying and went to bed, only to find next day the printer was fine! It was okay for months, however this week I made a test print with uniform blocks of colour: All colours printing fine until suddenly red abruptly fades to white. Internal diagnostic image showed an absent red and a not too happy striped MK. So, after several failed head cleaning cycles I changed the printhead. The ink was low so I installed fresh carts. I cleaned the electrical contacts for the printhead with rubbing alcohol and some q-tips. They were quite grubby. However, now I have a diagnostic image with two white squares where red and MK should be? I'm guessing an electrical problem? Any suggestions people?

[Mark Lindquist]

Hi again.
Bit of a worrying problem. MK and R cartridges have been problematic for a while. Six months ago I gave up trying and went to bed, only to find next day the printer was fine! It was okay for months, however this week I made a test print with uniform blocks of colour: All colours printing fine until suddenly red abruptly fades to white. Internal diagnostic image showed an absent red and a not too happy striped MK. So, after several failed head cleaning cycles I changed the printhead. The ink was low so I installed fresh carts. I cleaned the electrical contacts for the printhead with rubbing alcohol and some q-tips. They were quite grubby. However, now I have a diagnostic image with two white squares where red and MK should be? I'm guessing an electrical problem? Any suggestions people?

Hi NJ-
Best thing is to get a new MK/R printhead (unless that is what you already did). If it was mine, I'd open the cover, then just as the carriage moves, pull the plug. Remove all carts and printheads - put everything in a plastic bag and shake vigorously. Being sure the switch in back is in the off position, plug in (with the LAN cable removed), then start up the printer from the switch in back. Let the printer turn on and begin initializing. Feed the cartridges first as it asks for them, then the printheads as it asks for them.

Let it prepare the ink system and initialize fully. It will proceed to do a printhead alignment. Once filled up, proceed to a full head cleaning, then print the diagnostic print and analyse. Should be good to go. If not, keep forcing ink through the MK/R printhead with patches. Rinse and repeat. Should get there. I don't look for electrical problems on ink shortage issues - just force ink. If still no MK/R on the diagnostic print - you've got a bad printhead.

Best,

Mark

[John Nollendorfs]

Mark:
Im wondering if new HP print heads are not as good as the ones from 15 years ago? My 3200 is 2 years old and I have replaced many of the print heads in the last 6 months. My old 3100 was like 2 years old before I replaced the first one. Maybe I'm just printing more? Maybe because I'm using expired ink carts if I can find them two years or less out of date on Ebay? I'm going to start keeping closer track of head replacements  in the future.

[deanwork]

No. I’ve seen it too.  Right now I have a yellow-magenta head that is a about three
months old that is in warranty and has to be replaced. Not what I needed right now. I could not get any yellow gamut and so I printed a head check pattern and sure enough there is magenta in the yellow channel. I did head cleans and cleaned the head surface and that didn’t help.

John

Mark:
Im wondering if new HP print heads are not as good as the ones from 15 years ago? My 3200 is 2 years old and I have replaced many of the print heads in the last 6 months. My old 3100 was like 2 years old before I replaced the first one. Maybe I'm just printing more? Maybe because I'm using expired ink carts if I can find them two years or less out of date on Ebay? I'm going to start keeping closer track of head replacements  in the future.

[NackJich]

Thanks Mark
Yes its a new printhead, but I have one in reserve in case it just happens to be a dud. I'll follow your procedure to the letter tomorrow, and report back. I don't go through too many printheads, but I tend to buy old stock for the savings. Not sure if it's a false economy - wonder if they deteriorate with long storage? Hope I can get him back up and running...

[Mark Lindquist]

Hey guys - John, John and Nack-
Yeah there’s trouble in Lake Woebegone alright. Two years ago I worked with a Tier three engineer who needed help tracking down a bad batch of yellow ink. I have also had trouble with LC/LM and MK/R printheads. That’s why I try to buy them direct from HP. Occassionally they are out and I’ll get them from B&H.

I was told that the contract with whatever company makes the inks was either coming up for renewal (this was about 5 years ago) so it’s possible another company has stepped in and QC is not what it was.

Most always IDS (ink delivery system) issues trace back to printhead failures. I rarely clean and futz with printheads any more unless in a pinch. I just buy them new. Considering the marvel that they are and how miraculous the result is, I feel it’s pennywise and pound foolish to screw with them. If they go bad within warranty I insist on replacements.

I just changed out all printheads and all cartridges ahead of out of warranty on a Z that has a 5 year care pack and swapped all the heads and carts into another Z that is no longer under warranty. Hand me down ink and printheads work well in that situation.

I’ve built a “shaker” for my inks and printheads - works great and I’m betting that the ink will stay in suspension far longer than not being shaken.

After filling up all new inks, all new printheads and oiling the carriage rail, what a joy to behold. The Z is a thing of beauty. Even while we’re at the end of the golden age of these printers, I’m still overjoyed with the results. I’ll put up with their being finnicky and tempermental just as we all do - at least those of us who don’t throw them in the landfills...

Mark

PS - keep the carriage rail constantly lubricated - it’s the key to belt longevity. Really.
 

[deanwork]

Yes Mark,

You are so right. I remember the days when my print heads would last for several years after they were out of warranty. I’ve had three heads this year that went bad during the warranty period. Two of those were the MK/Red heads.

Yes yes, shaking the inks is very important, especially the blacks. Unlike the huge Canons, but like the Epsons, these Zs don’t really get agitated enough. Unsuspended pigment particles can damage heads.

I have a situation right now, I’m starting to experience the dreaded black rubber deposit spots on my prints now. You can see the the tiny particles inside the carriage sometimes so I have to watch that.
I’ve inspected the belt just now with a strong light and it looks really good to me. I looked all the way up and down and on both sides and I don’t see any signs of wear or fraying.  In the past the belts were totally shredded before I’d see any black spots on prints.

What should I clean this belt with, distilled water or something else? And is there anything I could put on it to protect it? I believe Armorall wipes were mentioned at one time. I don’t know if HP even services the Z3200 at all anymore. I think this belt is 2.5 years old. I loose track of time….."?

John

Hey guys - John, John and Nack-
Yeah there’s trouble in Lake Woebegone alright. Two years ago I worked with a Tier three engineer who needed help tracking down a bad batch of yellow ink. I have also had trouble with LC/LM and MK/R printheads. That’s why I try to buy them direct from HP. Occassionally they are out and I’ll get them from B&H.

I was told that the contract with whatever company makes the inks was either coming up for renewal (this was about 5 years ago) so it’s possible another company has stepped in and QC is not what it was.

Most always IDS (ink delivery system) issues trace back to printhead failures. I rarely clean and futz with printheads any more unless in a pinch. I just buy them new. Considering the marvel that they are and how miraculous the result is, I feel it’s pennywise and pound foolish to screw with them. If they go bad within warranty I insist on replacements.

I just changed out all printheads and all cartridges ahead of out of warranty on a Z that has a 5 year care pack and swapped all the heads and carts into another Z that is no longer under warranty. Hand me down ink and printheads work well in that situation.

I’ve built a “shaker” for my inks and printheads - works great and I’m betting that the ink will stay in suspension far longer than not being shaken.

After filling up all new inks, all new printheads and oiling the carriage rail, what a joy to behold. The Z is a thing of beauty. Even while we’re at the end of the golden age of these printers, I’m still overjoyed with the results. I’ll put up with their being finnicky and tempermental just as we all do - at least those of us who don’t throw them in the landfills...

Mark

PS - keep the carriage rail constantly lubricated - it’s the key to belt longevity. Really.
 

[NackJich]

Hi Mark and the others..
Your method did the trick. The process identified the MK/Red printhead as suspect. All three of my standby printheads (some already used) were rejected. The last one I put in the machine that started all this was a fresh but expired head that failed to fill. With all the swapping and exchanging I can't identify who I bought it from! Probably too late to return it anyhow. Lesson learned I'm not going to keep stock of printheads in future. So, I ended up putting in another new printhead, and I could tell from the calibration chart instantly that it was working. What a relief. Thanks very much. I have some oil coming today for the rails.
BW
NJ

[dgberg]

What is the suggested oil?

[Ernst Dinkla]

What is the suggested oil?

The Nye Hobbyist Lubricant Kit contains a thin oil that meets 99% of the HP recommended oil for the head carriage rod, a NYE oil in origin as well. Nye synthetic oil PP269, compare the spec sheet with the NYE 179 PAO PolyAlphaOlefin base that is used by HP. 2 fl ozs and the price competitive. So I went for the NYE PP269  that at that time was part of the NYE Hobby Lubrication Kit. That kit is no longer available, pity as the size and price was good.

Reading the specs of other oils that I checked at that time, papers still here, Molykote L-1232 and L-1232FG were also close in specs, PAO base too. Problem then was the quantity you could order, too much.

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst Dinkla

https://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

[neil snape]

IT was usually the MK R head that needed more cleanings or failed earlier. With too much time of non use, my long gone Z3200 had the GE line gel thus no longer worked.
My non used Z9+ is giving me a lot of trouble there. I replaced a MK/R as the old ione installed failed. I bought a new one from HP, returned it as the expiry date was a year or less away only to find no one has any with long expiry dates. Replaced the MK/R with a new one. Consumed a ton of ink.

Then after 5 minutes or so it says replace print head. I've tried everything, lube contact cleaner, cleaning ODD, pads and wipers, reseating etc. After exploring everything with HP tech support  in warranty print head out of warranty printer) it kept coming back. I could print. Yet had to send a spool file before the replace print head warning came back.

Called tech support again. Was told to replace all ink carts out of warranty and print heads. Hmmm, I explained that that would be helpful but not an obligation. Seeing that it was the NEW print head, they sent a new print head.

It has used 84 ml of ink so far in just that head. Now replacing it will cost a fortune. Could it be the quality of HP print heads is way down? Probably. Do they care? No.
They said if it the replacement print head doesn't work, they will send a repair estimate.

I loved the Z3200, hate the Z9. Trying to sell it to someone anyone who may find a use for it. Yet there is little or no interest.

Funny on my site I still get 30 views a week on my review....

[Mark Lindquist]

Yes Mark,

You are so right. I remember the days when my print heads would last for several years after they were out of warranty. I’ve had three heads this year that went bad during the warranty period. Two of those were the MK/Red heads.

Yes yes, shaking the inks is very important, especially the blacks. Unlike the huge Canons, but like the Epsons, these Zs don’t really get agitated enough. Unsuspended pigment particles can damage heads.

I have a situation right now, I’m starting to experience the dreaded black rubber deposit spots on my prints now. You can see the the tiny particles inside the carriage sometimes so I have to watch that.
I’ve inspected the belt just now with a strong light and it looks really good to me. I looked all the way up and down and on both sides and I don’t see any signs of wear or fraying.  In the past the belts were totally shredded before I’d see any black spots on prints.

What should I clean this belt with, distilled water or something else? And is there anything I could put on it to protect it? I believe Armorall wipes were mentioned at one time. I don’t know if HP even services the Z3200 at all anymore. I think this belt is 2.5 years old. I loose track of time….."?

John

GO HERE JOHN

I just published my process for rejuvenating our belts. Even though your belt looks good, treating it will eliminate the black specks. The rubber gets hard and micro cracks begin.
Now we can just use the wipes to fix it, usually 3 months at a time.

Fuhgeddaboudit bro!

Best -

Mark

[deanwork]

Excellent my man.

I bought some of the hp lubricant awhile back that I’ve been using so that will help too.

GO HERE JOHN

I just published my process for rejuvenating our belts. Even though your belt looks good, treating it will eliminate the black specks. The rubber gets hard and micro cracks begin.
Now we can just use the wipes to fix it, usually 3 months at a time.

Fuhgeddaboudit bro!

Best -

Mark

[mfrohman]

agree that recent HP 70 printheads seem to have a much shorter life span than they use to. It's too much trouble to get on the phone with HP and get a replacement if they're still under warranty so I just replace them with new ones most of the time.

+1 on the importance of using the lubricant on the carriage rail as well as a vacuum to keep things moving smoothly on the z3200s

[NackJich]

Just a quick update. Crisis over - my printer generated test sheets have never been better. Barely a missing segment on the nozzle check results. Thank you!!  Quick question.. how often do you shake those cartridges. Do you just lift the lid(s) and go through them one by one?

[plasakow]

Ernst, how critical do you think the specs are on the oil? I've been using a good sewing machine oil for the last few years and have had no problems. 

The Nye Hobbyist Lubricant Kit contains a thin oil that meets 99% of the HP recommended oil for the head carriage rod, a NYE oil in origin as well. Nye synthetic oil PP269, compare the spec sheet with the NYE 179 PAO PolyAlphaOlefin base that is used by HP. 2 fl ozs and the price competitive. So I went for the NYE PP269  that at that time was part of the NYE Hobby Lubrication Kit. That kit is no longer available, pity as the size and price was good.

Reading the specs of other oils that I checked at that time, papers still here, Molykote L-1232 and L-1232FG were also close in specs, PAO base too. Problem then was the quantity you could order, too much.

Met vriendelijke groet, Ernst Dinkla

https://www.pigment-print.com/spectralplots/spectrumviz_1.htm

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." H. L. Mencken

[plasakow]

Just for the record, MK-R printheads are the most likely to present problems for me as well. Others, like LM-LC, seem to last forever.

I also exclusively use expired but new printheads sold on eBay. Perhaps the MK-R issues are related to this, perhaps not...

Hi again.
Bit of a worrying problem. MK and R cartridges have been problematic for a while. Six months ago I gave up trying and went to bed, only to find next day the printer was fine! It was okay for months, however this week I made a test print with uniform blocks of colour: All colours printing fine until suddenly red abruptly fades to white. Internal diagnostic image showed an absent red and a not too happy striped MK. So, after several failed head cleaning cycles I changed the printhead. The ink was low so I installed fresh carts. I cleaned the electrical contacts for the printhead with rubbing alcohol and some q-tips. They were quite grubby. However, now I have a diagnostic image with two white squares where red and MK should be? I'm guessing an electrical problem? Any suggestions people?