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Author Topic: Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.  (Read 257 times)

ussmillerco

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Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.
« on: February 01, 2019, 03:22:23 AM »

Ok, Got this Printer from someone who was actually selling rolls of premium paper and canvas, and through the contact process it was revealed that this printer was available free (owner was going to push it out in the street with a free sign), I obviously jumped and drove up to pick up the paper and this printer. Was buying the paper for a another printer z3100, that I got cheap that needs a belt and possibly other stuff. Being riddled with A.D.D., I Became focused on the z3200, since it looks to be in pretty good shape. Z3100 is on the back burner. The z3200, came with a new HP ink tube assembly, so that was my first inkling there was problems.

Ok thatís the back story, so I got this printer home and fired it up, at first I had initialization issues and ended up replacing a very dead coin batt on formatted board. Then had numerous weird issue like the reseat this cartridge, then another, then it would fully work, so I could print out test pages (front panel, havenít as of yet connected to computer). Had numerous dried clogged printhead issues, and as I worked through those, on numerous occasions I would get either reseat cartridge, or from time to time during this process, the printer would not recognize any of the right side cartridges. This happened a couple of times, and just cycling it on and off, sometime several times I would see this issue go away. Well now itís back and not clearing. I actually bought a set of decoder boards that eliminate the cartridge chips. Installing those made no difference to the missing of right side cartridges. I have since removed those as I need to resolve the issue with what I have, and not put another issue in the path to troubleshooting.

    So, I can take out the right side cartridges and put em all back in and it continues to show them as missing. Iím also seeing the gloss enhancer shows itís empty, though I have weighed it and I know itís has fluid in it. Shows it as -1 percent. Also asked me to constantly reseat that cartridge. Now after Iím initialized and the screen shows all right side cartridges missing, I can press cancel(x) and that screen tells me which individual cartridge is missing, if I remove say red and black cartridges while on that screen, and open the top door and close it, the carriage move left then right, and for 5 or so seconds the screen shows Iím only missing the red and black cartridges, then the carriage re parks itís self and I see all the right side cartridges are missing again. So it appears to know the cartridges are there or not.

Very weird, I do have both sides off right now and see no cabling or connector issues. Have the z3100 for parts, but since that isnít running, I canít verify things like print mech board, which I understand is swappable, actually works. Any suggestions? Donít understand why all the right side cartridges would fail at the same time. Wondering if these are daisy chained, and one failed cartridge chip could cause this issue. The decoder chip I would think would of fixed an issue with the individual cartridge chips, since it goes in place of the chips. My thinking is maybe itís the print mech board, since from the ink supply station, the first stop for the right side cables is the print mech board. But hey, who knows. Any thoughts? Anyone seen similar?
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Ernst Dinkla

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Re: Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2019, 05:13:28 AM »

Ok, Got this Printer from someone who was actually selling rolls of premium paper and canvas, and through the contact process it was revealed that this printer was available free (owner was going to push it out in the street with a free sign), I obviously jumped and drove up to pick up the paper and this printer. Was buying the paper for a another printer z3100, that I got cheap that needs a belt and possibly other stuff. Being riddled with A.D.D., I Became focused on the z3200, since it looks to be in pretty good shape. Z3100 is on the back burner. The z3200, came with a new HP ink tube assembly, so that was my first inkling there was problems.

Ok thatís the back story, so I got this printer home and fired it up, at first I had initialization issues and ended up replacing a very dead coin batt on formatted board. Then had numerous weird issue like the reseat this cartridge, then another, then it would fully work, so I could print out test pages (front panel, havenít as of yet connected to computer). Had numerous dried clogged printhead issues, and as I worked through those, on numerous occasions I would get either reseat cartridge, or from time to time during this process, the printer would not recognize any of the right side cartridges. This happened a couple of times, and just cycling it on and off, sometime several times I would see this issue go away. Well now itís back and not clearing. I actually bought a set of decoder boards that eliminate the cartridge chips. Installing those made no difference to the missing of right side cartridges. I have since removed those as I need to resolve the issue with what I have, and not put another issue in the path to troubleshooting.

    So, I can take out the right side cartridges and put em all back in and it continues to show them as missing. Iím also seeing the gloss enhancer shows itís empty, though I have weighed it and I know itís has fluid in it. Shows it as -1 percent. Also asked me to constantly reseat that cartridge. Now after Iím initialized and the screen shows all right side cartridges missing, I can press cancel(x) and that screen tells me which individual cartridge is missing, if I remove say red and black cartridges while on that screen, and open the top door and close it, the carriage move left then right, and for 5 or so seconds the screen shows Iím only missing the red and black cartridges, then the carriage re parks itís self and I see all the right side cartridges are missing again. So it appears to know the cartridges are there or not.

Very weird, I do have both sides off right now and see no cabling or connector issues. Have the z3100 for parts, but since that isnít running, I canít verify things like print mech board, which I understand is swappable, actually works. Any suggestions? Donít understand why all the right side cartridges would fail at the same time. Wondering if these are daisy chained, and one failed cartridge chip could cause this issue. The decoder chip I would think would of fixed an issue with the individual cartridge chips, since it goes in place of the chips. My thinking is maybe itís the print mech board, since from the ink supply station, the first stop for the right side cables is the print mech board. But hey, who knows. Any thoughts? Anyone seen similar?

The Chinese? decoder boards have been a nuisance in my case. They are in a drawer for several years now, unused after showing of being no use at all within a month.

Edit: Check the connector at the right side again where you made the shortcut to the right side decoder board.

I think the head carriage board is unique for either the Z3100 and Z3200 and does the recognition of the right side carts Red ink used, Red or Chromatic Red.  I once ordered the Z3100 one where I needed the Z3200 one. They are different. The left side ink slots + connectors + electronics could be the same on both machines. The right side s+c+e the same too but the plastic hardware coding for the RED carts differs. In case you decide to replace Z3200 parts with Z3100 parts.

Check the connectors of the right side slots and cartridges. Clean and dry them.  No sign of a failing head carriage board?

Edit: Normally a bad cartridge chip will only trigger an error for that cart slot.

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« Last Edit: February 01, 2019, 05:37:41 AM by Ernst Dinkla »
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ussmillerco

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Re: Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2019, 05:23:57 PM »

Yeah, the Chinese board was a judgement call for troubleshooting this issue. Thought maybe I could get lucky by having the boards take the place of a failed cartridge chip.

I will check again, but I have checked several times for any bent, pins or obvious wiring issues, though the ribbon cable goes into the metal frame for a bit, so obviously canít see if that section has an issue.

Sure seems like it is some kind of issue where it doesnít like what it seeing. Like I said for several seconds after closing the top door, it sees whatever cart I have pulled and shows it, if only for a brief time.

Yeah Leary of using my z3100 parts since itís belt is shredded and looks like it had a tougher life. It was used for a company who sold aerial photos of businesses before google earth made them obsolete. Been around the block and Iím not sure it wasnít raped for parts for other Z series machines they may have had (just speculating). Certainly do some swaps and tear in farther if the suggestions received donít bear fruit. Yes I know about the Z3100 vs. Z3200 red vs. chromatic red and that some of the internals are different.

I use contact cleaner on most connectors if I believe thereís an issue, will give that a whirl.

Sign of Failing head carriage board? Have to look up those signs....and is that a possibility ?

Thank you for your help, much appreciated.

Iíll keep you informed of my progress.
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ussmillerco

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Re: Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2019, 11:21:29 PM »

Ok, updated firmware, still have the issue. Just to update my issue along with some other things i noticed. The entire right side cartridges show as missing, and now I noticed the entire left side cartridges show as needing to be reseated, not sure what thatís about. Reseating make no difference to their status.

 Little more back story, several times leading up to this issue I had numerous reseat cartridge warnings, a couple of times the right side cartridges exhibited the same issue Iím stuck with now, then cleared and let me print info pages and other front panel functions/ printhead trobleshooting. Then, i had the printer start rejecting a few random right side cartridges and since I had some spares, from the Z3100, i would replace them, it would recognize them, and continue on. I did have 2 cartridges, that appeared to be damaged, where if I tried to use those, it would say they were failed. They had previously showed plenty of ink, and had no issue. This leads me to ask the question below to try to understand how the printer handles cartridges.

Then eventually the entire right side missing cartridge issue came back, for good. Iím stuck since if it was 1 or 2 cartridges I would replace them, but since all right side has issues, Iím thinking itís something other than all cartridges have gone bad at the same time.

So, questions, does the printer, write to the cartridge chips... and fail them, and store that information in the chip, or is it in the printers onboard memory? I havenít got a concrete answer reading old posts on this. But as I understand it, this could be possible, if for instance you run your cartridge to totally empty and the bongos extend because the cartridge pump is no longer primed and is empty of ink and is sensed by the printers software, irreversibly failing the cartridge. If true, im hesitant to buy new cartridges, since if the problem is with the ink supply station bongo position sensing, or circuitry on one of the boards, giving an erroneous out of ink signal, the new cartridge chip may be written to as empty and basically destroy the new cartridges chip quickly. I must say, if what Iím asking is true and the empty signal renders new cartridge chips dead, that would really Terrible design, considering that something on the printer could of wiped out my current cartridge chips and buying more cartridges could be a waste of money. I am wondering if aftermarket arc chips are immune to the potential empty cartridge write failure too.

I have no failure codes on this machine, I plan to enter diagnostic service menu and do supply tests, and any other test that might reveal whatís going on, and what to attempt to replace. Iím thinking since this came with a new set of ink supply tubes, that this issue is what prompted its previous owners to abandon. I have used syringes to assure none of the ink lines are clogged, and donít see any leaks. I have read where ink supply stations can have failures in the sensors (assuming there talking about the bongo position sensors) from being fouled by ink, damaging sensors, but I see no indication of ink leaks, besides it would need to be on all right side sensors (unless they are daisy chained and or one is grounding out he whole lot. Still not sure what the left side reseat all cartridges warning is (all left side cartridges show as present and ok, just need reseat) as reseating makes no difference.

Please any recommendations or any idea on the theory of operation of the ink cartridge supply system would be so appreciated. Any ideas? Anyone seen similar. HELP!

 

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Mark Lindquist

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Re: Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2019, 01:52:48 PM »

Ok, updated firmware, still have the issue. Just to update my issue along with some other things i noticed. The entire right side cartridges show as missing, and now I noticed the entire left side cartridges show as needing to be reseated, not sure what thatís about. Reseating make no difference to their status.

 Little more back story, several times leading up to this issue I had numerous reseat cartridge warnings, a couple of times the right side cartridges exhibited the same issue Iím stuck with now, then cleared and let me print info pages and other front panel functions/ printhead trobleshooting. Then, i had the printer start rejecting a few random right side cartridges and since I had some spares, from the Z3100, i would replace them, it would recognize them, and continue on. I did have 2 cartridges, that appeared to be damaged, where if I tried to use those, it would say they were failed. They had previously showed plenty of ink, and had no issue. This leads me to ask the question below to try to understand how the printer handles cartridges.

Then eventually the entire right side missing cartridge issue came back, for good. Iím stuck since if it was 1 or 2 cartridges I would replace them, but since all right side has issues, Iím thinking itís something other than all cartridges have gone bad at the same time.

So, questions, does the printer, write to the cartridge chips... and fail them, and store that information in the chip, or is it in the printers onboard memory? I havenít got a concrete answer reading old posts on this. But as I understand it, this could be possible, if for instance you run your cartridge to totally empty and the bongos extend because the cartridge pump is no longer primed and is empty of ink and is sensed by the printers software, irreversibly failing the cartridge. If true, im hesitant to buy new cartridges, since if the problem is with the ink supply station bongo position sensing, or circuitry on one of the boards, giving an erroneous out of ink signal, the new cartridge chip may be written to as empty and basically destroy the new cartridges chip quickly. I must say, if what Iím asking is true and the empty signal renders new cartridge chips dead, that would really Terrible design, considering that something on the printer could of wiped out my current cartridge chips and buying more cartridges could be a waste of money. I am wondering if aftermarket arc chips are immune to the potential empty cartridge write failure too.

I have no failure codes on this machine, I plan to enter diagnostic service menu and do supply tests, and any other test that might reveal whatís going on, and what to attempt to replace. Iím thinking since this came with a new set of ink supply tubes, that this issue is what prompted its previous owners to abandon. I have used syringes to assure none of the ink lines are clogged, and donít see any leaks. I have read where ink supply stations can have failures in the sensors (assuming there talking about the bongo position sensors) from being fouled by ink, damaging sensors, but I see no indication of ink leaks, besides it would need to be on all right side sensors (unless they are daisy chained and or one is grounding out he whole lot. Still not sure what the left side reseat all cartridges warning is (all left side cartridges show as present and ok, just need reseat) as reseating makes no difference.

Please any recommendations or any idea on the theory of operation of the ink cartridge supply system would be so appreciated. Any ideas? Anyone seen similar. HELP!

I am hesitant to make suggestions when it's a printer that has questionable history, particularly, not knowing what the issues have been in the past and what's happing now.
However, I do recognize some issues you are having that are symptomatic of a print-mech board issue. The print mech board is on the right hand side behind the service station.  When the right cover is removed, it's right there in the back.  Often when the printer is asking for cartridges to be reseated, eventually it does lead to a print-mech failure.

If it was my printer, I would let it start and as the carriage is moving, unplug, (so that the carriage is free from its' parking position). Then I would remove all the printheads and put them in a plastic freezer bag and take them outdoors and shake them seriously for as long as I could stand it.  Same with the cartridges.  The start up the printer and see if it asks for the cartridges (they would be first), and if it took all the cartridges, and it went on to the next stage, asking for the print heads, see if it asks for paper to do the printhead alignment.  If it got that far, it could be good.

If it threw an error message, then I'd chase that down.  Chances are if it asked to reseat the printheads, I'd consider replacing the print mech board with an identical one (same Rev A or B number.)
Then I would make sure the printheads were out and the cartridges were out, and start the initialization process over again.

That's how I would approach it. If it were mine, that is.  I would probably not overthink the issue of how the printer deals with the cartridges - I'd look to see that I had good carts (not new, but well shaken) and make sure they were all at least 1/2 - 3/4 full and get on with it.

Best,

Mark

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ussmillerco

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Re: Z3200, No Right side cartridges showing up.
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2019, 12:06:03 AM »

Perfect, thanks Mark, will do. Print mech was what I was thinking as thatís where the right side ink supply station ribbon cable heads to. Note, the reseat issue (as opposed to missing right side cartridges), is the left side cartridges, and that ribbon goes to the main board. But agree, as I have seen your recommendation to pull consumables, shake, then add as directed, and see what happens. Seems like a good plan. Itís a Rev A by the way. Got a plan, and Iím off to implement. Will check back. Thank you..Sean
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