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Author Topic: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?  (Read 10379 times)

digitaldog

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #120 on: July 27, 2019, 11:49:27 am »

I run mine at 150cd/m2 and 350:1 so our targets are closer.
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Andrew Rodney
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dchew

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #121 on: July 27, 2019, 12:17:16 pm »

I also tried 140cd/m2 and 350:1. Those results are almost as good; avg 0.61 max 1.00.

Thanks again for your help, Andrew.

Dave
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smthopr

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #122 on: July 27, 2019, 03:22:20 pm »

I run mine at 150cd/m2 and 350:1 so our targets are closer.

Andrew, this seems to me a very bright screen for editing photographs.  Might you explain your thinking on choosing this approach?  Are you working in very brightly lit rooms?
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Bruce Alan Greene
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digitaldog

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #123 on: July 27, 2019, 03:39:18 pm »

Andrew, this seems to me a very bright screen for editing photographs.  Might you explain your thinking on choosing this approach?  Are you working in very brightly lit rooms?
Simple: matches my viewing booth.
 http://digitaldog.net/files/Print_to_Screen_Matching.jpg
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Andrew Rodney
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Frans Waterlander

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #124 on: July 27, 2019, 06:09:38 pm »

Simple: matches my viewing booth.
 http://digitaldog.net/files/Print_to_Screen_Matching.jpg


Andrew, what's the purpose of the task light in addition to the viewing booth? You probably don't use both at the same time, right?
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digitaldog

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #125 on: July 27, 2019, 06:29:55 pm »

I also tried 140cd/m2 and 350:1. Those results are almost as good; avg 0.61 max 1.00.

Thanks again for your help, Andrew.

Dave
I wouldn't alter you calibration targets just for a better report. If you can alter them and Print viewing conditions and are still happy with the results, that's okay.
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Andrew Rodney
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dchew

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #126 on: July 27, 2019, 07:03:46 pm »

I wouldn't alter you calibration targets just for a better report. If you can alter them and Print viewing conditions and are still happy with the results, that's okay.

Actually, that's why I went back up to 140cd/m2. I like the monitor a little brighter than the usual 120-ish. My prints are generally lit pretty well where they end up.

Dave
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digitaldog

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #127 on: July 27, 2019, 07:28:55 pm »

Actually, that's why I went back up to 140cd/m2. I like the monitor a little brighter than the usual 120-ish. My prints are generally lit pretty well where they end up.

Dave
Indeed, the 120cd/m2 "recommendation" urban legend has to cease; nothing special about that setting. Might be ideal, might not. Ditto with White Point. The numbers vary.
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Andrew Rodney
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smthopr

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #128 on: July 28, 2019, 11:45:52 am »

Simple: matches my viewing booth.
 http://digitaldog.net/files/Print_to_Screen_Matching.jpg

If your viewing booth is so bright, are you also displaying prints in a very bright environment?  I understand that you're getting a good match, but, from my experience, most prints are viewed in darker conditions.  But, maybe my experience is not usual?
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Bruce Alan Greene
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digitaldog

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #129 on: July 28, 2019, 11:55:06 am »

If your viewing booth is so bright, are you also displaying prints in a very bright environment?
Doesn't matter where the prints are viewed after seeing them under the viewing booth to result in visual match of display + booth. Our eyes adapt and a match isn't the goal any longer. This is all outlined in my video:

Why are my prints too dark?
A video update to a written piece on subject from 2013
In this 24 minute video, I'll cover:

Are your prints really too dark?
Display calibration and WYSIWYG
Proper print viewing conditions
Trouble shooting to get a match
Avoiding kludges that don't solve the problem


High resolution: http://digitaldog.net/files/Why_are_my_prints_too_dark.mp4
Low resolution: https://youtu.be/iS6sjZmxjY4
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Andrew Rodney
Author “Color Management for Photographers"

deanwork

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #130 on: July 28, 2019, 01:17:45 pm »



Does anyone know the “average” life span of the bulbs in these NEC  PA271q displays.

What is the first thing to go, color accuracy or luminance?

John

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michael_mutmansky

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #131 on: August 02, 2019, 05:10:46 am »

I am fighting with my brand new PA271q and found this thread...

It looks like mine is pretty bad, so I downloaded Andrew's profile to compare to his. It's much worse.

I'm on a iMac, so I can't get the firmware to update until I go to the office tomorrow.  If I can't get this to update, I guess I'll be returning the monitor.

Has anyone gotten the FW to properly update when making the thumb drive on a Mac?  I need suggestions, as i followed the directions precisely.
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dchew

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #132 on: August 02, 2019, 05:33:25 am »

Has anyone gotten the FW to properly update when making the thumb drive on a Mac?  I need suggestions, as i followed the directions precisely.

According to NEC tech support it will not work if the files are loaded from a Mac. I tried every way I could imagine and could not get it to recognize the file. You need a PC. I suggest doing the whole sequence from the PC: download the file, unzip and drop on the thumb drive.

Dave
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michael_mutmansky

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #133 on: August 02, 2019, 11:57:15 am »

According to NEC tech support it will not work if the files are loaded from a Mac. I tried every way I could imagine and could not get it to recognize the file. You need a PC. I suggest doing the whole sequence from the PC: download the file, unzip and drop on the thumb drive.

Dave

Thanks Dave.  I saw your post earlier, and I was afraid that was going to be the answer.  Odd that NEC doesn't appear to be aware of the existence of Apple computers in this respect...

I'll get this resolved over the weekend and then I'll be back to resolve a bunch of questions I have about the woefully inadequate manuals for this monitor and the Spectraview software (I'll start a new thread for that).
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michael_mutmansky

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #134 on: August 02, 2019, 10:35:39 pm »

After the firmware update, the values are better, but nowhere near as good as Andrew's...

I'm wondering if I should return this to the vendor or talk to NEC.  It's brand new, and this makes me think that there is a bad batch of panels out there.  It's likely to get worse as the display ages, I'd expect.  It makes me wonder what this will mean for the life of the display compared to an ideal display.
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dchew

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #135 on: August 02, 2019, 10:47:21 pm »

Michael,
I’m curious what happens if you set the target at 130 cd/cm2, 300 contrast ratio, white point 5800?

Dave
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michael_mutmansky

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #136 on: August 03, 2019, 01:31:57 am »

Here it is...
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dchew

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #137 on: August 03, 2019, 05:54:51 am »

Well, so much for that theory. Mine was also no better after updating the firmware, but something changed after several calibrations. In my case, it was after I lowered the target to 130. 

Also, in preferences, calibration tab, make sure you have 52 calibration steps selected.

As much as I subscribe to “insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result,” you might go through several calibrations, particularly ones that keep the black point between 0.4 and 0.5. Start by using “default” for the contrast ratio. After that first calibration with default contrast ratio, use a manual entry to get that black target set point between 0.4-0.5. I’m sure you know this, but just in case: black target is your setting / contrast ratio, so 150cd/m2 / 300 = 0.5 black target.

“Several” meaning 3-6.

Dave
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michael_mutmansky

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #138 on: August 03, 2019, 02:59:29 pm »

Looks like that doesn't help me so far.  The values aren't improving, and I've reset it a few times, calibrated all of the stock options and a few of the custom ones as well.

I think I just got a crappy panel in mine.

I'll try a few more variables, but frankly, for the price of this thing, i'm a bit pissed they don't have better quality control.

I'll be sending a message to tech support to see what they suggest.
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digitaldog

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Re: Would you find this delta-E acceptable on a new PA271q?
« Reply #139 on: August 03, 2019, 03:28:42 pm »

Looks like that doesn't help me so far.  The values aren't improving, and I've reset it a few times, calibrated all of the stock options and a few of the custom ones as well.

I think I just got a crappy panel in mine.

I'll try a few more variables, but frankly, for the price of this thing, i'm a bit pissed they don't have better quality control.

I'll be sending a message to tech support to see what they suggest.
Simple: Request a new replacement.
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Andrew Rodney
Author “Color Management for Photographers"
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