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Author Topic: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine  (Read 146047 times)

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2560 on: December 20, 2021, 11:41:33 am »

You've lost it man, get a grip and at least look at what you wrote and exactly when! Indeed Alan, you should:Stop lying to people here on LuLa on the dangers of J&J vaccine. You're spreading misinformation that's dangerous to the people here. "STOP IT".
I don’t know if you are purposely trying not to understand this, or if you simply cannot understand it.   



People are smart enough here to make their own judgments.  If they have a choice between the three, why would anyone take J&J?  Telling them to ignore what I say is not how to do it.  You present counterarguments of why they should take J&J over the others.  Calling me names isn't the way to do it.

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2561 on: December 20, 2021, 11:43:27 am »

I have to support Alan here. To "lie" is to intentionally say something that you know is false. I don't think Alan does that. Of course, many of the things he says are factually false, but he believes them--so, no lies. I also do not recall him ever making a personal attack.
Thanks.  I think.  ;)

LesPalenik

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2562 on: December 20, 2021, 12:27:17 pm »

I'm sorry Les.  You're incorrect.  I haven't lied. And I'm disappointed in your accusation and agreement with Andrew a man whose every other post smears someone, not only me.   Like everyone else here, I present evidence to support my point of view.  And others present their evidence to support theirs.  Just like opposing sides in court.   Truth lies in the eye of the beholder.  It;'s up to others to draw conclusion of what they heard and make up their own minds.   

Of course, everyone makes errors on facts.  There's no way anyone has a monopoly on them.  We can't know everything.  Plus facts change from day to day.  What was understood to be true yesterday may be untrue today and vice versa.   

I was accused of lying about how J&J vaccine killed people.  That's the truth and you can see my article above.  So Andrew lied.  Yet you don't seem concerned about his lies, distortion,s and personal attacks.  You don't seem to acknowledge your poorly chosen and inaccurate comments but only see them in others.  It's very disappointing to hear this from you.

Alan,
I didn't say that you lied, but in my reply to Andrew's question I grouped lies, inaccuracies and poorly chosen words together. That was my way to say that there is a difference between outright lies and incorrectly stated facts, although some readers won't make such a distinction.

You definitely interpreted in past some things incorrectly or drew wrong conclusions and usually I responded right then with quoting the actual facts.  I also know that you, as well some others on this forum didn't do it intentionally, so that's why I always rectified it by stating actual or more accurate data rather than by calling anyone here a liar. When I posted something wrong and it was brought to my attention, I always acknowleged and apologized for it.   

And I'm aware as also Peter says, that you never made here personal attacks. I think also positively about your efforts to keep the forum alive. As you say, like everyone else here, you presented evidence information to support your point of view. Now, I wouldn't call it evidence. Others present their data or interpretation to support their point of view. Compared to other fora, I still find the interaction between the LuLa forum members quite civilized and filled with many interesting and useful facts.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2563 on: December 20, 2021, 12:40:47 pm »

Les thanks for clarifying those points.

digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2564 on: December 20, 2021, 12:51:32 pm »

People are smart enough here to make their own judgments. 
People are stupid enough to post judgments that make them yell fire in a crowed theater, recommend injecting bleach and posting lies about both the safely of vaccines and the underlying goal of the scientists who produce them. Plenty of examples of this stupidy, I don't know why more examples have to follow.
Quote
If they have a choice between the three, why would anyone take J&J?

The question is yet another obvious attempt to digress from the first point I made above.
You have this odd, regular habit of asking questions of others, when your posting history and agenda show/prove, you have no desire or ability to accept any answer. No need to ask. The question has zero to do about how you lied about J&J and those who developed and approved it.

Here it is AGAIN for you to ignore but hopefully for the site owners and others to see WHY you were called out and WHY you should stop talking about this. No matter how the factual history of your posts and mine are provied, you'll ignore them; there is no way you can accept them as they were provide:

Alan Klein on December 19, 2021, 04:49:37 am
Quote
"They allowed a bad product to be fostered on an ignorant  public killing a lot of people."

Three hours later, I called you out for his rubbish by showing an article that factually stated that nine out of 16 MILLION residents in the US died from this vaccine. I'd ask you to do the math and examine the percentage of 9 deaths from 16 million (further, all having underlying conditions, outlined in the URL you didn't read or did and didn't understand) who received the J&J vaccine. Asking you to examine the math would likely make your head explode but one is more likely to be struck by lightening sir. The U.S. has averaged 43 reported lightning fatalities per year. It kills a lot of people; idiotic FUD.
Of course the number in that 16 million protected from a deadly vaccine, you have no idea nor care to even consider.

Equally absurd and a lie: Alan Klein on December 19, 2021, 04:49:37 am
Quote
The bottom line is that scientists dealt a crooked hand with J&J.
It isn't the bottom line, you lie about scientists deliberately 'crooked hands" with J&J; this is a figment of your imagination and a danger to post. Anyone unvaccinated and can only get J&J should do so! Until such a time the actual scientists say otherwise, NOT you. It is dangerous to suggest otherwise. 800K have died, and many more unvaccinated will die. 9 out of 16 million is a sound bet to take. 

December 19, 2021, 05:49:15 pm: you post the SAME URL I provided before you, showing that only 9 people died, you of course decided to cherry pick that 9 out of 16 million, then make up a statement ("I don't understand why anyone would continue to defend J&J when people are dying from it") when no one, NO ONE defended J&J! It appears yes, you do not understand. That providing facts that don't fit your confirmation bias is a defense of said facts.
"Facts are facts and will not disappear on account of your likes." -Jawaharlal Nehru

Nothing more about your absurd deliberate mistruths need to be said here; the record stands. A record you will ignore and digress from.




« Last Edit: December 20, 2021, 01:10:38 pm by digitaldog »
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digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2565 on: December 20, 2021, 01:02:19 pm »

Alan,
I didn't say that you lied, but in my reply to Andrew's question I grouped lies, inaccuracies and poorly chosen words together. That was my way to say that there is a difference between outright lies and incorrectly stated facts, although some readers won't make such a distinction.
So your initial answer to this is now different?

Quote
We get many deliberate lies and misinformation also from Biden. I wish he stopped that.
You can petition the White House, I'm petitioning LuLa owners.
FWIW, I'm not aware of any lies from Biden that unlike some before him in the White House, lead to thousands or more deaths from Covid-19 lies.
*Les, do you believe any of the following is a lie?

I was following the science.

The bottom line is that scientists dealt a crooked hand with J&J.  They deceived the public about its effectiveness.   Their oversight was deficient. They allowed a bad product to be fostered on an ignorant  public killing a lot of people.

So now that Covid is on the way out, we're left with the economic damage.
*Since it really is a single and simple yes or no question, Yes or no is all I ask again.
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LesPalenik

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2566 on: December 20, 2021, 01:18:03 pm »

So your initial answer to this is now different?
You can petition the White House, I'm petitioning LuLa owners.
FWIW, I'm not aware of any lies from Biden that unlike some before him in the White House, lead to thousands or more deaths from Covid-19 lies.
*Les, do you believe any of the following is a lie?

*Since it really is a single and simple yes or no question, Yes or no is all I ask again.

My answer was no different, but explained it in more detail. There is nothing more I could say about Alan's posts. Anything more on this subject is a waste of time.
As to Biden, as I wondered in one of my earlier posts, I don't know if he lied about GM intentionally or if he is so disinformed.
I wouldn't accuse him of causing any deaths by his handling of covid, but unfortunately that can't be said about his handling of Afghanistan exit.
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digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2567 on: December 20, 2021, 01:26:36 pm »

My answer was no different, but explained it in more detail. There is nothing more I could say about Alan's posts. Anything more on this subject is a waste of time.
As to Biden, as I wondered in one of my earlier posts, I don't know if he lied about GM intentionally or if he is so disinformed.
I wouldn't accuse him of causing any deaths by his handling of covid, but unfortunately that can't be said about his handling of Afghanistan exit.
Agreed to a small degree (yes or no answer refusal noted) although the same is true, more so with Biden; the topic isn't the handling of Afghanistan exit or GM, but Covid-19 and vaccines! There is another forum topic where you can go on and on about the handling of the Afghanistan exit. Got anything to say about Covid-19 inside Afghanistan? Or GM?
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LesPalenik

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2568 on: December 20, 2021, 01:48:06 pm »

Agreed to a small degree (yes or no answer refusal noted) although the same is true, more so with Biden; the topic isn't the handling of Afghanistan exit or GM, but Covid-19 and vaccines! There is another forum topic where you can go on and on about the handling of the Afghanistan exit. Got anything to say about Covid-19 inside Afghanistan? Or GM?

I said at one time that I'm not here to engage in any pissing contests and I don't derive pleasure in arguing with others just to win an argument or scoring brownie points.
When I post something, it's usually information which I find interesting and useful and maybe of interest to some others. Or trying to correct some misleading posts.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2569 on: December 20, 2021, 04:32:05 pm »

People are stupid enough to post judgments that make them yell fire in a crowed theater, recommend injecting bleach and posting lies about both the safely of vaccines and the underlying goal of the scientists who produce them. Plenty of examples of this stupidy, I don't know why more examples have to follow.
The question is yet another obvious attempt to digress from the first point I made above.
You have this odd, regular habit of asking questions of others, when your posting history and agenda show/prove, you have no desire or ability to accept any answer. No need to ask. The question has zero to do about how you lied about J&J and those who developed and approved it.

Here it is AGAIN for you to ignore but hopefully for the site owners and others to see WHY you were called out and WHY you should stop talking about this. No matter how the factual history of your posts and mine are provied, you'll ignore them; there is no way you can accept them as they were provide:

Alan Klein on December 19, 2021, 04:49:37 am
Three hours later, I called you out for his rubbish by showing an article that factually stated that nine out of 16 MILLION residents in the US died from this vaccine. I'd ask you to do the math and examine the percentage of 9 deaths from 16 million (further, all having underlying conditions, outlined in the URL you didn't read or did and didn't understand) who received the J&J vaccine. Asking you to examine the math would likely make your head explode but one is more likely to be struck by lightening sir. The U.S. has averaged 43 reported lightning fatalities per year. It kills a lot of people; idiotic FUD.
Of course the number in that 16 million protected from a deadly vaccine, you have no idea nor care to even consider.

Equally absurd and a lie: Alan Klein on December 19, 2021, 04:49:37 amIt isn't the bottom line, you lie about scientists deliberately 'crooked hands" with J&J; this is a figment of your imagination and a danger to post. Anyone unvaccinated and can only get J&J should do so! Until such a time the actual scientists say otherwise, NOT you. It is dangerous to suggest otherwise. 800K have died, and many more unvaccinated will die. 9 out of 16 million is a sound bet to take. 

December 19, 2021, 05:49:15 pm: you post the SAME URL I provided before you, showing that only 9 people died, you of course decided to cherry pick that 9 out of 16 million, then make up a statement ("I don't understand why anyone would continue to defend J&J when people are dying from it") when no one, NO ONE defended J&J! It appears yes, you do not understand. That providing facts that don't fit your confirmation bias is a defense of said facts.
"Facts are facts and will not disappear on account of your likes." -Jawaharlal Nehru

Nothing more about your absurd deliberate mistruths need to be said here; the record stands. A record you will ignore and digress from.





You're welcome to take J&J if you wish even though it isn't as safe or effective as Moderna or Pfizer.   May you live long and prosper.

digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2570 on: December 20, 2021, 04:34:19 pm »

Nothing more about your absurd deliberate mistruths need to be said here; the record stands. A record you will ignore and digress from.

You're welcome to take J&J if you wish even though it isn't as safe or effective as Moderna or Pfizer.   May you live long and prosper.
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2571 on: December 20, 2021, 04:34:54 pm »

I said at one time that I'm not here to engage in any pissing contests and I don't derive pleasure in arguing with others just to win an argument or scoring brownie points.
When I post something, it's usually information which I find interesting and useful and maybe of interest to some others. Or trying to correct some misleading posts.
Too late.  You took his bait. Now, like me, you're on his sh!t list.  :o

digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2572 on: December 20, 2021, 04:35:29 pm »

Nothing more about your absurd deliberate mistruths need to be said here; the record stands. A record you will ignore and digress from.

Too late.  You took his bait. Now, like me, you're on his sh!t list.  :o

"Ignorance is brought about by assumption."-T. D. Jakes
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TechTalk

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2573 on: December 20, 2021, 05:58:11 pm »

What Refutes Science

• Better science based on new data

What Does NOT Refute Science

• Your feelings

• Your politics

• Your religion

• Your assumptions

• Your assertions based on your assumptions

• Your opinion

• Your half-baked opinion after watching a YouTube video made by someone that doesn't understand science

• Your half-baked opinion after reading online commentary made by someone that doesn't understand science

• Facts pulled out of your ass imagination which aren't facts

• Data or statistics acquired by the method described above
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Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2574 on: December 20, 2021, 06:04:19 pm »

New news.  I only had the half booster.

Moderna booster shot increases antibody levels against Omicron, company says
Currently, Moderna's booster is administered as a 50-microgram dose. The company announcement noted that this dose increased antibody levels 37-fold, compared with the levels seen when a fully vaccinated person does not receive a booster, and a 100-microgram dose increased antibody levels 83-fold.
It remains unclear what these increases mean as far as how well the booster doses clinically work against Omicron.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/20/health/moderna-booster-omicron-bn/index.html

Alan Klein

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2575 on: December 20, 2021, 06:23:58 pm »

I'm not sure who this pleases the most. :)

Trump reveals he got COVID-19 booster shot; crowd boos him
Former President Donald Trump has revealed he received a booster shot of the COVID-19 vaccine, drawing boos from a crowd in Dallas
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/trump-reveals-covid-19-booster-shot-crowd-boos-81860432

TechTalk

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2576 on: December 20, 2021, 06:46:47 pm »

I'm not sure who this pleases the most. :)

My feeling about it in under 30-seconds...

https://www.youtube.com/my response
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chez

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2577 on: December 20, 2021, 07:07:53 pm »

I'm not sure who this pleases the most. :)

Trump reveals he got COVID-19 booster shot; crowd boos him
Former President Donald Trump has revealed he received a booster shot of the COVID-19 vaccine, drawing boos from a crowd in Dallas
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/trump-reveals-covid-19-booster-shot-crowd-boos-81860432

What...he's stop drinking bleach?
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digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2578 on: December 20, 2021, 07:13:02 pm »

What...he's stop drinking bleach?
Please, facts!  ;D He was suggesting injecting disinfectant (and light). But bleach fits in that large group of products.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-suggests-injection-disinfectant-beat-coronavirus-clean-lungs-n1191216
Quote
April 23, 2020, 5:18 PM MDT / Updated April 24, 2020, 8:31 AM MDT
By Dartunorro Clark
President Donald Trump suggested the possibility of an "injection" of disinfectant into a person infected with the coronavirus as a deterrent to the virus during his daily briefing Thursday.
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digitaldog

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Re: Promising New Coronavirus Vaccine
« Reply #2579 on: December 20, 2021, 07:24:07 pm »

Wow, that's a keeper that needs repeating with your permission. Brilliant. Succinct. Quote worthy.

What Refutes Science

• Better science based on new data

What Does NOT Refute Science

• Your feelings

• Your politics

• Your religion

• Your assumptions

• Your assertions based on your assumptions

• Your opinion

• Your half-baked opinion after watching a YouTube video made by someone that doesn't understand science

• Your half-baked opinion after reading online commentary made by someone that doesn't understand science

• Facts pulled out of your ass imagination which aren't facts

• Data or statistics acquired by the method described above
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