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Author Topic: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?  (Read 2432 times)

Zen8

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2018, 04:07:13 pm »

Would a machine be able to work at the patent office and wonder - "what would I see if I rode on a light beam"   

Rory

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2018, 04:31:00 pm »

Would a machine be able to work at the patent office and wonder - "what would I see if I rode on a light beam"   

I hear you and not to in any way denigrate Einstein's achievements, but if he had not made the breakthroughs someone else would have soon enough.  Each insight is achieved on the shoulders of past work.  I see no reason an AI cannot do this in the future.  It is possible that future some breakthroughs will only be achieved by AI.
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Telecaster

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2018, 04:55:18 pm »

I don't expect AI to replicate human intelligence. It'll likely be its own thing, maybe "smarter" than us in some or many respects and less so in others. There are aspects of the world even a turkey perceives and intuits better than we humans do. I'd expect no less from AI.

-Dave-
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Rory

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2018, 05:00:52 pm »

I don't expect AI to replicate human intelligence. It'll likely be its own thing, maybe "smarter" than us in some or many respects and less so in others. There are aspects of the world even a turkey perceives and intuits better than we humans do. I'd expect no less from AI.

-Dave-

+1
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Zen8

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2018, 05:18:19 pm »

Interesting stuff.

chez

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #25 on: October 16, 2018, 06:15:57 pm »

I don't expect AI to replicate human intelligence. It'll likely be its own thing, maybe "smarter" than us in some or many respects and less so in others. There are aspects of the world even a turkey perceives and intuits better than we humans do. I'd expect no less from AI.

-Dave-

You are so exactly right that we humans are not always the most intelligent beings and many animals have intelligence and senses well beyond our means.         
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Zen8

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #26 on: October 16, 2018, 07:08:24 pm »

My dog is way smarter than I am. He doesn't follow me around and pick up my krap.     

StoryinPictures

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #27 on: November 14, 2018, 11:13:20 am »


There are aspects of photography which have become less difficult.  We don't need to bring a cart, mix explosive chemicals with dangerous fumes, paint them on a glass plate, try to keep dust off of them while we load them in a camera to make an exposure before it dries but after we have carefully moved the lens back and forth to get it in focus, being careful to have the aperture shut down and to avoid light getting onto the plate before or after exposure. 

The technology is constantly evolving to make our tasks "easier."  Sometimes, too much so.  "You press the button, we do the rest" was an old Kodak add for the Brownie.

Technology which means I can do less work and not have to get dust on my plates--yes, please! A box which takes away control and frequently makes poor choices--I'll pass.  AI technology that competently removes noise that was introduced by the sensor--sounds great if it does its job correctly.

But there is still a lot of room for creativity and my guess is there will continue to be a space for creativity as the technology proves itself capable of certain tasks, our efforts will move to the spaces where they serve our vision better using the best of the available technology.

Step one is determining which of the automated features help make better pictures and which are better avoided.  Step two is decide how you wish to express your vision.  Step three is do the work.

Looking back at older articles and letters to the editor in older photo publications, you can see that this is a (relatively) old conversation in photography. 

:)
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Redcrown

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #28 on: November 14, 2018, 03:53:14 pm »

Somewhere in the early eighties I was at a big name tech conference. One session was on the future. In one example, a speaker said within 10 years we will see movies with young Marylin Monroe acting beside young Harrison Ford.

Stand-in actors would make the scene. Computers would replace the stand-ins, drawing from every movie ever made by the two stars. Voices would equally be replicated. It would be an elaborate cartoon but no one would be able to tell the difference.

Where is that? I'm still looking for it. The closest I've seen was when Forest Gump met President Kennedy at the White House. No speaker at that conference mentioned self driving cars, although flying cars was a hot topic.
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smahn

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #29 on: November 14, 2018, 05:41:04 pm »

Somewhere in the early eighties I was at a big name tech conference. One session was on the future. In one example, a speaker said within 10 years we will see movies with young Marylin Monroe acting beside young Harrison Ford.

Stand-in actors would make the scene. Computers would replace the stand-ins, drawing from every movie ever made by the two stars. Voices would equally be replicated. It would be an elaborate cartoon but no one would be able to tell the difference.

Where is that? I'm still looking for it. The closest I've seen was when Forest Gump met President Kennedy at the White House. No speaker at that conference mentioned self driving cars, although flying cars was a hot topic.

Not to be too snarky but... ever hear of CGI? It's pretty commonplace these days.
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BJL

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #30 on: November 14, 2018, 05:56:46 pm »

There are aspects of photography which have become less difficult.  We don't need to bring a cart, mix explosive chemicals with dangerous fumes, paint them on a glass plate, try to keep dust off of them while we load them in a camera to make an exposure before it dries but after we have carefully moved the lens back and forth to get it in focus, being careful to have the aperture shut down and to avoid light getting onto the plate before or after exposure. 

...

Technology which means I can do less work and not have to get dust on my plates--yes, please! A box which takes away control and frequently makes poor choices--I'll pass.

I doubt that the options for doing it ourselves are going away, except in some cameras aimed at casual photography.  The early days of auto-focus had some cameras going over-board, not offering manual focus, but camera makers then learnt their lesson. For example, even camera-phones whose basic camera app is AE/AF only offer apps giving more control. It is amazing the number of times I have read in posts in forums that seem to believe that low-level DSLRs are so automated that they lack the option for manual exposure controls or manual metering, but it just ain't so.

And I welcome every new option to allow automation of routine tasks, for the (great majority of) cases where I know that I would make a "standard" choice, so long as manual override is a quick button push or dial twist away.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2018, 08:39:57 am by BJL »
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Redcrown

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #31 on: November 15, 2018, 01:15:13 am »

Not to be too snarky but... ever hear of CGI? It's pretty commonplace these days.

Certainly, I'm always amazed at the fake architecture, explosions, floods, and animals. especially the animals. The tiger in Life of Pi was outstanding (and the CGI company that made it went broke within a year). But where are Marylin and Harrison, Bacon and Bacall, Bogey and Bullock?
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StoryinPictures

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #32 on: November 15, 2018, 01:28:45 am »

Certainly, I'm always amazed at the fake architecture, explosions, floods, and animals. especially the animals. The tiger in Life of Pi was outstanding (and the CGI company that made it went broke within a year). But where are Marylin and Harrison, Bacon and Bacall, Bogey and Bullock?

A tiger doesn't claim property for the use of his image ;)

Ever see "The Congress" with Robin Wright?

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BJL

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #33 on: November 15, 2018, 08:43:26 am »

Certainly, I'm always amazed at the fake architecture, explosions, floods, and animals. especially the animals. The tiger in Life of Pi was outstanding (and the CGI company that made it went broke within a year). But where are Marylin and Harrison, Bacon and Bacall, Bogey and Bullock?
How about Peter Cushing (and briefly a younger Cary Fisher) in "Star Wars Rogue One": https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/rogue-one-creator-defends-cgi-tarkin-says-carrie-fisher-loved-her-digital-self-203453637.html
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Bart_van_der_Wolf

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #34 on: November 15, 2018, 10:51:41 am »

Just to note that CGI and AI are distinctly different subjects that may merge further in the future.

CGI is an already established technique (basically using modeled objects with surface overlays). AI is starting to become accessible to the general public in everyday applications (recognizing or replacing features/structures). Behind the scenes, AI and Neural networks typically depend on lots of (distributed) processing power. Recently AI has been optimized for use on lower processing powered hardware for a few dedicated use-cases, notably feature recognition (like faces/eyes). AI requires training of a system to recognize objects/features. Once trained, it becomes faster to apply actions (like focusing) to the recognized features. Not all AI is neural-network based.

Cheers,
Bart
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Zen8

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #35 on: November 15, 2018, 12:10:33 pm »

It will be interesting but I doubt I'll see it, if it happens. We were watching a mid 90's police show. No computers and they used a big map and pins to follow murder pattens. Look how much has changed in 20+ years. All the face recognition tools, etc. My wife said if that had been a show from the 70's it would have been pretty much the same. I remember playing the most sophisticated game of it's time at the pub - Pong.             

Peter McLennan

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #36 on: November 15, 2018, 12:32:51 pm »

In answer to the OP question:

Yes.

https://ai.googleblog.com/

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Clark

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #37 on: November 30, 2018, 04:56:33 am »

From everything I've heard, AI will be a massive revolution in the coming years.

We can say for sure it's going to get very advanced. What is really hard to predict though, is how it will change our lives. Seems to me that being a creative is one of the slightly safer lines of work to be in.

The thing to remember is: Anything that becomes ubiquitous becomes un-special. People get bored of consuming the same thing all the time. If A.I. makes all pictures look too perfect, people will quickly become interested in real pictures again.

As another poster pointed out, there is already a huge trend for AI modified selfies. This will not last long. In just a few years I would predict it will go completely out of fashion, or become a more niche obsession. 

« Last Edit: November 30, 2018, 05:00:56 am by Clark »
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luxborealis

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #38 on: December 14, 2018, 05:23:59 pm »

Automatic transmissions have been around for decades; I will still choose a standard/manual transmission even if that means switching manufacturers to get one. I know automatic transmissions arenít AI, but I prefer to be in control of whatís happening where the tires meet the road. Auto might be fine for the nice days, but when thereís snow under the wheels, Iím glad to have the skills to drive a standard.

Needless to say, the same goes for photography. Push button processing is rampant even without AI. It may or may not make the end result better. In fact it stifles creativity, just like digital filters have done. And, if all youíve ever done is push button processing, then you wonít have the skills to deal with the more difficult situations.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2018, 05:55:22 pm by luxborealis »
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kirkt

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Re: Will "AI" in post processing overtake craft?
« Reply #39 on: December 21, 2018, 11:54:24 am »

This is interesting and is well beyond accenting a sky by automatically segmenting it and editing its appearance:

https://youtu.be/kSLJriaOumA

kirk
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