Adhesive for canvas mounting

[vrkaya]

Hi,

I searched for this topic and there is quite a bit of info in all the posts yet I would like to ask more specifically about this.

I am wanting to glue canvas prints to a surface, probably gator board, and I tried Lineco PH neutral adhesive (which is a white glue) but was not satisfied with the adhesion. My process was applying and spreading the glue with a small hard rubber roller (burnisher?) and It did look as if I had good coverage on the entire substrate; I then placed the canvas and rolled it out with a different roller to press it all firmly into the glue and avoid air pockets, etc... ; and last, I laid a piece of protective paper over the canvas then a piece of flat plywood over this and completely weighted the plywood down in all areas. I thought I would get a really good full adhesion with this method but I'm wondering if maybe I'm using the wrong adhesive? There were several places each of the two times I did this where the adhesive did not fully stick to the canvas.

Any advice on what adhesive would work better for this? Or any problems you see in how I did this? I just started doing it after watching some videos so I'm new at it.

Regards,
Ron

[dgberg]

Miracle Muck is the stuff. From Raphael's in California. All we have used for the last 10 years. Very inexpensive too.
The process is so simple. Foam roller to cover your entire substrate. Lay your canvas down and smooth it out with your hand. Burnish any bubbles out with a brayer. Flip over and trim your bleed off with a razor and done.
No weights or anything like that required at all. What is required with the larger pieces is to lay them on the floor or a countertop until they dry. Because you have adhered a wet product to only one side these things can get like a potato chip until they dry. No weights needed.
When dry they will return to flat.

[langier]

If you have a dry mount press, there's the heat-activated foam board that I use. Can't remember the brand but I know it can be found with a web search. I just use the stock from my framing colleague since he's always got it on hand due to my urging. There's two types he has in his shop in Northern California, one is good for paper, the other a little thicker, is better for canvas.

The heat-activated board is so convenient, easy to use and mess-free that I wonder why someone didn't think of this decades ago.

[vrkaya]

Thanks for the replies. I don't have a dry mount press so have ordered Miracle Muck! Much appreciated!!

Ron

[mcbroomf]

You also mention using a hard rubber roller.  I wonder if your coating was too thin.  As Dan mentioned use a foam roller.  It works well (I took Dan's canvas printing and framing workshop an eon or so ago) ...

Mike

[Kemosabe]

You need a cold roller system.  It works with adhesive gator or foam core board, liquid adhesive, and double single sided film adhesives.  The rollers will get rid of air pockets/ bubbles and spread the adhesive uniformly.

[dgberg]

Be very careful using gator board with attached adhesive with canvas.
Years ago we did our first batch of a hundred canvas mounted to gator board with Seals print mount ultra for our local hospital.
A cold mount adhesive we put it down with our 2 Seal laminators. We were using Miracle Muck at the time but wanted to give this a shot and with two laminators we thought it would be much quicker that the liquid. Went down quick and easy. Finished and hung them and all was good until winter came. About 2 months in to the heating season we received a call from the hospital maintenance crew that some of the canvases were loose and seemed to be coming unattached from the backer. I went in to check them out and every single one that was near a ceiling heat vent was coming loose. The heat measured at the ceiling was almost 100 degrees coming out of the vent and they had the rooms at almost 78 degrees. Tha adhesive could not handle that kind of heat and was coming loose. I took down around 30 of them. Pulled the canvas off, flipped them over and attached them with Miracle Muck and put them back in the frame. I was lucky I did not have to do all 100 over. We are 100 % Miracle Muck now and it really is an easy process. No laminator required. A 2 minute hand brayer and done.
If you try and run it through the laminator and you have excess liquid adhesive it will push out the sides and get all over everything. Something you do not want to do. We still do several hundred a year for this hospital and all of their satellite facilities so we do have it down pat.

[mearussi]

Miracle Muck is considered the strongest adhesive available, but with a PH of 4.5 Miracle Muck is not considered archival.

[Dward]

Dan is right about Miracle Muck--the best I've found for mounting canvas.  Easy to use, and somewhat repositionable if you happen to put the canvas down crooked on the substrate and have to redo. I position the canvas on the substrate, and clamp it in place (using a piece of matboard or canvas scrap between the print and the clamp to protect the image.  Then I fold back the other end of the canvas and coat the exposed 1/2 of the substrate with Miracle Muck, flop the canvas down, cover the canvas with kraft paper and smooth it out with my hands--using my hand allows me to feel any bubbles or irregularities.  Then I remove the clamps from the other end, fold it back over the now-glued half and coat that end. Then flop it down, smooth with my hands, and then roll it hard with a J-roller (the sort flooring guys use).  Using a J-roller lets me put more pressure than the usual brayers. 

David V. Ward, Ph. D.
David Ward Fine Art Photography

[Lewando_Images]

    Miracle Muck is the best way to go. I've been doing it that way with canvas and Gator Board for 20 years. I can do it while sound asleep....it's very easy and works extremely well. Although it goes on slightly acidic.....once dry it is completely inert.....so actually it is archival. It's been around for a long time.....my father who if still alive would be 95.....made canvas boards for painting with Miracle Muck for over 50 years ! Simple....it just works....don't over complicate it.

[vrkaya]

Thanks everyone for the additional tips & info. I ordered from Raphael on September 30 and it took them until yesterday (the 9th) to ship it, after I left a voicemail. Is there any other good source that you use? I’m still waiting for my miracle muck to arrive.

I’m also looking for the best source for gator. I have some but it is expensive!

Regards,
Ron

[dgberg]

Any sign supply houses out your way? I buy from Harbor Sales in Sudlersville Md. and they deliver to me free of charge in se Pa.
Paying $54 a sheet for 4x8" 3/16" black. Gets a little cheaper to buy a case but not enough of a discount to stock that quantity.

Just make sure you have enough before winter comes. They may or may not ship because if it freezes it is throw away. I always buy the 2 gal. case.
Coming from the west coast I always plan at least a week for shipping. I would guess they had stock issue as that delay has never happened to me.

[Lewando_Images]

   artgrafix.net , They are pretty good and have reasonable prices if you want Gator in sizes less then 4ft x 8ft. They ship fast by UPS and are very friendly to deal with. I would give them a call for your 1st order...... 800-443-4421. I've tried a lot of suppliers and have had the best luck with these people. They are in Beacon Falls CT.

[vrkaya]

Thanks, Peter and Dan:

Wow! $54 for a 4x8 sheet sounds great. I have just started buying both gator and miracle muck so it must have been a supply issue since it took so long with the adhesive. Kind of wish they would have let me know, but oh well..... And yes, the freeze issue was described on their website and that was why I was getting concerned about it.....still nice in Ohio ~ likely in PA too ~ but there is some cold weather coming this weekend. They did ship late this past week, thank goodness. I ordered one 2 gallon to start..... so will have to look for a a warmer weather window to get a winter supply! Good idea.

I will check artgrafix.net, Peter. Thanks for the recommendation with them. I'm new to buying these materials but find myself more and more wanting to mount prints with adhesive and gator looks like the best option currently since it stays flat.

I bought some 32x40 sheets of gator through Blick; I get my mat board from them and they are great with fast shipping and good packaging ~ but cheaper prices for the gator mean less cost to customers so more sales!!

Thanks again guys:)
Ron