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Author Topic: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?  (Read 3328 times)

kevs

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From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« on: December 21, 2018, 08:42:05 pm »

I'm six years with the Canon 5D2... Coming out of hibernation, next year I could go to the 4, or even the R/S or...
Any recommendations? I lean to the 4 as the others while having 20 MB more pixels, but Canon seemed to have left out the iso and other benefits correct?

I was thinking of waiting for the 5Dmark 5, but a BH reps said he is 80% that they will not make a mark 5.

And I could stay with the 2 for a long time more really, does not bother me, but it it dynamic ranger from over six years ago.

I shoot people photography.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2018, 12:47:53 pm by kevs »
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Canon 5D2/ Profoto D1s

BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2018, 01:12:17 am »

I donít think it makes that much sense to buy another DSLR in 2019.

I would wait until the release of a decent mirrorless R (probably mid to late 2019) or go straight to Sony if you share my doubts about the ability of Canon to come up with competitive bodies.

Cheers,
Bernard

kevs

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2018, 01:29:43 am »

No interested in Sony, but what is wrong with the current Canon R and Mark 4? ( and R/S?)
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2018, 01:53:00 am »

No interested in Sony, but what is wrong with the current Canon R and Mark 4? ( and R/S?)

Iíll let Canon users answer you.

Cheers,
Bernard

Rado

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2018, 03:04:11 am »

No interested in Sony, but what is wrong with the current Canon R and Mark 4? ( and R/S?)
The R works very well for shooting people. The AF is fast, accurate (even wide open) and covers almost the whole frame. Adapted lenses work well too. I'm very happy with how my R performs.
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stever

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2018, 09:44:30 am »

as usual, a lot depends on what your priorities are

in general, i agree with Bernard, but whether to buy a ff mirrorless camera in 2019 will depend on what Canon, Nikon, and Sony do. I think buying a 1st generation mirrorless from Canon or Sony is not a good substitute for a 5D4 (which I have) - and I'm not sure that a 3rd generation Sony is either.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2018, 09:50:28 am »

as usual, a lot depends on what your priorities are

in general, i agree with Bernard, but whether to buy a ff mirrorless camera in 2019 will depend on what Canon, Nikon, and Sony do. I think buying a 1st generation mirrorless from Canon or Sony is not a good substitute for a 5D4 (which I have) - and I'm not sure that a 3rd generation Sony is either.

You probably meant Canon or Nikon and I can mostly agree with that (although the Z7 is a damn good camera its AF isn't yet competitive with recent DSLRs), but to me the a7rIII is head and shoulder above the 5DmkIV in every single area, mostly obviously image quality and AF. In particular when shooting people where eye AF is a super killer feature.

The only case where a 5DmkIV would make sense is if you hate EVFs.

Cheers,
Bernard

Rhossydd

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2018, 11:36:34 am »

The only case where a 5DmkIV would make sense is if you hate EVFs.
Which is exactly why I bought one last month.
A great camera that's a joy to use.
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kevs

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2018, 11:37:58 am »

Bernard, thanks what is eye AF... I'm just guessing:

What on the nuisances of Mark 2 is I shoot people.

If this help everyone. I don't shoot much wildlife, nature etc, people, environmental portraits, some fashion, fine art...

For people, vertical, I have to manually set that top AF that hits the eye, very cumbersome and is does not work as well as the middle focus point. I was assuming or hoping by mark 4, with what 60 points, on a vertical headshot it would nail the persons eyes in focus, yeah or nay on that? I don't know...(but how do most Canon/ Nikon shooter focus for eyes, like I do, manually changing each time to top point?)

That said, I can't imaging switching over to Sony, I just ordered a new Sigma 12-24, not arrived yet, and have 4 lenses and backup Rebel. switch and spend a new 6 k? And then Canon in a few years matches whatever....

What else is wrong with DSLR? Iv'e seen articles that say the trade off between the two balances out. The extra body size if negligible, meaningless.

I've never used EVF. Do some people not like it?

I can't imagine images on the Sony would look better on a 27" imac or even a well printing 30 x40 in print. You really think most people would see a big difference?



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sbay

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2018, 12:25:17 pm »

I moved from 5d2 to sony a7r2. The files are significantly better, with much better noise performance in the shadows / dynamic range (super important if you lift them regularly). Makes shots possible that would not work on the Canon (without blending). Of course the 5D4 closes the gap significantly. Nikon is basically the same as sony. There's also the resolution bump.

Re portraits -- on the sony I tend to use eye autofocus. Basically you hit the AF button and the camera picks the 1 out of 400 focus points covering the closest eye. It works really well and is a game changer IMO. I believe EOS-R has this feature too.

kevs

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2018, 12:46:31 pm »

I was actually thinking a minute ago,  I could switch over to Sony easily, buy the a7 -- I only have 3 main Canon lenses and a back up body, but... then just read this now:

https://kenrockwell.com/tech/comparisons/nikon-vs-canon-vs-sony-full-frame.htm

And I trust this guy. Color and ergonomics of Canon is better, and Canon is just better... so that is kaput for now... I think maybe the Sony has taken over Canon/ Nikon is a bit inflated- overrated.

Do love the eye focus idea, but just it's 2 extra clicks to get that with SLR.. so it's not a game changer in the way that full frame digital was 13 years ago. ie. Nikon lagged behind with full frame, for what .. 6-7 years behind Canon?  (when I started there was no auto focus at all!)

For Canon shooters: do you think there will be no Mark 5?  I'm leaning to buying the 4 as Rhoss just did, but if I new a 5 was coming...maybe would wait for it..
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2018, 04:43:09 pm »

The Canon R has a half baked eye AF in AF-S mode. It works is you shoot static portraits at f8.

The Sony has a fast and accurate AF-C eye AF that works at f1.4 consistently anywhere in the frame with native Sony mount lenses and with adapted Canon mount lenses. That works on subjects that move like many humans do. ;)

100% of my former Canon portrait shooting friends have switched to this solution.

As a total Nikon fanboy this has made me consider a switch or an addiction many times.

Sony colors are probably not as good as Canon/Nikon out of the box but my friends have not complained about this although they are super picky on colors and look... this is IMHO way over hyped.

Cheers,
Bernard

BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2018, 04:48:24 pm »

Which is exactly why I bought one last month.
A great camera that's a joy to use.

That was my position also till I used the Z7 EVF, and I come from the D5 and the H6D-100c that are arguably two of thevbest OVFs available anywhere, I have changed my mind on this now.

Granted, the R and Sonyís EVF donít offer the same quality of experience.

Cheers,
Bernard

Rhossydd

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to ? 4 or the 5Ds or ?
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2018, 05:44:51 pm »

That was my position also till I used the Z7 EVF,
I've not seen that one yet, but I still think OVFs are more direct and allow a greater connection with the subject. I understand why some people might think seeing the finished result on an EVF might be preferable, but that direct visual connection of an OVF is something I'll always value in photography.

Right now I can't see anything that would be better than the 5D iv for me. Enough of everything technical and great handling. In two months use the only niggle I have with it is the lock on the function control. I never had an issue on the 5dii with it being knocked, so the lock is a minor annoyance like the double button requirement on the 1 series cameras. Given time it'll become second nature to press it when swapping modes. It always takes a while before muscle memory is set on the new control layout, but from the mkII there's so little difference it'll only take one proper long shot for it all to fall into place.
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charles.woodrich

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2018, 08:56:41 pm »

I own a 5D4 and a Sony a7r3, and I love them both.  If I had to drop one of them it would be the Sony.  The Canon files aren't as big but I prefer the color (I use Capture 1 Pro).  Both bodies have many pluses and minuses, but at the end of the day, for me it comes down to reliability.  The Sony is a great piece of equipment, and I'm continually shifting between the two systems, but for what I do (wildlife) the 5D4 is my choice.  If you are indoors most of the time, and eye AF is useful, I would go with the Sony.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2018, 09:39:30 pm »

I own a 5D4 and a Sony a7r3, and I love them both.  If I had to drop one of them it would be the Sony.  The Canon files aren't as big but I prefer the color (I use Capture 1 Pro).  Both bodies have many pluses and minuses, but at the end of the day, for me it comes down to reliability.  The Sony is a great piece of equipment, and I'm continually shifting between the two systems, but for what I do (wildlife) the 5D4 is my choice.  If you are indoors most of the time, and eye AF is useful, I would go with the Sony.

Hi Charles,

What aspects of the Sony prevent you from using it full time if I may ask?

Cheers,
Bernard

kevs

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2018, 09:56:03 pm »

And Charles, interesting, today I'm talking to a friend who has owned both and sold his Sony, because he says as being a people shooter, like, me, he want to talk and chat with the client while he is shooting can't be bothered with the insane display/ control/ function issues that is Sony.  That reason alone he went back to Canon (the new mirrorless R) for  -- ease of use. I bought the rx100 for travel 3 years ago ($500), and it's nice, but very non intuitive to deal with.

He said BTW that he calls it face recognition, said also a game changer, as before he was losing 20% of shots to focus issues so that alone he like the mirrorless 4. I asked if it locks into the eyes (not nose or mouth). I have to research that more as that would be a lovely feature for a people photographer. (I have no idea if it's as good as the Sony currently, but it might).

I don't think there is anything that Canon wont eventually conquer and be tops with.

I've never used EVF, should have asked him about that..  with EVF one cannot playback images to the client as well?  It's live and then gone?
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #17 on: December 23, 2018, 12:32:25 am »

I don't think there is anything that Canon wont eventually conquer and be tops with.

Man, you've been living on an isolated island for 10 years haven't you? ;)

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: December 23, 2018, 08:06:21 am by BernardLanguillier »
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eronald

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #18 on: December 23, 2018, 01:53:50 am »

Man, you've be living on an isolated island for 10 years haven't you? ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

The focus on pro Canon and Nikon 1D, Dx series is good enough for snapshot portraits. These cameras are made for superfast use at sports but also press conferences in mediocre light, priced accordingly, and they deliver.

I don't think mirrorless is there yet exactly, but it will be in another generation. I expect the next batch of Nikons will be perfect, Canons too, I don't know about Sony ergonomics though, they seem to have a habit of making puzzleboxes. .

Edmund
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Rhossydd

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Re: From Canon 5D2 to 4 or R or 5 or Sony ?
« Reply #19 on: December 23, 2018, 04:24:00 am »

Man, you've be living on an isolated island for 10 years haven't you? ;)
and trusts Ken Rockwell........
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