The CI Take on P1 Feature Update Firmware 8

[Paul2660]

Hi Bernard,

Glad to pass on info.  Is there a way you can rent to own or demo a back?  I feel if you used it on your tech camera setup, you would be very impressed.  I can't speak to the color differences, between the tricolor and IQ4, but it would be interesting to hear your feedback.  I was very close to upgrading to the tricolor, but held off when I was told that Phase One would have a better solution coming in 6 months for tech camera lenses. 

Paul C

[Steve Hendrix]

Thanks a lot Paul!

Dual exposure and reduced lens cast are tempting, but I am a bit concerned by the lack of power sharing and live view issues.

Cheers,
Bernard

As much as there are some ... how should we put this ... legacy performance issues that remain un-resolved on the IQ4, if I was using a technical camera, and I used an IQ4 and then was told I had to go back to an IQ3, no frigging way. For tech camera users, the workflow difference is far too important. Virtually no color cast and no black frame reference. Most of my clients never perform an LCC with their IQ4 backs. It doesn't mean there isn't still some benefit, but many just don't even bother any longer. And goodby black frame references (unless you - optionally - want them).


Steve Hendrix/CI

[Paul2660]

Great point on the Black frame reference.  I pretty much quit using my tech camera on the 3100 due to this issue, just too much overhead and time needed, and went back to the XF.  When I tested the IQ4 against the 3100, first thing that happened, was the 3100 was asking for the black frame reference, and it all came back to me. 

I now can't remember what created the need for the black frame reference, but as I recall it was any time the shutter speed was changed when using the ES?  I can't remember if the black frame was needed with if the Copal was used, but I was only interested in using ES.

Paul C

[Balafre]

...

As for the IQ4 and being solid.  After two years, I figure it's as solid as it will be. 

3.  There appears to be an issue where after Feature Update 8, with the back tethered, it no longer allows you to charge the internal battery as you could before.....

Paul C

Paul, thank you so much for all this detail - thankfully I haven't upgraded my XF/3-100 set-up to this level yet because the point you make of not it no longer trickle charging the battery is worrying as this single function proved a God send at times. Is this 100% for real?
Meanwhile I'll happily sacrifice some faster LS function to retain the ability to work at all!

Thanking Ye!

Charles

[Paul2660]

Hi. Yes. Currently the IQ4 has not trickle charge where the back can take power from the battery in the XF. I also loved this feature in the 3100 and just thought it would be there with the IQ4.

Odds are it won’t now. All you get now is the ability to pull the battery out of the back while it’s on the XF and the back will not power off.


Paul C

[Balafre]

Hi! This contradicts and undermines the whole raison d'être of the XF - it was designed/sold/advertised as being infinitely conformable to any users requirements. Simply wanting to keep the electricity flowing is hardly an idiosyncratic demand!

It's beyond belief - mine lives on the big Manfrotto 400 geared head on a stand and often elevated and beyond reach when working, and often the battery compartment can't even be opened when it's at certain angles. What is P1 thinking by removing existing utility from a camera that's meant to represent the ultimate quest for the N'th utility?

It's unworthy of Phase One. Shame upon those Danish Dolts!

Thank you again Paul for your diligence and generosity in sharing this.

Warmly,

Charles

[BernardLanguillier]

Yes, this something even the H6D-100c does better now. One battery for camera and back.

The fact it hasn’t been fixed by now after 8 firmware upgrades tells us it’s a probably a hardware issue with the IQ4...

I was shooting in heavy snow on Thu with my Trichro and being able to keep shooting after the back’s battery got empty was super helpful.

Cheers,
Bernard

[Balafre]

Yes, this something even the H6D-100c does better now. One battery for camera and back.

The fact it hasn’t been fixed by now after 8 firmware upgrades tells us it’s a probably a hardware issue with the IQ4...

I was shooting in heavy snow on Thu with my Trichro and being able to keep shooting after the back’s battery got empty was super helpful.

Cheers,
Bernard

Bernard Hi!

The XF/IQ3-100 does share power between batteries and deplete assymetrically dependent upon usage. Forgive me if I'm misinterpreting you, but does the IQ4 not?
My issue with the upgrade Paul details so well is his point 3) - that when tethered run he reports the batteries within the IQ & XF are no longer trickle charged, so the setting on the back is absent (?) but I assume that this issue is via the USB cable rather than the power adapter, which if used when tethered will still trickle charge the battery set?

STEVE! Please, is this correct? Thanks

most cordially,
Charles

[Paul2660]

No the IQ4 does not trickle charge from the XF. You only get the ability to pull the battery in the back when it gets low without powering the back off.

IQ4 also consumes the P1 3400 milliamperes battery faster.

And still with latest firmware feature upgrade 8 the battery will show 20 percent or less when you actually have around 35 percent remaining. Not a huge deal but it does seem the intelligence for the battery logic took a step backwards with the IQ4.


Paul C

[Balafre]

No the IQ4 does not trickle charge from the XF. You only get the ability to pull the battery in the back when it gets low without powering the back off.

IQ4 also consumes the P1 3400 milliamperes battery faster.

And still with latest firmware feature upgrade 8 the battery will show 20 percent or less when you actually have around 35 percent remaining. Not a huge deal but it does seem the intelligence for the battery logic took a step backwards with the IQ4.


Paul C

Paul thanks, are you shooting tethered with the XF/IQ set-up powered by batteries only or wired up to the power adapter please?

[Paul2660]

I am only shooting in the field. Not tethered.  With the 3100 and XF the back would run down its battery to a certain level they it would use the battery in the XF. It did not charge the battery with a trickle charge. The IQ4 does not have this capability.

The trickle charging would apply to tethering. With feature update 8 it seems the IQ4 battery is no longer being charged. It used to allow this when tethered to a PC or MAC with USB3. Capture Integration wrote a blog article about this problem right after the Feature Update was released. I don’t think this issue has been fixed as of yet. There may be a beta firmware out there however that has been released to dealers. Here is a link.

https://www.captureintegration.com/feature-update-8-usb-power-not-so-great/


Paul C

[Schwarzzeit]

The IQ4 has a range of options for external power, i.e. USB-C, PoE and AC-power through the XF Power Supply (AC power adapter). As I don’t have a PoE router I never tested this option. In the field a USB-C powerbank is the most convenient option to extend shooting time on the IQ4. While the previous firmware allowed a power input of up to 45 W which enabled quick charging in the field, this was cut to 15 W with firmware update 8. It’s enough to power the IQ4 without using the battery but there isn’t much excess power left to charge the battery while actively shooting. When idling it charges faster and even trickles some power to the XF. That said, when the camera is not idling the XF does not get any power from a USB-C powerbank on the IQ4. Currently the only way to power the full XF IQ4 system externally is through the XF Power Supply connected the XF. While there are AC capable power banks available having a DC power source convert to AC power which the XF power supply transforms back into DC is not very power efficient. In my tests with such a setup the total power consumption climbed to more than 20 W while shooting long exposure sequences.

I measured the cutoff voltage of the IQ4 battery when the back indicates it’s depleted, and it still read about 7.0V without any load. Under lower loads these batteries can easily be drained down to 6.0V though a peak load on a battery that is drained this far could cause stability issues. By setting a higher cutoff voltage and thereby lowering the effective capacity of a battery the engineers make sure that the battery is always at a level where it can power the system under the system’s maximum load. System stability is a higher priority than effective battery capacity.
It also explains why there have been reports that some chargers indicate a depleted battery still has 20% charge left. I would guess the charger expects a lower cutoff voltage from that type of battery. On the newer Hähnel Cube charger that comes with the IQ4 I get a reading between 0 and 5% for a depleted battery. I guess these chargers are calibrated to display the capacity properly for use with the IQ4.

So there are several factors that lead to a significantly lower shot capacity per battery on the XF IQ4 system vs. the XF IQ3 system. The IQ4 is more power hungry than the IQ3. On the IQ4 the batteries have a lower effective capacity. The XF battery does not trickle power to the IQ4 except for keeping the system running during battery changes.

-Dominique