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Author Topic: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS  (Read 87526 times)

Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2340 on: August 26, 2020, 08:17:27 am »

Silencing? John didn't suggest silencing, he suggested not listening. You're confused.
Hide like an ostrich.

Peter McLennan

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2341 on: August 26, 2020, 09:17:50 am »

That's the solution the left always proposes. Silence those who don't agree with your point of view.

And yet, that’s precisely what you did when proven wrong in the thread about Los Angeles and desertification.
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2342 on: August 26, 2020, 10:00:35 am »

And yet, that’s precisely what you did when proven wrong in the thread about Los Angeles and desertification.
I didn't silence anyone.  I made my points; others made theirs.

Paulo Bizarro

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2343 on: August 26, 2020, 10:01:30 am »

Poor and inadequate measures for the containment of Covid-19 lead to a devastating impact on health and the economy.

Impact to health and economy

I do not remember now the source, but I read a few months back that in the 1918-20 pandemic, the countries who recovered economically first werethe ones that had managed the health part better.

Saving as manylives as possible isalways good, at the bare minimum from a morale perspective - people will feel safer when returning slowly to "normal" living. This will take a long time, the WHO estimates around 2 years for the effect of the virus to diminish. Going from pandemic to endemic.

Good article, thanks for sharing.

Robert Roaldi

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2344 on: August 26, 2020, 11:07:03 am »

I didn't silence anyone.  I made my points; others made theirs.

Well, if people have been trying to silence you, they haven't been very successful, have they? I don't think you have anything to fear on that score.
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2345 on: August 27, 2020, 07:59:08 am »


I do not remember now the source, but I read a few months back that in the 1918-20 pandemic, the countries who recovered economically first werethe ones that had managed the health part better.

Saving as manylives as possible isalways good, at the bare minimum from a morale perspective - people will feel safer when returning slowly to "normal" living. This will take a long time, the WHO estimates around 2 years for the effect of the virus to diminish. Going from pandemic to endemic.

Good article, thanks for sharing.
It wasn't managed very well. It lasted four years. The second year was much worse than the first year. The third was third worse but much less than the first.   The fourth year was the least bad as most people did not die but only had symptoms.  The dynamic American economic system is what helped us recover as we entered the Roaring Twenties despite the fact the disease had killed millions.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2020, 08:07:15 am by Alan Klein »
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LesPalenik

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2346 on: August 27, 2020, 10:10:06 am »

Never mind the old pandemic. I just found out that Covid-19 kills more men than women.

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In the public data set, the number of men who died from COVID-19 is 2.4 times that of women (70.3 vs. 29.7%, P = 0.016). In SARS patients, the gender role in mortality was also observed. The percentage of males were higher in the deceased group than in the survived group (P = 0.015).

Conclusion: While men and women have the same prevalence, men with COVID-19 are more at risk for worse outcomes and death, independent of age.

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2020.00152/full#:~:text=In%20the%20public%20data%20set,group%20(P%20%3D%200.015).
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2347 on: August 27, 2020, 10:59:36 am »

Never mind the old pandemic. I just found out that Covid-19 kills more men than women.

https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2020.00152/full#:~:text=In%20the%20public%20data%20set,group%20(P%20%3D%200.015).
There are four times as many women as men living in the assisted living facility where my 97 year old mother-in-law lives.  I did a tally one day in the cafeteria where everyone was eating.  I believe this is pretty much standard for these places.  Since most of the COvid deaths came from people living in these type facilities, your fact that men died at a rate of 70% vs 30% for women, means that there might not be any men left in these facilities.  Not that these elderly ladies notice for the most part.  :)

kers

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2348 on: August 28, 2020, 07:28:53 pm »

AiAi Infections in Europe are rising: especially in France : over 7000 new infected in a single day!
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Pieter Kers
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Peter McLennan

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2349 on: August 28, 2020, 08:03:45 pm »

I didn't silence anyone.  I made my points; others made theirs.

But you did "hide like an ostrich."
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Robert Roaldi

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2350 on: September 04, 2020, 09:27:19 pm »

According to Worldometer, the US has had just over 192,000 Covid deaths and is still consistently experiencing just over 1000 per day. If these numbers stay at or near that level, the US will hit 200,000 by mid-September or so. Brazil and India are both catching up quickly with a steady 1000+ deaths per day at the moment, with Brazil at 125,000+ deaths.
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elliot_n

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2351 on: September 05, 2020, 06:49:36 am »

If these numbers stay at or near that level, the US will hit 200,000 by mid-September or so.

IHME are forecasting 410,000 US deaths by the end of the year.

https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america?view=total-deaths&tab=trend
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2352 on: September 05, 2020, 09:55:19 am »

deleted
« Last Edit: September 05, 2020, 10:05:38 am by Alan Klein »
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armand

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2353 on: September 05, 2020, 11:12:53 am »

One should be careful not to focus to much just on deaths, many who were quite sick but survive don't live very happily after.

LesPalenik

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2354 on: September 05, 2020, 03:23:16 pm »

One should be careful not to focus to much just on deaths, many who were quite sick but survive don't live very happily after.

That's true. Since C19 leaves permanent damage on various organs, infected people could heal from the virus, but later die from heart failure, cancer or diabetes.
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Jeremy Roussak

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2355 on: September 06, 2020, 04:14:18 am »

That's true. Since C19 leaves permanent damage on various organs, infected people could heal from the virus, but later die from heart failure, cancer or diabetes.

We can be absolutely certain that everyone infected will die in due course; and those are undoubtedly three possible causes. I'm unaware of any evidence that late onset heart failure, cancer or diabetes can be said, or even hypothesised, to be due to Covid infection: does any exist?

Jeremy
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LesPalenik

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2356 on: September 06, 2020, 07:14:14 am »

We can be absolutely certain that everyone infected will die in due course; and those are undoubtedly three possible causes. I'm unaware of any evidence that late onset heart failure, cancer or diabetes can be said, or even hypothesised, to be due to Covid infection: does any exist?

Jeremy

There is plenty of such evidence. Just google "long term health effects of covid 19". 
Below is an excerpt of an article from Science Magazine.

Quote
The list of lingering maladies from COVID-19 is longer and more varied than most doctors could have imagined. Ongoing problems include fatigue, a racing heartbeat, shortness of breath, achy joints, foggy thinking, a persistent loss of sense of smell, and damage to the heart, lungs, kidneys, and brain.

The likelihood of a patient developing persistent symptoms is hard to pin down because different studies track different outcomes and follow survivors for different lengths of time. One group in Italy found that 87% of a patient cohort hospitalized for acute COVID-19 was still struggling 2 months later. Data from the COVID Symptom Study, which uses an app into which millions of people in the United States, United Kingdom, and Sweden have tapped their symptoms, suggest 10% to 15% of people—including some “mild” cases—don’t quickly recover. But with the crisis just months old, no one knows how far into the future symptoms will endure, and whether COVID-19 will prompt the onset of chronic diseases.

Despite the novelty of SARS-CoV-2, its long-term effects have precedents: Infections with other pathogens are associated with lasting impacts ranging from heart problems to chronic fatigue. “Medicine has been used to dealing with this problem” of acute viral illness followed by ongoing symptoms, says Michael Zandi, a neurologist at UCL. Even common illnesses such as pneumonia can mean a monthslong recovery. “I see a lot of people who had [the brain inflammation] encephalitis 3, 4 years ago, and still can’t think, or are tired,” Zandi says. Infections with certain bacteria and Zika virus, among others, are linked to Guillain-Barre syndrome, in which the immune system attacks nerve tissue, causing tingling, weakness, and paralysis.

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/07/brain-fog-heart-damage-covid-19-s-lingering-problems-alarm-scientists

Even though 80 per cent of people get mild cases, 20% of people do experience more serious effects that can last for months or years and can lead to permanent disability and premature death. The research into the long term effects of the virus has barely started. We should know more about it next year.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30701-5/fulltext
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Alan Klein

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2357 on: September 06, 2020, 08:42:35 am »

We just had a scare with my 97 year old mother-i-0law. Seems she tested positive and was isolated in her assisted living home facility.  My wife was a nervous wreck.  I wasn't happy either as my wife saw her just a couple of days before the test results were known.  Three days later they did another test that showed her negative.  They do tests on the residents once a week here in New Jersey. In any case I'm scheduled for an antibody test on Tuesday, but I feel fine. 

So now they're pushing the regular flu shot.  But I bet this will be the best year for the least amount of flu cases since everyone's isolating and using masks because of the Covid.  I just realized that neither my wife nor I have had a common cold since this thing started six months ago.  I'm sure it's because we've isolated or protected ourselves.  What's been you experience with this? Maybe this is why Asians tend to live longer than us Westerners. Masks and isolation when they get sick.

chez

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2358 on: September 06, 2020, 10:27:49 am »

Maybe this is why Asians tend to live longer than us Westerners. Masks and isolation when they get sick.

Or maybe Asians eat a healthier diet and excersise more than the west. During my travels, I've never seen the all you can eat buffets with lineups at the troughs. I also believe the Asian culture believes in preventive medicine using natural methods than the North American chemical drugs onslaught after one gets ill.
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Chris Kern

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Re: COVID-19 | science, damage limitation, NO POLITICS
« Reply #2359 on: September 06, 2020, 10:56:26 am »

Interesting reporting in the New York Times by Julian Barnes and Michael Venutolo-Mantovani about the attempts by intelligence operatives reporting to China, Russia, and Iran to collect information about corporate and academic research into the creation of a SARS-CoV-2 vaccine and the counterespionage efforts to thwart them.

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The coronavirus pandemic has prompted one of the fastest peacetime mission shifts in recent times for the world’s intelligence agencies, pitting them against one another in a new grand game of spy versus spy, according to interviews with current and former intelligence officials and others tracking the espionage efforts.
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