Bear Pit: now the sole domicile of politics at LuLa

[faberryman]

https://www.dailysignal.com/2020/09/04/39-photos-capture-americas-summer-of-violent-riots/

Sure looks like a lot of the protesters in those photographs are white to me.

[chez]

Oh, man! You found a picture of a white guy looting what appears to be a single six-pack of beer! Congrats!

And some others looking at some empty boxes on the ground. Wow!

And judging looting by the number of people stupid enough to be caught is like judging the amount of drugs crossing the border by the amount of seized ones.

P.S. Oh, by the way, Portland demographics is only 6.3% black (a half of national), and 76.1% white.

Ok...so now about your 99% looters are black BS.

[chez]

Ok, I admit, I was wrong, it wasn't 98% but 95%:

https://thefederalist.com/2020/09/16/study-up-to-95-percent-of-2020-u-s-riots-are-linked-to-black-lives-matter/

Still WRONG as many whites including me believe in Black Lives Matter. Slobo...you get yourself into these messes whenever you try to think. Stop it.

[Chris Kern]

If Americans can't get justice in 2020, what do you suggest they do - write a strongly worded letter to their congressman?

That, and organize politically, vote for state and federal legislative representatives, a president and vice president, governors as well as other elected state officials who are responsive to their concerns, and support non-governmental organizations that represent their interests.  Which is what they've been doing in much of the country.  Seems to be working.

[Alan Klein]

It doesn't require a great knowledge of South African history to know that Mandela was not a non-violent Ghandi figure, though you may be forgiven for not knowing about the Suffragettes' campaign of arson and bombing. In both cases they resorted to violence because there was no way to justice through peaceful means. 

If Americans can't get justice in 2020, what do you suggest they do - write a strongly worded letter to their congressman?

How does burning down black-owned businesses and looting them help the black community?

[Alan Klein]

Biden's popular vote margin over Trump has now exceeded 7 million.

We got it. He won.

[faberryman]

Ok, I admit, I was wrong, it wasn't 98% but 95%:

https://thefederalist.com/2020/09/16/study-up-to-95-percent-of-2020-u-s-riots-are-linked-to-black-lives-matter/

Well, certainly no agenda there. For a different view, you can read the actual report here:

https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/demonstrations-political-violence-in-america-new-data-for-summer-2020/

It's not that long. There's something in it for everyone.

[Alan Klein]

Here is some images from the Portand looting. The last are mugshots of people charged for looting.

So much for this fake news regarding 99% of looters were black. Seems like our boys ( Slobo and Alan ) learn very well from their fearless leader ( Chetos ) on how to spread lies to support their slanted views.

Those are the 1%.  Well, maybe the 2%.

[TechTalk]

I agree Slobodan, you're a smart guy and you are perfectly able to separate facts from ideological fiction.

Being unable "to separate facts from ideological fiction" increases in proportion to the extent with which one's identity is rooted in any ideology. Ability and willingness don't necessarily go hand-in-hand either.

[TechTalk]

We got it. He won.

Apparently, many don't get it. There is a large percentage of Republicans that believe the anti-democracy fraud lies from Trump and his enablers.

[Alan Klein]

How many countries had to have a Civil War to decide whether or not to end slavery? Most had ended it at least 30 years before.
It would be interesting if you were to take a poll in the US on who accepted the result of that war. It might be like the election.

So you're saying that countries that ended slavery 30 years before America did, after hundreds of years of owning and/or trading in slaves, are the standard of moral scruples America should compare ourselves too? So you're saying that Americans who live in the south would like to reimpose slavery?  Where do you find these beliefs?

[chez]

We got it. He won.

Why not phone up your buddy Chetos and tell him he lost. Seems like his minions are scared shitless to tell him the bad news...and Chetos himself has no self respect to be a gracious loser.

[faberryman]

So you're saying that countries that ended slavery 30 years before America did after hundreds of years of owning and/or trading in slaves are the standard of moral scruples America should compare ourselves too? So you're saying that Americans who live in the south would like to reimpose slavery?  Where do you find these beliefs?

The real question is where do you come up with these "So you're saying..." interpretations of what he actually said? Not only do do make up the stuff you say, you now make up the stuff other people say. It is remarkable. Well, not really that remarkable. These "restatements" are known as the logical fallacy of strawman. At least it is a change from whataboutism.

[Alan Klein]

I agree Slobodan, you're a smart guy and you are perfectly able to separate facts from ideological fiction. However your posts here show a very deep rooted hatred at anything slightly to the left and every wrongdoing in your eyes is caused by "the left" and exaggerated up to gigantic proportions in a style and vigor that is in my eyes hurting your credibility. The way your peddling this as one big left conspiracy is just beyond my comprehension.

In my opinion the post I quote here below is probably the best I've read and closest to how I feel about the whole issue:
I've been pretty harsh and unsubtle in my rebukes to you (some but not all tactics were actually copied from you) and that's not my normal style but I did it to try and hold a mirror in front of your face to see if and how it would change anything. Since it didn't I won't react to your posts on this topic anymore, no matter how extremist and absurd they look to me because I think Robert above said it way more eloquently as I could ever do and we're not going to change each-others' opinions on this anyway 

As a last thought, when looking in a mirror everything left seems right and everything right seems left, so sometimes looking in a mirror and looking at matters from multiple angles (actually your advice on a different issue several pages back) can be very refreshing.

Your moralizing is making me itch.  You know when you point a finger at someone else, there are three left that are pointing back at you.,  Surely, you don't want to go into how the Dutch killed millions and stole fortunes from other peoples through the centuries.  You ought to look inward and straighten out your own country's problems.  Muslims in our country can wear burkas unlike in your country.. 

Burka ban and face mask laws frustrate Dutch Muslims
One year after the burka ban in the Netherlands, Muslim women are reporting increased discrimination and violence. Adding to the frustration, face masks against coronavirus have become mandatory on Dutch public transport.
https://en.qantara.de/content/islam-in-the-netherlands-burka-ban-and-face-mask-laws-frustrate-dutch-muslims

[Alan Klein]

Still WRONG as many whites including me believe in Black Lives Matter. Slobo...you get yourself into these messes whenever you try to think. Stop it.

Oh, stop it.  You're pulling the same thing you did with Trump.  Slobodan is talking figurately as I did.  99% is figurative speech that means practically most of them.  You know that.  Stop playing these silly word games by taking every word literally.  This is a forum, not a research paper.

[TechTalk]

You know when you point a finger at someone else, there are three left that are pointing back at you... You ought to look inward and straighten out your own country's problems.

The old—listen to what I say, not what I do—kind of advice.

[faberryman]

How does burning down black-owned businesses and looting them help the black community?

This, too, is a strawman. If you re-read the preceding posts, as painful as that might be, you'll notice that no one said, or even suggested, that burning down black-owned businesses and looting them help the black community.

I have mentioned before that burning down black-owned businesses and looting them is lashing out irrationally. What you need to do is examine why people are lashing out irrationally, and address the underlying issue. Treating the disease and not the symptoms, in other words.

It is kind of like when you are on the fourth hole, and shank your approach shot out of bounds, and get mad and break the club over your knee. If your playing partner asks how does breaking your club over you knee help you not shank your approach shot, you might not ask him to play with you again.

This stuff isn't really that hard if you stop and think about it before posting.

[Alan Klein]

That, and organize politically, vote for state and federal legislative representatives, a president and vice president, governors as well as other elected state officials who are responsive to their concerns, and support non-governmental organizations that represent their interests.  Which is what they've been doing in much of the country.  Seems to be working.

Even Obama came out and said that "defund the police" is a stupid thing to argue for.  It just turns people off who otherwise would consider helping.  Burning, looting and rioting are worse.

As far as voting for people who support blacks, many of these Demcorats have done nothing in decades.  They've often been in charge of the cities where most blacks live.  Yet, blacks still have huge problems.  So why are they re-electing the same people who are doing nothing for them except for promises? They should vote for Republicans who have better business policies that have worked for blacks during the last four years.  After all, minorities have had the lowest unemployment rates under Trump and Republicans than ever before.

[Alan Klein]

Apparently, many don't get it. There is a large percentage of Republicans that believe the anti-democracy fraud lies from Trump and his enablers.

Well the electors and Congress will be voting soon and finalizing the election.  Then we can criticize Biden full time. 

[TechTalk]

After all, minorities have had the lowest unemployment rates under Trump and Republicans than ever before.

The unemployment rate for all groups follow a similar trend pattern and rise and fall together, for African-Americans the unemployment rate is generally about 1.7-2X greater than for whites.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/Unemployment Rate Trends

https://www.usnews.com/news/2020-06-07/ap-fact-check-trump-exaggerations-on-blacks-economic-gains