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Author Topic: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political  (Read 208975 times)

Robert Roaldi

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6220 on: July 16, 2020, 10:37:10 am »

Maybe we're looking at this all wrong. Maybe more companies should be getting Trump to shill their products for them in the oval office. Maybe we could get him to pose with bottles of maple syrup at his desk. Or maybe he'd drive down the block in a Toyota. What brand of smartphone does he use to tweet? He may be missing out on lots of opportunities to cash in on his time in office. Canon/Nikon/Sony? Isn't there an old picture of the Queen holding a Rollei 35?
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6221 on: July 16, 2020, 10:43:29 am »

And so the campaign goes, https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/507592-trump-shakes-up-campaign-leadership-demotes-parscale.

To the tune of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE.

In my first IT job out of school in 1977, I worked for a small company of about 20 employees. I was there 18 months and by the time I left, I was the 4th most senior person in the office. And there were several people who started and left during the time I was there. I thought THAT was a lot of turnover.

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Robert

kers

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6222 on: July 16, 2020, 10:46:29 am »

I think it would be fair to Alan if Trump would say what a great photograper he is...
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6223 on: July 16, 2020, 10:47:55 am »

Loyalty tests now, https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/15/trump-appointees-loyalty-interviews-364616.

These interviews aren't necessarily with campaign or white house workers or even party members. They're interviewing civil service appointees gauging their loyalty to Trump. Shouldn't their loyalty be to the country or the constitution or something, or maybe loyalty to their field of study/service?

Isn't this a little Soviet?
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Alan Klein

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6224 on: July 16, 2020, 11:07:17 am »

Maybe we're looking at this all wrong. Maybe more companies should be getting Trump to shill their products for them in the oval office. Maybe we could get him to pose with bottles of maple syrup at his desk. Or maybe he'd drive down the block in a Toyota. What brand of smartphone does he use to tweet? He may be missing out on lots of opportunities to cash in on his time in office. Canon/Nikon/Sony? Isn't there an old picture of the Queen holding a Rollei 35?
The Clintons rented out the Lincoln bedroom to guests for overnight stays in the White House if you contributed to their campaign over a certain amount.  When they left the White House when his terms were up, they walked out with the dishes and were made to return them to the White House.  If Hillary had won, they would have had another chance at the silverware.
https://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1997/02/25/clinton.money/

Craig Lamson

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6225 on: July 16, 2020, 11:28:38 am »

Maybe we're looking at this all wrong. Maybe more companies should be getting Trump to shill their products for them in the oval office. Maybe we could get him to pose with bottles of maple syrup at his desk. Or maybe he'd drive down the block in a Toyota. What brand of smartphone does he use to tweet? He may be missing out on lots of opportunities to cash in on his time in office. Canon/Nikon/Sony? Isn't there an old picture of the Queen holding a Rollei 35?

Odds are Trump is losing money being President...
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hogloff

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6226 on: July 16, 2020, 12:10:11 pm »

Odds are Trump is losing money being President...

My understanding is Trump lost money all his life. If it wasn't for daddy...Trump would be flipping burgers.
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6227 on: July 16, 2020, 12:13:38 pm »

The Clintons rented out the Lincoln bedroom to guests for overnight stays in the White House if you contributed to their campaign over a certain amount.  When they left the White House when his terms were up, they walked out with the dishes and were made to return them to the White House.  If Hillary had won, they would have had another chance at the silverware.
https://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1997/02/25/clinton.money/

Yup, it's the Clinton's fault. Or wait, I thought it was Obama's fault. Or maybe FDR's? I"m sure someone's to blame.
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faberryman

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6228 on: July 16, 2020, 12:18:24 pm »

The Clintons rented out the Lincoln bedroom to guests for overnight stays in the White House if you contributed to their campaign over a certain amount.  When they left the White House when his terms were up, they walked out with the dishes and were made to return them to the White House.  If Hillary had won, they would have had another chance at the silverware.
https://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1997/02/25/clinton.money/

I know you want to talk about the Clintons, what with your previous references to TravelGate (1993) and the Seth Rich pardon (2000), and now the references to the Lincoln bedroom (1997) and stealing the White House china (2001), but I have no interest in discussing them, either pro or con. Been there, done that, moved on. It is just whataboutism, which by the way is a logical fallacy in itself, just like ad hominen, non sequitur, red herring, and all the rest.  The fact that Jeffery Dalmer murdered people and then ate them does not excuse Dylann Ruff for murdering nine black people in a church in Charleston during a bible study class. Simply put, the Clinton wrongdoings, and there were many, do not excuse any of Trump's behavior.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 02:55:36 pm by faberryman »
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faberryman

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6229 on: July 16, 2020, 01:21:21 pm »

Trump demoted Brad Pascale, his campaign manager, and replaced him with Bill Stepien. Trump's poll numbers are tanking and it has to be someone else's fault. Pascale argued that the polls on TV are fake, and his internal polls show Trump well ahead, especially in swing states, to no avail.  Besides, Trump has a thing for facial hair. Bolton didn't last long either. Stepien's claim to fame is that he was Chris Christie's campaign manager and involved in the Bridgegate scandal. Many people say that he has agreed not to wear a mask in Jacksonville.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXDXvPWxBeI
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 02:52:23 pm by faberryman »
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MattBurt

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6230 on: July 16, 2020, 01:27:29 pm »

Trump demoted Brad Pascale, his campaign manager, and replaced him with Bill Stepien. Trump's poll numbers are tanking and it has to be someone else's fault.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXDXvPWxBeI

It's EVERYONE ELSE's fault. Always!

"Mistakes are always forgivable, if one has the courage to admit them." - Bruce Lee
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TechTalk

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6231 on: July 16, 2020, 02:29:58 pm »

Really not that hard when you know the context.

Criminals from Mexico who came in under Obama/Biden did not get shipped back to Mexico because Mexico would not take them, would not let the buses in or the planes land.

Now under the Trump adminstration Mexico takes them back. 

And maybe someday Trump will tell you why.

Yes, they left out the context.  If they watched the actual speech instead of just reading CNN's or MSNBC's cherry picked bias, they would have understood the
context. 

Trump was not talking about Mexico. Yet, you accuse others of not understanding context. Why?
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Craig Lamson

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6232 on: July 16, 2020, 02:31:31 pm »

Trump was not talking about Mexico. Yet, you accuse others of not understanding context. Why?

Ok then tell us all what he was talking about, I'm willing to learn.

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faberryman

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6233 on: July 16, 2020, 02:49:11 pm »

Georgia Gov. Brian Kemp bans local governments from mandating masks

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/georgia-gov-brian-kemp-bans-local-governments-mandating-masks-n1234046

This just a power play. Kemp (Georgia) had not issued an executive order requiring masks. Many mayors thought that was nuts, so they enacted the requirement at the local level. Kemp wanted the last word so he issued an executive order overriding the mayors. I heard that some people think that the whole mask thing has been politicized. Meanwhile, sources close to the governor say he has seat belts and motorcycle helmets on the radar. There are too many people living in Georgia already.

Edit: The mayors have indicated that they are going to challenge the governors order. It might be interesting to try and guess what the death toll will be when everyone stops bickering about masks. We currently are at circa 138,000.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 05:22:19 pm by faberryman »
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TechTalk

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6234 on: July 16, 2020, 03:02:11 pm »

Ok then tell us all what he was talking about, I'm willing to learn.

Quote from White House Transcript (no "CNN's or MSNBC's cherry picked bias") "Cancel all asylum cooperation agreements in the Western Hemisphere.  Well, we have agreements with Honduras, Guatemala, with El Salvador.  We have great agreements, where, when Biden and Obama used to bring killers out, they would say, “Don’t bring them back to our country.  We don’t want them.”  “Well, we have to.”  We don’t want them; they wouldn’t take them.  Now, with us, they take them.  Someday I’ll tell you why.  Someday I’ll tell you why.  But they take them, and they take them very gladly."

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-press-conference-071420/

He was talking about asylum agreements with Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador. Not deporting criminals from Mexico.

Here's a fact check of what Trump said about Obama and deportation when he was running in 2016.

Trump: ""Nobody knows about it, nobody talks about it, but under Obama, millions of people have been moved out of this country, they've been deported."

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2016/oct/21/trump right obama deportation numbers/wrong nobody talks about it
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faberryman

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6235 on: July 16, 2020, 03:17:12 pm »

Here's a fact check of what Trump said about Obama and deportation when he was running in 2016.

Trump: ""Nobody knows about it, nobody talks about it, but under Obama, millions of people have been moved out of this country, they've been deported."

I wonder where they went?
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Craig Lamson

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6236 on: July 16, 2020, 03:20:14 pm »

Quote from White House Transcript (no "CNN's or MSNBC's cherry picked bias") "Cancel all asylum cooperation agreements in the Western Hemisphere.  Well, we have agreements with Honduras, Guatemala, with El Salvador.  We have great agreements, where, when Biden and Obama used to bring killers out, they would say, “Don’t bring them back to our country.  We don’t want them.”  “Well, we have to.”  We don’t want them; they wouldn’t take them.  Now, with us, they take them.  Someday I’ll tell you why.  Someday I’ll tell you why.  But they take them, and they take them very gladly."

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-press-conference-071420/

He was talking about asylum agreements with Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador. Not deporting criminals from Mexico.

Here's a fact check of what Trump said about Obama and deportation when he was running in 2016.

Trump: ""Nobody knows about it, nobody talks about it, but under Obama, millions of people have been moved out of this country, they've been deported."

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2016/oct/21/trump right obama deportation numbers/wrong nobody talks about it

Did you see the words Western Hemispere?

Last I knew, Mexico fits in that little group. Are we bussing illegals back into Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador from the US?    Are we bussing them back to Mexico? 

From the same source:

"They used to bring them out and they wouldn’t even let the airplanes land if they brought them back by airplanes.  They wouldn’t let the buses into their country.  They said, “We don’t want them.”  I said, “No, but they entered our country illegally.”  And they’re murderers; they’re killers, in some cases.  And they said, “Nope, we don’t want them.”  They’d turn the bus around, they’d turn the plane around, and they’d land in the United States, and who knows what happened to them, but it wasn’t good."

Clearly he was talking about criminals as well as others, and as far as I know the only place south of the border where we use buses to return illegal criminals and other is Mexico.   So he was taking about Mexico as well.  But of course if I have that wrong, I'll be happy to be enlightened.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 04:01:27 pm by Craig Lamson »
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Alan Klein

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6237 on: July 16, 2020, 03:39:47 pm »

I know you want to talk about the Clintons, what with your previous references to TravelGate (1993) and the Seth Rich pardon (2000), and now the references to the Lincoln bedroom (1997) and stealing the White House china (2001), but I have no interest in discussing them, either pro or con. Been there, done that, moved on. It is just whataboutism, which by the way is a logical fallacy in itself, just like ad hominen, non sequitur, red herring, and all the rest.  The fact that Jeffery Dalmer murdered people and then ate them does not excuse Dylann Ruff for murdering nine black people in a church in Charleston during a bible study class. Simply put, the Clinton wrongdoings, and there were many, do not excuse any of Trump's behavior.

You missed my point.  I should have been clearer.  I raised the point about the Clinton's corruptness because in 2016, Hillary Clinton was running against Trump.  That was one of the two candidates we had to choose from.  Voting for Trump was the better choice.  Whatever finagling he did was done in private life before he became a politician.  The Clintons were crooks as politicians and used their positions to get rich.   Likewise, we're going to have a choice in November.  Vote for a non-politician, who's tough and takes no prisoners to fight for America, or a guy who believes in nothing other than he wants to be president, who's changed his position on everything he ever believed in, who will help turn AMerica into a socialist state and who does not have the wherewithals to defend America against some pretty mean people and countries. 

Chris Kern

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6238 on: July 16, 2020, 03:47:11 pm »

These interviews aren't necessarily with campaign or white house workers or even party members. They're interviewing civil service appointees gauging their loyalty to Trump.

No, they're not.  They are interviewing federal political appointees: individuals who serve at the pleasure of the current national administration and who are expected to offer to resign when that administration ends; if they fail to do so, they may be summarily dismissed by the next Administration (even if it is of the same political party and even if it is headed by a re-elected president).

Federal civil service employees in the United States are career employees.  They are required by law to behave in an apolitical manner, they serve regardless of what party is in power, and they are expected as professionals to implement the policies of the incumbent administration regardless of their personal political opinions.  A variety of statutory and regulatory mechanisms exist to protect them from political manipulation.  These are mostly effective, although I have witnessed occasional attempts―most flagrantly, in my experience, during the administration of President Ronald Reagan―to circumvent those protections.  Civil service job applicants typically are hired by career civil servants, not by political appointees, and asking questions regarding the applicant's political views or requiring a political profession of loyalty is likely to result in the dismissal of the hiring official.

I have seen a number of instances where career employees, at their own initiative, attempted to ingratiate themselves with administration appointees by expressing personal political loyalty.  But they tended to be shunned thereafter by their colleagues.  Most left the government before too long.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 04:02:02 pm by Chris Kern »
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Alan Klein

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Re: PLAYPEN: Covid-19 Everything Political
« Reply #6239 on: July 16, 2020, 04:02:39 pm »

No, they're not.  They are interviewing federal political appointees: individuals who serve at the pleasure of the current national administration and who are expected to offer to resign when that Administration ends; if they fail to do so, they may be summarily dismissed by the next Administration (even if it is of the same political party and even if it is headed by a re-elected president).

Federal civil service employees in the United States are career employees.  They are required by law to behave in an apolitical manner, they serve regardless of what party is in power, and they are expected as professionals to implement the policies of the incumbent administration regardless of their personal political opinions.  A variety of statutory and regulatory mechanisms exist to protect them from political manipulation.  These are mostly effective, although I have witnessed occasional attempts―most flagrantly, in my experience, during the administration of President Ronald Reagan―to circumvent those protections.  Civil service job applicants typically are hired by career civil servants, not by political appointees, and asking questions regarding the applicant's political views or requiring a political profession of loyalty is likely to result in the dismissal of the hiring official.

I have seen a number of instances where career employees, at their own initiative, attempted to ingratiate themselves with administration appointees by expressing personal political loyalty.  But they tended to be shunned thereafter by their colleagues.  Most left the government before too long.
Unfortunately, many civil servants think they have a license to practice politics as we saw in the FBI regarding the FISA court, Russian dossier and other investigations.  These were political in nature, a very dangerous thing for our democracy.  Confidential records are released all the time to the press to embarrass administrations and stir up trouble.  It weakens our diplomacy and makes us less secure.  Then the culprits get fired or retire, and they go on to make millions writing a book.  And these are not limited to one party or the other. 
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