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Author Topic: from the front page: adam krawesky  (Read 7357 times)

OmerV

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2019, 10:25:49 am »

I'm glad this work isn't parroting Klein, Frank, Levitt, etc. Hell would be the inability to leave the past, plus romanticizing what was is as corrosive as rust. And photographing people with deformities is not novel or new.

Adam Krawesky's work has a quietness that makes it contemplative, a respite from the freneticism of much public photography, past and present.

amolitor

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2019, 10:29:51 am »

HCB's photograph embraces the clutter of the city and works with it, graphically, in a way that at most one of Krawesky's does, rather than carving it all out of the frame to simplify the problem of taking a picture.

HCB's photograph blurs the motion of the man, abstracting him into everyman. In to, it turns out, a representation of all the people who were making that same jump that day, but we don't know that offhand. We do see the abstract figure leaping.

HCB's photograph shows the man leaping to... somewhere? Nowhere? We don't know. We are free to guess, to extrapolate, to imagine, to spin allegories.

HCB's photograph distills a real event, albeit a tiny one, to its essence, places it in a frame that feels realistic by embracing the clutter of the city, and abstracts that event into something we are free to enlarge in our own minds.

Krawesky's pictures, on those rare occasions when anything at all is happening, feel unreal because he tends to crop out the clutter, and abstract nothing at all, leaving nowhere for us to go. We fall back the appeal of graphics and the color, and that is about it.

There are bits and pieces. The woman with her hair blowing over her eyes strikes me as having an element of something, but the rest of the frame is just a mess. The man standing low down by the window with LINC printed on it feels more realistic, more urban-cluttered, but it is utterly static. Nothing is happening, where do I go with this? The boy leaping for the sign feels like something. Maybe it wants to be an expression of childhood or something, but somehow there is a sterility to the frame that sabotages that -- all that empty space.

And so on. There are flashes of something here and there, but nothing comes together.
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Ivophoto

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2019, 10:46:01 am »

HCB's photograph embraces the clutter of the city and works with it, graphically, in a way that at most one of Krawesky's does, rather than carving it all out of the frame to simplify the problem of taking a picture.

HCB's photograph blurs the motion of the man, abstracting him into everyman. In to, it turns out, a representation of all the people who were making that same jump that day, but we don't know that offhand. We do see the abstract figure leaping.

HCB's photograph shows the man leaping to... somewhere? Nowhere? We don't know. We are free to guess, to extrapolate, to imagine, to spin allegories.

HCB's photograph distills a real event, albeit a tiny one, to its essence, places it in a frame that feels realistic by embracing the clutter of the city, and abstracts that event into something we are free to enlarge in our own minds.

Krawesky's pictures, on those rare occasions when anything at all is happening, feel unreal because he tends to crop out the clutter, and abstract nothing at all, leaving nowhere for us to go. We fall back the appeal of graphics and the color, and that is about it.

There are bits and pieces. The woman with her hair blowing over her eyes strikes me as having an element of something, but the rest of the frame is just a mess. The man standing low down by the window with LINC printed on it feels more realistic, more urban-cluttered, but it is utterly static. Nothing is happening, where do I go with this? The boy leaping for the sign feels like something. Maybe it wants to be an expression of childhood or something, but somehow there is a sterility to the frame that sabotages that -- all that empty space.

And so on. There are flashes of something here and there, but nothing comes together.


I appreciate to take the time and effort to tell your story about the HCB, thanks Amolitor.

There is a huge forgiveness in the reading of the HCB picture and a lack of it in the reading of Kraweskyís.
Itís a lot projection Iím afraid. And a lot of after talk. I would not exclude the possibility your Ďabstract every maní would be tack sharp if HCB had faster film at hands.

I got your point about the clutter of the city. Thatís a fair point.

I remember a comment on a series I made in Paris, one suggestion was to go back and retake the shots and avoid the clutter that exposed the era. Here is the glitch, some wants to see the city as is, but the expectation is to see as it was. That is not possible.

For me there is nothing wrong to esthetically make different choices and exclude clutter of time, it is not that easy. 




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amolitor

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2019, 10:47:49 am »

If HCB had had faster film, or if the slot in the fence he shot through had been less fortuitously placed, the pictures would all have been junk and (I suppose) he wouldn't have published them.
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #24 on: January 06, 2019, 10:48:21 am »

What I find incredibly difficult to understand with photographers criticizing the work of others is how many photographers seem to think that other photographers should subscribe to their vision. I think that most photographers are anchored in a way of seeing that they believe to be an objective reality that we all must see and share in and if that viewpoint isnít reflected in the work then the work is deemed to be a failure, wrong in some way.

If a photographer shows us a city scene that appears sterile, unwelcoming, constructed of rigid geometric shapes then perhaps that is that photographers vision of it. Perhaps that is how he sees it, how it makes him feel, what he wishes to communicate. Alienation, people as intruders, transient.

How about we look at the work of others and rather ask, what is this person trying to say. How do they see things. Could I perhaps learn something, add something to my visual vocabulary?
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Ivophoto

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #25 on: January 06, 2019, 10:54:20 am »

What I find incredibly difficult to understand with photographers criticizing the work of others is how many photographers seem to think that other photographers should subscribe to their vision. I think that most photographers are anchored in a way of seeing that they believe to be an objective reality that we all must see and share in and if that viewpoint isnít reflected in the work then the work is deemed to be a failure, wrong in some way.

If a photographer shows us a city scene that appears sterile, unwelcoming, constructed of rigid geometric shapes then perhaps that is that photographers vision of it. Perhaps that is how he sees it, how it makes him feel, what he wishes to communicate. Alienation, people as intruders, transient.

How about we look at the work of others and rather ask, what is this person trying to say. How do they see things. Could I perhaps learn something, add something to my visual vocabulary?

Exactly.
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OmerV

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #26 on: January 06, 2019, 10:58:17 am »

What I find incredibly difficult to understand with photographers criticizing the work of others is how many photographers seem to think that other photographers should subscribe to their vision. I think that most photographers are anchored in a way of seeing that they believe to be an objective reality that we all must see and share in and if that viewpoint isnít reflected in the work then the work is deemed to be a failure, wrong in some way.

If a photographer shows us a city scene that appears sterile, unwelcoming, constructed of rigid geometric shapes then perhaps that is that photographers vision of it. Perhaps that is how he sees it, how it makes him feel, what he wishes to communicate. Alienation, people as intruders, transient.

How about we look at the work of others and rather ask, what is this person trying to say. How do they see things. Could I perhaps learn something, add something to my visual vocabulary?

Agreed.

Perhaps expectation born out of conditioning.

stamper

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2019, 11:01:50 am »

What I find incredibly difficult to understand with photographers criticizing the work of others is how many photographers seem to think that other photographers should subscribe to their vision. I think that most photographers are anchored in a way of seeing that they believe to be an objective reality that we all must see and share in and if that viewpoint isnít reflected in the work then the work is deemed to be a failure, wrong in some way.

If a photographer shows us a city scene that appears sterile, unwelcoming, constructed of rigid geometric shapes then perhaps that is that photographers vision of it. Perhaps that is how he sees it, how it makes him feel, what he wishes to communicate. Alienation, people as intruders, transient.

How about we look at the work of others and rather ask, what is this person trying to say. How do they see things. Could I perhaps learn something, add something to my visual vocabulary?

You have written what I have been thinking for a long time but better than I could possibly express.

amolitor

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2019, 11:03:10 am »

What I find incredibly difficult to understand with photographers criticizing the work of others is how many photographers seem to think that other photographers should subscribe to their vision. I think that most photographers are anchored in a way of seeing that they believe to be an objective reality that we all must see and share in and if that viewpoint isnít reflected in the work then the work is deemed to be a failure, wrong in some way.

If a photographer shows us a city scene that appears sterile, unwelcoming, constructed of rigid geometric shapes then perhaps that is that photographers vision of it. Perhaps that is how he sees it, how it makes him feel, what he wishes to communicate. Alienation, people as intruders, transient.

How about we look at the work of others and rather ask, what is this person trying to say. How do they see things. Could I perhaps learn something, add something to my visual vocabulary?

The logical conclusion of this is that there's no such thing as good or bad, truth or beauty, it's all just subjective. This is the postmodern experiment, an experiment which I consider to be an abject failure. A position many a successful academic would fight me on.
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Ivophoto

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2019, 11:03:46 am »

If HCB had had faster film, or if the slot in the fence he shot through had been less fortuitously placed, the pictures would all have been junk and (I suppose) he wouldn't have published them.

Thatís interesting. It brings us to the question: How far are photographers a product of their gear, but thatís the start of a flame war in another thread.
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KLaban

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #30 on: January 06, 2019, 11:09:02 am »

Thatís interesting. It brings us to the question: How far are photographers a product of their gear, but thatís the start of a flame war in another thread.

Gosh, I hope not, if it were true I'd be labelled as simple.

;-)
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Ivophoto

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from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #31 on: January 06, 2019, 11:10:28 am »

The logical conclusion of this is that there's no such thing as good or bad, truth or beauty, it's all just subjective. This is the postmodern experiment, an experiment which I consider to be an abject failure. A position many a successful academic would fight me on.

I believe in cases like this, subjectivism is superior to objectivism.
It does put a lot stress on the premise.
Objectivism is always an attempt.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2019, 11:16:47 am by Ivophoto »
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RSL

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #32 on: January 06, 2019, 11:12:27 am »

What I find incredibly difficult to understand with photographers criticizing the work of others is how many photographers seem to think that other photographers should subscribe to their vision. I think that most photographers are anchored in a way of seeing that they believe to be an objective reality that we all must see and share in and if that viewpoint isnít reflected in the work then the work is deemed to be a failure, wrong in some way.

If a photographer shows us a city scene that appears sterile, unwelcoming, constructed of rigid geometric shapes then perhaps that is that photographers vision of it. Perhaps that is how he sees it, how it makes him feel, what he wishes to communicate. Alienation, people as intruders, transient.

How about we look at the work of others and rather ask, what is this person trying to say. How do they see things. Could I perhaps learn something, add something to my visual vocabulary?

Itís a fair point, Martin. And it goes to the question of how art grabs you. Obviously, how hard a grip a particular photograh, painting, or poem exerts depends to a very large extent on your life experiences. Some artworks that grab you may not grab me, and vice versa. Thereís a superficial level at which the grabbing takes place, and at that level thereís wide diversity in the strength of the grip. Fads come and go. But there also are deeper levels that account for the fact that after a time certain artworks retain their grabbing power and sometines even increase it while others lose their grip.

The problem with asking what an artist is trying to say is that what the artist is trying to say doesnít make a damn bit of difference. Either the work he produced says something Ė hopefully the thing he was trying to say Ė or it doesnít. Or, as I said long ago in the preface to my poetry collection: ď. . .the effectiveness of a work of art has no more to do with the artistís intent and state of mind than the effectiveness of a human has to do with the umbilical cord that sustained him before birth. The result is the result is the result. If it hasnít a life of its own then itís dead and ought to be buried.Ē

Martin Kristiansen

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #33 on: January 06, 2019, 11:14:27 am »

The logical conclusion of this is that there's no such thing as good or bad, truth or beauty, it's all just subjective. This is the postmodern experiment, an experiment which I consider to be an abject failure. A position many a successful academic would fight me on.

Not at all. You miss my point. I do see truth, beauty, good and bad. However I believe they are all worth commenting on. And non of them exist in isolation. No good without the potential of bad. The concept of truth cannot exist if there is not the possibility of untruth.  Because things are relative doesnít mean they donít exist. It means they donít exist in quite the way we think they do.

This photographer is saying something. Itís not what BCB was saying. Perhaps he doesnít see things as HCB saw them. Thatís fine. He still has something to say. I think he says it skillfully and coherently.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2019, 11:34:55 am by Martin Kristiansen »
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Ivophoto

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #34 on: January 06, 2019, 11:15:27 am »

If it hasnít a life of its own then itís dead and ought to be buried.Ē

Or it is kept alive with all the blabla about it, see the piles of blabla about work that should already be long forgotten.
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #35 on: January 06, 2019, 11:44:08 am »

At least the article and images provoked a serious discussion. Thatís good right?
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Ivophoto

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #36 on: January 06, 2019, 11:46:28 am »

At least the article and images provoked a serious discussion. Thatís good right?

Yep
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RSL

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #37 on: January 06, 2019, 12:03:08 pm »

Or it is kept alive with all the blabla about it, see the piles of blabla about work that should already be long forgotten.

Just saying that is meaningless, Ivo. Which work? Give us at least one example to illustrate the point you're trying to make.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2019, 12:14:19 pm by RSL »
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OmerV

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #38 on: January 06, 2019, 12:30:49 pm »

Just saying that is meaningless, Ivo. Which work? Give us at least one example to illustrate the point you're trying to make.

Gene Smith's Walk to Paradise Garden.

https://huxleyparlour.com/w-eugene-smith-hope-and-innocence-2/

Ivophoto

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Re: from the front page: adam krawesky
« Reply #39 on: January 06, 2019, 12:45:19 pm »

Just saying that is meaningless, Ivo. Which work? Give me at least one example to illustrate the point you're trying to make.

Yes I can Russ.

The image of HCB here above.

This image lives his life thanks to all the cinema around it. 

I donít say it doesnít have itís merits and I donít want to minimize itís impact , but they are not in proportion with the hysteria around it.

HCB is a lot of fantastic images, but also a lot of blabla generated by wannabes who think having to say something about HCB increases their seriousness.

Did you had the chance to visit the HCB foundation in Paris? Loaded with only the after talk and pompous reflections of all so called HCB specialists, you run into a massive deception.

On the other side of the spectrum I could point to Gurskyís ĎThe Rhineí. It is an impressive picture, but hyped to sky by all who feel great by joining the hype.

Or Vivian Maiers hyped úuvre that would never had surfaced without the smart marketing of John Maloof.

Lartigueís úuvre, the snapshots of jumping, racing or tennis playing woman, only made possible because he had the money to buy the newest gear / technical possibilities. Also here it was the curator of MOMA who hyped the early works of Lartigue to the status it is now.

Etc etc




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