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Author Topic: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera  (Read 1819 times)

ThomasMagno

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Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« on: May 25, 2020, 04:24:30 pm »

I would like some input. Using a Phase 50 mp cmos back. But may be using a 100mp Phase in the near future. Best choice: Rodenstock APO-Sironar digital 120, SCHNEIDER APO-Digitar 120 M, Schneider APO-Digitar 120 N, Schneider ASPH 120 or any other variation that’s out there’re?

I have a Schneider (non-digital) (not macro) APO 120 L that is working quite well. I just tested a Schneider  Makro-Symmar 120 HM (not digital) That was actually Not as sharp.

Help needed.
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matted

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #1 on: May 26, 2020, 09:06:59 pm »

If you can find one, the Schneider 120 ASPH is very good at macro as well as non-closeup ranges. I wish I bought one for my technical camera when I had the chance as they are very much in demand now. I use a Schneider 120 M on my view camera and it is very good at closeup ranges, but I haven’t compared it to any of the others mentioned. The 120 “N” is ill suited to close up ranges so I would avoid that one for your intended purpose. I don’t think you could go wrong with the others.
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TechTalk

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2020, 09:59:48 pm »

I would like some input. Using a Phase 50 mp cmos back. But may be using a 100mp Phase in the near future. Best choice: Rodenstock APO-Sironar digital 120, SCHNEIDER APO-Digitar 120 M, Schneider APO-Digitar 120 N, Schneider ASPH 120 or any other variation that’s out there’re?

I have a Schneider (non-digital) (not macro) APO 120 L that is working quite well. I just tested a Schneider  Makro-Symmar 120 HM (not digital) That was actually Not as sharp.

Help needed.

what distance/magnification range?
« Last Edit: May 28, 2020, 07:25:38 pm by TechTalk »
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ben730

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2020, 03:55:28 am »

Hi Thomas
I have never used the Schneiders but I use the APO-Sironar digital 120 with a 50 MP CMOS Back on a Cambo Ultima 23.
The lens is very sharp with a huge image circle (I never had to go to the limit).
I can recommend it.

Regards,
Ben

Doug Peterson

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2020, 09:08:48 am »

The Schneider 120mm ASPH is, in my biased opinion, the very best option for this until you get to around 1:1 magnification. This lens does continue to perform very well beyond 1:1, but the Rodenstock 105HR is even better as you get to magnifications like 2:1 or 3:1.

DT is the only company that still commissions stand-alone Schneider 120mm ASPH lens cells and has new inventory thereof, and we primarily use them for our Cultural Heritage products. However, you're always welcome to contact one of our sales team to inquire about purchasing this lens as a stand alone product.

ConnorRay

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2020, 12:40:00 pm »

I have been planning to ask you @ Digital Transition if it's possible to buy the Schneider 120mm ASPH from you? I initially wanted to buy the both the SK60XL and the SK120ASPH but could only afford the SK60XL before stock ran out.

It would also be nice if Schneider made a batch for other resellers (Like Linhof Studio) or if Phase One could buy some and release them with the new shutter for the XT.
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Doug Peterson

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2020, 03:48:45 pm »

I have been planning to ask you @ Digital Transition if it's possible to buy the Schneider 120mm ASPH from you?

Yep, email info@digitaltransitions.com or your DT sales person if you already work with us.

TechTalk

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2020, 08:27:59 pm »

The only lens in your list that I've used is the Schneider 120mm f/5.6 Apo Digitar M Lens. I used it for images in the 1:2 to 2:1 range and it was superb for that use.

I tested it at lower magnification for tabletop work and my experience was perhaps similar to yours in your testing of the APO 120mm L compared to the Makro-Symmar 120mm HM. I found that the macro lens tended to lose sharpness fairly quickly as I moved further from the range it was designed for which is 1:4 to 4:1 (optimized at 1:1). I got better results with a standard lens until I was approaching the 1:4 magnification range. If you are flexible regarding the focal length, there are a number of excellent non-macro lenses in the 100mm to 135mm range.

I didn't use it over a long period of time or do extensive testing or comparison. This was also several years ago. So, your experience may vary from mine. I'll be curious as to what you find.

My general impression is that the APO 120mm L lens, that you have is a fine lens for "close-up" work until you get down into those higher magnification ratios. I would expect the newer generations of lenses of similar design would be better; it's a question of how much better. The Schneider 120mm ASPH does have the reputation of being the best of the best in its category.

It may be helpful, in getting useful feedback from others, to know how much magnification you need for the close-up usage you intend. If it's helpful to you, here's a link to specs for the discontinued Schneider Digitar lenses.  https://www.arca-swiss-magasin.com/contents/fr/digitare_e.pdf

And a description from Schneider of the APO 120mm L lens that you have... https://www.walkercameras.com/lenses/s_wide_56120.html
« Last Edit: May 28, 2020, 11:44:15 pm by TechTalk »
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ThomasMagno

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2020, 06:56:46 am »

Thanks for this input. I have after talking to a few people and more research concluded that for 1:3 up I think what I have is not a bad choice. But the 120 ASPH would be an improvement. The only problem is finding one. Digital Transitions does not have them in Copal shutters. So the search goes on.
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ThomasMagno

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2020, 07:59:55 am »

This question is for Doug. Did you test the Rodenstock 120 APO Macro Sironar for your Cultural Heritage system? And did you determine that the Schneider 120 ASPH performed better in those ranges? Specially in digitizing 6x6, 6x9, 4x5 transparencies and negatives?
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ben730

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Re: Which 120mm for tabletop to close up on view camera
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2020, 01:25:50 pm »

Thomas
Maybe you should also consider the Schneider Macro AF 120 mm BlueRing with the XF.
This lens is very sharp with a beautiful bokeh and with the XF you can easily focus stacking.
Regards,
Ben
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