Topaz AI Clear adjustment update (>3x faster)

[Zen8]

Yeah something is going on. The previews look great in Topaz. I would expect it just to take longer just like the Gigapixel blog but still produce correct results. I started a thread at Topaz and the mod told me I was shooting too high an ISO. Then this happened. The mod shut it down. That second last post is not me but a continuation about applying AI to a smaller sized file. I also opened a support request and have not heard from them.       

 

                   

[Zen8]

Forgot to say. What am I supposed to do now? How am I supposed to get the help I'm looking for. I'm not going to start another thread. I also tried it on my MacBook Air with 1.5GB VRAM but only 4GB memory. Same thing.     

[Zen8]

Found another thread

http://discuss.topazlabs.com/t/ai-clear-saved-results-dont-match-preview/8143

[Zen8]

So based on that thread at Topaz. All full sized Jpeg exports at 200%. 1st image is direct in and out of Topaz, no changes. 2nd is in and out of Topaz with recovery set to 0. 3rd is exported from LR as a TIFF, saved back to LR and exported as a full sized Jpeg.

         

[Zen8]

Direct in and out using Topaz. Not as bad but still getting them. 200%



 

[plugsnpixels]

Zen8, I just got home and saw your posts and did a quick test on my trusty MacBook Air (Intel HD Graphics 5000 1536 MB).

The original very noisy uncropped image was taken by someone else in 2009, with a Canon Cr2, the result being 3861x2574 pixels, 17.4MB.

I opened in it PS/Camera RAW and saved it out as a straight TIFF, as shot, then brought it straight into TS (no LR involved).

Here is a split before-and-after 100% screenshot in Topaz Studio 1.12.6 using AI Clear as an Adjustment, followed by a 100% crop from the full frame processed image. I believe the results look the same as the preview.

Also, I will write my contact at Topaz and refer them to the threads where you felt you were not being heard.

[kirkt]

Thanks kirkt, can you provide this or a similar image for me to play with?

Also, are you running Clear on the entire uncropped image, and if so, what is its full resolution?

Full res image from Fujifilm X-H1 = 6000 x 4000.

I will pm you a Dropbox link to the Tiff that I fed to AIClearwhen I get to work.

Kirk

[kirkt]

A hacky solution would be to run from within PS an action that slices a full res image into quarters, processes each quarter in AI Clear, and then reassembles the quarters into a complete image at full, original image dimensions. 

Ridiculous, but it "works."

As you decrease the pixel dimensions of the high ISO image, the artifacts become less noticeable.  They are especially problematic in out of focus areas with vague detail, as if the AI is being fooled into sharpening or creating detail where it should not exist.  Sure, you could use the treated image as a layer and paint in the useable areas with a mask, but that defeats the purpose.

kirk

[Zen8]

Zen8, I just got home and saw your posts and did a quick test on my trusty MacBook Air (Intel HD Graphics 5000 1536 MB).

The original very noisy uncropped image was taken by someone else in 2009, with a Canon Cr2, the result being 3861x2574 pixels, 17.4MB.

I opened in it PS/Camera RAW and saved it out as a straight TIFF, as shot, then brought it straight into TS (no LR involved).

Here is a split before-and-after 100% screenshot in Topaz Studio 1.12.6 using AI Clear as an Adjustment, followed by a 100% crop from the full frame processed image. I believe the results look the same as the preview.

Also, I will write my contact at Topaz and refer them to the threads where you felt you were not being heard.

I think they know it is an LR and PS issue when going through either. Thanks for offer to contact Topaz. Looking forward to that. I dragged a CR2 file directly into AI Clear and the results were better. I don't have the recommended VRAM so maybe that is a factor preventing a perfect match to the preview.           

[Zen8]

A hacky solution would be to run from within PS an action that slices a full res image into quarters, processes each quarter in AI Clear, and then reassembles the quarters into a complete image at full, original image dimensions. 

Ridiculous, but it "works."

As you decrease the pixel dimensions of the high ISO image, the artifacts become less noticeable.  They are especially problematic in out of focus areas with vague detail, as if the AI is being fooled into sharpening or creating detail where it should not exist.  Sure, you could use the treated image as a layer and paint in the useable areas with a mask, but that defeats the purpose.

kirk

That sounds like a good idea but more than I want to take on. One workaround is to ignore Topaz's instructions and send a file from LR without turning off NR adjustments. I'm not sure what is going on in Topaz but not following their procedures I have to verify if I'm getting plasticky look or not.

1st image is LR with NR. 2nd is back from AI.

               

[kirkt]

I think they know it is an LR and PS issue when going through either. Thanks for offer to contact Topaz. Looking forward to that. I dragged a CR2 file directly into AI Clear and the results were better. I don't have the recommended VRAM so maybe that is a factor preventing a perfect match to the preview.         

I get the artifacts shown in my previous example when I load the full res TIFF into the standalone version of Studio and run AI Clear on it as well.  I doubt that, in my example, it has anything to do with the host application or the RAM or whatever - it appears to be the algorithm.

Kirk

[Zen8]

I get the artifacts shown in my previous example when I load the full res TIFF into the standalone version of Studio and run AI Clear on it as well.  I doubt that, in my example, it has anything to do with the host application or the RAM or whatever - it appears to be the algorithm.

Kirk

I agree 100%. People mentioned PS or LR and since this is early in the game they may have assumed that was the cause.

[Zen8]

I'd like to stick with it because as a details enhancer it does a good job. This is about an 80% crop. 1st image is out of LR with all edits. 2nd is back from AI and exported using LR. Same export settings but no capture sharpening applied (detail tab).

   

[Zen8]

Use it on a duplicate layer set to luminosity blend mode.

How would one approach this using LR?

[smahn]

How would one approach this using LR?

Sorry, not familiar with running Topaz straight from LR. However, via Photoshop Topaz Studio allows you to apply blend modes to your adjustments. I'd imagine the same functionality is present in the LR plugin, but I'll defer to those more versed in that workflow.

[plugsnpixels]

Thanks kirkt, I was able to reproduce those same artifacts on a fusion iMac (NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M 1024 MB).

Are you getting the artifacts with any other image, or images from other camera brands? It would be interesting if that was not the case, and if it still is, then a software fix would be needed.

[Zen8]

Sorry, not familiar with running Topaz straight from LR. However, via Photoshop Topaz Studio allows you to apply blend modes to your adjustments. I'd imagine the same functionality is present in the LR plugin, but I'll defer to those more versed in that workflow.

Thanks. LR does not have that but I just adjusted the tint a bit. Not sure why that would be required at all. Might be part if this algorithm thing. I know they aren't the same but a good idea it bring it up.       

[smahn]

Thanks. LR does not have that but I just adjusted the tint a bit. Not sure why that would be required at all. Might be part if this algorithm thing. I know they aren't the same but a good idea it bring it up.       

Are you able to make a screen grab of the AI Clear interface you're working with? The right side where the adjustments are. I'm tempted to think you should/do have the blend mode option.

[Zen8]

Here you go.

[smahn]

See my red rectangle. That's a blend mode drop down menu. Set it to Luminosity.