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Author Topic: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts  (Read 2082 times)

Manoli

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #20 on: May 20, 2019, 05:52:31 am »

LR is not really zooming the image. It is just applying a crop marquee that only LR will respect, and you can change afterwards in Post. If you open the DNG in any other raw converter, the zoom setting will be discarded.

Dear Francisco,

I've no desire to engage in a handbags-at-dawn exchange with you, and I'm "happy that you're happy" but that does little to enlighten us. Apple, I'm told, does not allow access to RAW data for the telephoto lens, only the wide-angle. I've passed on info communicated directly from 2 developers via personal email. I've given you the date Apple effected the restriction, it seems abundantly obvious that that limitation still exists. Your post above just confirms this and repeats what I've posted above.

Some developers have circumvented these limitations ( and I agree that the reason 'why' re the EXIF data is not immediately apparent). Moment adheres to Apple guidelines - try zooming in RAW and you'll get a message 'zoom not supported in RAW capture". (see attached)
Others have bypassed restrictions by using a jpeg as well (?) . Halide call it smart RAW.  What exactly is involved I dunno, for sure it's not pure RAW as we been accustomed to and of necessity the shot has already been demosaiced .

If you have factual info to contradict this please educate me - I'll be grateful.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2019, 05:56:15 am by Manoli »
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Manoli

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #21 on: May 20, 2019, 05:53:04 am »

... like every mobile phone "telephoto" camera that I know of, it achieves its narrower field of view with the combination of a longer focal length and a smaller sensor ...

Moving on, it seems that the Huawei w/ Leica optics smartphone has moved up a gear by employing "field-of-view fusion" zoom, using super-resolution algos (up to 3x), and a 5x zoom with technology referred to as 'folded optics'.  Interesting qualitative comparison w/ the Apple Xs at DxOMark.  https://www.dxomark.com/huawei-p30-pro-camera-review/

Expect to see a a variant of this in the 2019 iPhone expected later this year.
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fdisilvestro

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #22 on: May 20, 2019, 07:26:04 am »

Dear Francisco,

I've no desire to engage in a handbags-at-dawn exchange with you, and I'm "happy that you're happy" but that does little to enlighten us. Apple, I'm told, does not allow access to RAW data for the telephoto lens, only the wide-angle. I've passed on info communicated directly from 2 developers via personal email. I've given you the date Apple effected the restriction, it seems abundantly obvious that that limitation still exists. Your post above just confirms this and repeats what I've posted above.

Some developers have circumvented these limitations ( and I agree that the reason 'why' re the EXIF data is not immediately apparent). Moment adheres to Apple guidelines - try zooming in RAW and you'll get a message 'zoom not supported in RAW capture". (see attached)
Others have bypassed restrictions by using a jpeg as well (?) . Halide call it smart RAW.  What exactly is involved I dunno, for sure it's not pure RAW as we been accustomed to and of necessity the shot has already been demosaiced .

If you have factual info to contradict this please educate me - I'll be grateful.

My proof is the DNG files generated by the LR camera. Here is an example, but just in case these images were taken with a iPhone 7 Plus with iOS 12.2 and LR v. 4.3.0

1.- I took two images with the 6.6mm tele lens (should be called normal), one straight and the second with a 200% zoom and here is how they look in LR

First image - no zoom



Second image: 200% zoom



Note that both images have the same size, and the second shows a smaller "Cropped dimension"

2.- When I go to the develop module and open the crop tool you can see that all LR does when zooming is applying a crop, nothing else, and that's why you don't receive the warning in LR



Now is it an undemosaiced raw or a linear raw?

First evidence: Open the image (the zoomed one, but it would be the same with any) in RawDigger and the EXIF shows "Parametric Interpretation: Color Filter Array". You will not get this message it it were linear raw



Second evidence: Open the image in RawTherapee and go to the demosaicing tab and it shows "Sensor with Bayer Matrix" and you can choose the demosaicing algorithm of your liking. Try to do that with a linear raw



So. Yes, LR Produces a UNDEMOSAICED RAW from the iPhone tele lens and zoom is just a CROP (Metadata), it does not affect the raw image.

I don't know if Adobe has any special agreement with Apple, but this is real, try LR if you don't believe me.

Aram Hăvărneanu

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #23 on: May 20, 2019, 07:51:32 am »

The two cameras used two different sensors with different crop factors.
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Manoli

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #24 on: May 20, 2019, 08:29:08 am »

Francesco,

Yes, thank you for that.
No doubt that that's accessing the tele lens.
I've already emailed one developer asking for an update. If I get any feed back I'll post it here.
I'm wondering why the discrepancy between apps - however no point speculating, so I'll wait for the reply.

Thanks again,
Best,
M

One question, how do you select the tele lens on your 7 in Lr - Is there a 2x zoom button on the UI ?
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fdisilvestro

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2019, 08:57:20 am »


One question, how do you select the tele lens on your 7 in Lr - Is there a 2x zoom button on the UI ?

Hi Manoli, thanks for your comment. in the LR camera there is toggle button that has an icon of a lens and you toggle between T (tele) and W (Wide). You can see how they look in the following image (highlighted with red arrows)

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2019, 01:46:15 pm »

... Second image: 200% zoom

Note that both images have the same size, and the second shows a smaller "Cropped dimension"

2.- When I go to the develop module and open the crop tool you can see that all LR does when zooming is applying a crop, nothing else, and that's why you don't receive the warning in LR...

Just to make sure there is no misunderstanding: when you talk about 200% zoom, that is not the same as selecting the tele lens/camera, right?

fdisilvestro

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Re: Confused About iPhone XS Max Focal Lenghts
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2019, 02:48:45 pm »

Just to make sure there is no misunderstanding: when you talk about 200% zoom, that is not the same as selecting the tele lens/camera, right?

Right, I selected the Tele lens and on top of that zoomed into the image. I should have chosen a value different than 200% to avoid the confusion.
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