Poll

Which (if any) of the new mirrorless systems interest you?

Nikon - 45.7 mp in a compact weathersealed package...
- 29 (34.1%)
Canon - wow - a 28-70 f2.0!
- 5 (5.9%)
Fuji - GH5-alike video with "best of APS-C" stills and great controls - or reasonably priced MF?
- 17 (20%)
I'm waiting for Panasonic - might it be a RED I can afford?
- 8 (9.4%)
Sony hasn't released anything in the past few weeks, but I like my mature system.
- 26 (30.6%)

Total Members Voted: 69


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Author Topic: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?  (Read 4834 times)

BJL

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #100 on: October 07, 2018, 10:02:43 PM »

Both the 70-300 and the 300 PF seem like good lenses for Nikon to (eventually) put out Z-mount versions of (or closely related lenses). Depending on how they do it, they could be ... as heavy as the F-mount version plus the FTZ (in which case, why bother).
With that combination of long focal lengths (so no need to have rear elements close to the sensor) and highish minimum f-stops, I doubt there is room for improvement over current designs, so probably that second options, and they would end up like ...
... what Sigma did when they produced E-mount versions of the ART lenses - they just put what amounts to a permanent mount adapter on the back of existing designs.
My guess is that Z-mount versions of such lenses will wait until there is a significant desire in the market to have a "pure Z" kit, to avoid fiddling with adaptors.
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Dan Wells

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #101 on: October 12, 2018, 03:10:59 AM »

I had a bunch of the current generation of FF (and larger) mirrorless in front of me in a store today.

Nikon Z7 with the 24-70
Sony A7rIII with (unfortunately) the 28-70 f3.5-5.6
Canon EOS R with the 24-105
Fuji GFX-50S with the 32-64

 No opportunity to get real images (what can you tell in camera shop lighting???) - but a good look at the handling. I was there to pick up my Z7 preorder (unfortunately, the bank's "big transaction security" means I'll have to pick it up tomorrow - it was after business hours when they wanted to confirm). Since I had the preorder in, I clearly already favored the Z7, but it was really interesting to see with its competitors.

I'd handled quite a number of Sonys before, and shot with several extensively, although never one of the III series in any depth (I'd played with an A7rIII at PhotoPlus, but that's a mob scene).

I'd handled a Z7 at a launch event and placed a preorder based on that experience, early reviews and the reputation of the sensor (and its close relative, the D850 sensor).

I'd never seen an EOS R before (very few people have).

I'd seen a GFX at PhotoPlus and in a couple of shops, but never spent any time handling one.



I confirmed my personal bias that I like the Z7 the best of the lot for what I do - landscapes, often very far from the trailhead (I admit that I've always liked Nikon and Fuji, and never warmed to Sony handling). It's a relatively compact camera (a tiny bit bigger than the A7rIII, largely because of the larger grip and because the Sony variable-aperture lens is TINY - I'd never seen one of those, not that you'd use it on a 40+ MP body). I was surprised by how  much larger the EOS R is than the Sony and Nikon. The GFX is huge - it's much closer in size to a D850 than to any of the others, and the 32-64 zoom is the size of a typical 24-70 f2.8, despite the shorter range and slower aperture. The 50R may be significantly smaller, but the lenses are the same as the 50S, and that means big...

The Nikon controls are very well placed - the two main dials and the focus point selector fall right to hand for me. No dedicated EV comp dial is an omission, although the button is easy to reach (and the lens ring can be set to EV comp). The Sony dials are not as easy to reach, although the EV comp dial is a very welcome addition. The Canon lacks a focus point selector altogether (I don't find the touchscreen useful with the camera to my eye). The Fuji controls are very nice once you get used to the size of the beast (I was expecting it to feel like an X-H1, which it resembles, but it's so much bigger that it really doesn't).

The Nikon and Fuji grips are the most comfortable for my (big) hands, followed by the Canon. The Sony just didn't feel good in hand (this is entirely personal preference, of course - someone's going to say "I love the Sony grip and the Nikon bulges in all the wrong places" - all that means is that we have differently shaped hands...).

I looked carefully at the visible seals (battery and memory compartments plus the lens mount), and Nikon wasn't kidding when they said "it's sealed like a D850". Big, thick gaskets and very positive locks on the doors. I didn't have a D5 in front of me, but I'd be surprised if there's much difference even there. The Fuji also looks robustly sealed, while the Sony and Canon are less so. I couldn't even see a gasket on their battery doors at all (there may have been a thin one in a groove).

The Fuji lens has absolutely beautiful zoom and focus controls! The little Sony consumer zoom feels very cheap (but that's not the lens most people would actually use on that body - I've never handled a G-Master, but I'm sure it would not disappoint). The Canon 24-105 is big, much more so than I would expect from the modest additional reach, but it's a nice, smooth lens - the lens felt much better built than the (slightly cheap) body. The Nikon lens is slightly stiff on the zoom control - the movement from "lock" to 24mm is (deliberately) very stiff, then it becomes smoother within the zoom range. All the lenses except the Sony felt very well built (yet again, the Sony suffered from the wrong lens).

All four viewfinders are quite good - nothing like the low-resolution, laggy finders on any mirrorless from a few years ago. Nikon boasts of the optics in their finder, and with good reason - best EVF I've ever used, although I've never used the vaunted Leica SL...

All four focused quickly and accurately, even in the low light. No opportunity to track a moving subject. The Nikon's optional pinpoint AF area is wonderfully small, and it does hit it.

All in all, the Nikon is what I would choose (and have chosen) for what I do. The Sony doesn't "feel right" to me, but only the weather sealing is anything but a matter of personal preference - someone else may love its controls and handling, and it certainly makes great images, as a year worth of people using it in the field show. The Canon doesn't feel like the camera and the lenses are meant to go together - the body has a much more "consumer" feel than anything else that was in front of me, while even the 24-105 (the least exotic of its lenses) felt like it was meant for a bigger and more professional body. Did they rush the body out the door, while the lenses had been development for some body we haven't seen yet? The Fuji is huge, and feels like it's more suited for use closer to the car than a multi-hundred mile hike.

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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #102 on: October 12, 2018, 05:40:18 PM »

I wonder if the stats of this survey are any representative.

It doesn’t look like Canon has managed to generate too much excitement with their initial R body.

Wouldn’t it be fun if mirrorless meant that Sony moves to #1, Nikon stayed #2 and Canon slipped to #3? Wouldn’t that be a fair representation of the value brought by these 3 companies the past 5–10 years?

Cheers,
Bernard

faberryman

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #103 on: October 12, 2018, 05:45:12 PM »

I am currently a Fuji user considering the move to full frame. The Nikon is the only camera that peaks my interest, but it will be two to three years before there is a decent selection of native lenses, so there is really not much to get excited about. If I had to choose today, I'd probably go for the Fuji GFX50R.
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Dan Wells

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #104 on: October 31, 2018, 08:10:21 PM »

With a few opportunities to shoot my Z7, plus a look at all of the competitors at PhotoPlus (including the GFX 50R in hand - I'd previously seen a GFX 50S, but not a 50R, and both the Panasonic S1r and the GFX 100S under glass)... I certainly picked the right camera for my use - of course, others' use cases will differ.

The Z7 handles very nicely - it's nothing like my Fujis, but it is a lot like any other modern Nikon. Still getting used to the Nikon handling a bit, but I've always felt that Fuji and Nikon have the two best control systems...

The build quality feels superb - I completely believe Roger Cicala's teardown (I've never seen him so impressed with any camera's build). The one issue is that it's possible to accidentally open the XQD door while getting the camera out of the bag. I'll probably tape the door a bit in tough conditions (the seal's excellent - I just don't want to accidentally pop it open).

The only other issue I've had is that the shots remaining counter (on the card) isn't completely accurate - it usually indicates fewer shots than it really has (this in NEF plus large/fine JPEG). Many cameras do this, although Nikons tend to be off by more than some others...


Looking at the competitors:

The looks I had at the EOS R I had at PhotoPlus confirmed what I saw at my local camera shop - the body doesn't match the quality of the lenses, and they don't really look like they go together (could there be another body that they didn't finish in time for this release)? The body is a nice size, but feels much less solid than the Nikon. The lenses are big and heavy (I haven't seen the little 35mm macro), but beautifully built.

The Panasonic looks like it is close to the size of a D850. There was nothing else in the case to compare it to (it was in a separate case quite a ways from the nearest GH5 or G9), so that is a guess, but it is BIG. The prototype looks relatively finished and production-quality, but I don't think anybody's seen one turned on.

I can't see what still specification it could possibly have that would make the size and weight "worth it" - why would you want a camera the size of a D850 that offered no advantage over a D850 (or a 5DIV if you prefer Canon), without the huge advantage of one of the established systems (and it won't have really solid adapters for anything other than a 12 MP crop using Micro 43 lenses) . We already know that it is about the same resolution as a D850 or a Z7, and it can't have much more dynamic range unless it's got 16-bit output (which has never been seen on anything except a few medium format SLRs). It does have some sort of sensor shift that supposedly generates a 168 MP image, which may be useful for certain situations, but all current versions of this technology require absolutely no motion in either camera or subject, limiting use outside of the studio.

I'm still optimistic that Panasonic will do something class-leading in terms of video. There are unconfirmed rumors of raw video floating around, but Panasonic employees in the booth would not talk about any specification other than those that have already been released - they'll confirm 4K, but nothing more.  There doesn't seem to be anything special about the initial lenses from any specification I've seen. Of course, it's all been "look but don't touch", and they've been VERY coy about specifications (can't even get a weight out of them), but I would think they'd be talking about anything special, trying to get people to wait for it..

The GFX 50R is much larger than it looks in many pictures. I had imagined a somewhat larger X-E3, and it DOES look like an X-E3, but it's probably twice the size. It's about the size of a D850 according to camerasize, but it actually feels bulkier than that... The 50MP sensor is well known for its image quality (and the prints Fuji had in the booth were very impressive) - but it's really big if that matters to you. It handles very well, but it handles like a big camera - I've only handled a Mamiya 6 or 7 a couple of times, and they were years ago, but it's much more like that than any APS-C Fuji, or even any Leica. I've never used the Fuji "Texas Leicas" that used 120 film, but I suspect they're similar. The only real differences in bulk between the 50R and the 50S are the viewfinder and the "hump" on the back of the 50S. The 50R may actually be larger without the protrusions.

Here's a camerasize comparison between the GFX 50R with the 32-64, the D850 with the 24-70 f2.8, the EOS R with the 24-105 f4, the A7rIII with the 24-105 f4 and the Z7 with the 24-70 f4. Camerasize didn't have the Panasonic yet. The lenses aren't quite fair (the D850 has a faster lens, and the Z7 lacks long-end range compared to the Sony and Canon, while the Fuji has less overall range), but there aren't comparable lenses for all the bodies. Each one is the zoom I'd use to carry around, though (the lighter options for D850 and A7rIII sacrifice too much quality).

http://j.mp/2OixXch

Seeing a GFX 100 under glass, it is much larger than either of the GFX 50 models. It's at least the size of a D5 or a 1Dx II, maybe larger. The prototype is clearly a long way from production - the integrated vertical grip doesn't look like it matches the rest of the camera at all. It almost looks like the grip is a 3D printed addition. Maybe it's an odd design decision, and the grip really will have a different finish, but unless that's the case, it looks six months or more from production.



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armand

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #105 on: November 01, 2018, 01:04:05 PM »

The build quality feels superb - I completely believe Roger Cicala's teardown (I've never seen him so impressed with any camera's build). The one issue is that it's possible to accidentally open the XQD door while getting the camera out of the bag. I'll probably tape the door a bit in tough conditions (the seal's excellent - I just don't want to accidentally pop it open).


The door opening is getting annoying, it's starting to become more often than it should.

D Fuller

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #106 on: November 02, 2018, 10:56:11 PM »

The door opening is getting annoying, it's starting to become more often than it should.

How does that happen. It’s never happened with mine (so far).
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armand

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #107 on: November 03, 2018, 06:03:58 AM »

How does that happen. It’s never happened with mine (so far).

It depends on the bag, if it's a tighter fit when pulling it out the door gets caught and opens.

Dan Wells

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #108 on: November 08, 2018, 08:19:15 PM »

A new piece of (completely inscrutable) mirrorless news. Olympus is preparing to launch a new sports-centered M43 camera called the E-M1X - it's bigger than a D850, and almost the size of an EOS-1DX mk II, with a built-in vertical grip...and a M43 sensor! It'll be priced well above the existing E-M1 mk II (hopefully a lot cheaper than the D5 and the EOS-1DX mk II). How do they expect to get away with sensor quality that lags behind a bunch of ~$500-$600 cameras (D3500, A5100, A6000, Fuji X-A5, etc... - anything cheap with a recent Sony 24 MP APS-C sensor) in what will probably be a $3000 camera? I'm sure it'll be fast and rugged, and have great IBIS - the E-M1 mk II is all of that, yet it suffers from a small, resolution and DR challenged sensor. Unless they have a unique (organic?) sensor, they're giving up two stops of sensor quality to literally every other camera anywhere NEAR the same price, size or weight. It'll take a lot of features to make that up.

Almost equally headscratchingly, it seems to use a 7.4 volt battery - no further specs. Most cameras use a 7.2-7.4 volt battery, so that is not in and of itself unusual. The only two cameras I know of with a significantly higher-voltage battery (around 11 volts, so 3 cells rather than 2) are the two sports titans (the D5 and EOS-1DX mk II). A few other Nikons can run at the higher voltage with vertical grips attached and the D5 battery in the grip. The big, high-voltage battery is a big part of why those cameras are so fast in every measure from AF to frame rate to viewfinder blackout (and why their grips aren't removable). Why build a camera with a built-in grip withouttaking advantage by filling it full of battery?

If this were Panasonic, my initial response would be "that's not a camera, it's a camcorder"... There might even be a full-fledged SSD buried in the grip, and 4KP120, 4K raw video and ProRes (or something like that) would explain the size - it would need a ton of space to cool the sensor! I'd wonder why it was built in a DSLR-style body instead of a smaller version of a Sony FS5 type body? Olympus has previously shown little inclination to build camcorders, but it's the best explanation I can think of...
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Telecaster

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #109 on: November 08, 2018, 08:47:13 PM »

The rumored Oly camera is claimed to be capable of high-res mode (~80mp) handheld capture. If they can legitimately pull that off they'll have something. Video features are also claimed to be extensive.

Who knows… I'll pay attention once/if it's real.

-Dave-
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armand

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #110 on: November 08, 2018, 08:50:04 PM »

I couldn't justify the E-M1ii price several years ago and meanwhile the target moved further. This might suffer from the same problem.

DP

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #111 on: November 08, 2018, 08:55:57 PM »

resolution ... challenged sensor.
D500, 1DxII, D5 are the same 20mp level sensor resolution wise... so DR - yes, but resolution is OK for the target audience.
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Telecaster

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #112 on: November 09, 2018, 01:04:03 AM »

The *target audience being folks who print stuff they can display in their homes and/or offices rather than hallucinating about covering museum walls with ginormo Meisterwerke.

(Only partly tongue-in-cheek.)

-Dave-

*With current m43 cameras…got no comment on something that currently exists only as rumor.
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Dan Wells

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #113 on: November 09, 2018, 10:30:32 AM »

While printing big is one issue with the M43 sensors, it's not the only one... They're also DR-challenged to the point that (given exactly the wrong image), it can be visible in a web-sized image. The noise difference can be visible in a relatively small print or online at really high ISOs, and clear in an 8x12 by ISO 1600 or 3200. Maybe Olympus has a new sensor that makes the difference only resolution, and if so, it's much less of an issue - the resolution doesn't crop up as a problem until at least 13x19 (and that requires a very high-detail subject).

I just don't see where the strength that overcomes the weaknesses is. The E-M1 mk II has a niche (not as large as Olympus would like) in that it is by far the fastest camera anywhere near its size or price. It focuses faster, has a higher frame rate and tracks better than anything except the sports titans that cost and weigh more than twice as much (and it's competitive with them).

 When it was introduced, it was also the most rugged camera anywhere near its size or price, and its IBIS was the best on the planet. One reason that Olympus is in trouble right now is that, while there's nothing more rugged or with better IBIS, the competition is a lot closer in those areas without the sensor challenges. Sony, Fuji and Nikon all have excellent IBIS now, and both Sony and Nikon couple it with sensors that have more than twice the resolution and more than two stops of extra dynamic range (Nikon gets close to three stops because of a native ISO 64). Fuji and Nikon, along with Pentax's  KP (a DSLR the size and weight of a  good-sized mirrorless body) have bodies that closely approach the Olympus in build quality and weather sealing. None of them have the E-M1 mk II's speed, but its niche has become "speed in an extremely portable package".

 Lose that portability and you run directly into the sports titans, with 20 years of AF lenses hanging around newsrooms around the world and pro support at every major event. If you're shooting Canon or Nikon for Sports Illustrated at a major league baseball game and you take a foul ball (or, occasionally, a ballplayer) to the lens (the expensive sound of flourite glass breaking is heard at Fenway Park alone at least once a year), someone else in the camera well will get you a lens by the next pitch, you'll have SI's spare lens (which may be a generation older) for tomorrow's game, and CPS or NPS will have your lens fixed or replaced by next week (if it's the playoffs, CPS or NPS will have a lens for you during the next inning break). Can Olympus match that?
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BJL

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - OMD EM1X rumor-cam and DR
« Reply #114 on: November 09, 2018, 11:41:17 AM »

I’d much rather an EM5 Mk 3 than what this rumor describes, but I dispute a bit the claims of a DR advantage for low-light fast action photography when elevated exposure index (“ISO speed”) is needed. In short, it is misleading to count stops of highlight headroom when every photosite is far below full; what counts then is photon counts, shot noise and read noise levels. If a larger format is at ISO 400 or above, photosites all under 1/4 full, and the smaller format can use a shorter, brighter lens of similar front element size and effective aperture diameter, so that the ISO speed can be lower, there is little difference in noise levels and “practical DR”, measured from the brightest pixels down.

A larger format does better on practical DR and noise levels when a larger lens and larger aperture size (not ratio) can be used—that is, when that bigger lens is available, its greater weight and cost is acceptable, and the shallower DOF is also acceptable (or even desired).

Otherwise, longer exposure times are the key to increased practical DR and improved SNR—far more traditional territory of the larger format advantage than fast action photography!
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johnvanatta

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #115 on: November 09, 2018, 06:28:57 PM »

I think the m43 sensor disadvantages get overstated a bit--there are so many situations where 20MP m43 is much, much more than sufficient, and/or realizing the full potential of larger sensors is impossible. Particularly when depth of field is desirable, or IBIS can claw back the ground. Street shooting at night, for example, I'd take my EM-1.2 over my Z7.

But I'm still scratching my head about a fully gripped EM-1 variant. Not just the lack of a strong support network as Dan mentioned...but the lenses. D5 type cameras are usually paired with the big iron, right? 300/2.8 and 400/2.8 type lenses. Huge, expensive, fast. Olympus doesn't really have those right now. The 300/4 is excellent but it's more of a packable wildlife lens, a competitor to Nikon's 500/5.6, not their 400/2.8. The older 4/3 SHG 150/2 and 300/2.8 are optically superb, but their autofocus systems are dated (at least the 150 is, I haven't shot the 300), and they aren't even officially supported anymore. Panasonic has a 200/2.8, which is more like it, but I suspect Oly isn't going to be showing marketing with that mounted  :) There are rumors circling of a 200-400/4 type lens, which would help, but it still seems pretty thin for such a niche camera--even the D5 isn't exactly a high volume product.

Maybe the world is big enough to support a niche (smaller sensor, higher framerate) within a niche (large, fully gripped, super-premium cameras) within a niche (standalone cameras in general)...but....wow.
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BJL

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #116 on: November 09, 2018, 07:17:49 PM »

...
But I'm still scratching my head about a fully gripped EM-1 variant. Not just the lack of a strong support network as Dan mentioned...but the lenses. D5 type cameras are usually paired with the big iron, right? 300/2.8 and 400/2.8 type lenses.

Me too, though I can just maybe see a niche. Skeptically, when someone has enough use for f/2.8 in a long lens to buy and carry such a thing, it has a clear speed advantage over anything likely in Four Thirds format, where I do not expect f/1.4 long lenses. Even f/4 is pushing it, though f/2 counterparts are quite optically feasible (like 200/2 to compete with a 400/4, or 300/2 to compete with a 600/4). On the other hand, anything where 35mm format can now do the job at f/5.6 or higher (which is quite often thanks to the far high usable ISO speeds these days) an equivalent half-length f/2.8 is quite viable.

So my question is how big is the niche is for somewhat less massive and fast lenses, now that Four Thirds sensors can use far higher ISO speeds than 35mm film — and with more cropping latitude — so that the shutter speeds that once needed f/2.8 or f/4 super-telephotos with 35mm film is easily exceeded in Four Thirds with f/5.6 lenses of half the focal length; also meaning that zooms can do jobs that once required several primes. So maybe a big chunk of what used to require pushing the limits of the biggest, fastest long lenses can now be easily surpassed by a smaller, lighter kit in Micro Four Thirds ...

... or in APS-C format. After all, cameras like the Nikon D500 have a following for fast telephoto photography, for the sake of needing somewhat less massive lenses than in 35mm format. If the D500's format downsizing compared to its big brother the D5 makes sense for some use cases, just maybe the rumored E-M1X can too.

P. S. The E-M1X rumor trail:
https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/the-new-olympus-e-m1x-omd-camera-will-be-alunched-in-january-and-have-a-built-in-grip-to-compete-in-the-sports-realm/
https://www.43rumors.com/ft5-the-new-olympus-e-m1x-is-a-canon-1dx-level-camera/
https://www.43rumors.com/ft5-confirmed-olympus-registered-a-new-omd-model-with-built-in-grip/
https://www.43rumors.com/ft5-the-new-e-m1x-can-shoot-handheld-high-resolution-images/
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Telecaster

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #117 on: November 09, 2018, 09:09:45 PM »

I just don't see where the strength that overcomes the weaknesses is.

See attached pic of my usual travel bag, with me on my current trip, containing a Panasonic GX8 and five lenses: 12–35/2.8; 35–100/2.8, 100–300/4.0–5.6; 20/1.7 & 42.5/1.7. Now imagine the bulk and weight of a bag containing the "equivalent" lenses coverage-wise in deity-approved full frame.

Also, in my experience your comments about dynamic range and noise as they pertain to m43 cameras are all but irrelevant in most real-world use. Measurable? Yes. Meaningful? Mostly no, particularly when size & weight are any kind of factor.

-Dave-
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johnvanatta

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Re: Mirrorless comparison - Does anything announced recently help you?
« Reply #118 on: November 09, 2018, 09:26:06 PM »

See attached pic of my usual travel bag...

m43 is unmatched in portability. But would you be interested in adding an expensive, chunky, fully gripped EM-1x as the body to use with your kit? That's the part I'm not quite getting. Big form factor cameras strike me as highly specialized, and not very well matched to the rest of the system.
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BJL

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Mirrorless comparison - would the Olympus E-M1X make much sense?
« Reply #119 on: November 09, 2018, 10:23:46 PM »

m43 is unmatched in portability. But would you be interested in adding an expensive, chunky, fully gripped EM-1x as the body to use with your kit?
Not with most MFT lenses, but if you start using it with fast "sport/wildlife" lenses, extra body weight could cease to be much of a disadvantage, especially if usage would need a battery pack/vertical grip added anyway if it were not built-in. What if for example Olympus plans to match some of its extreme Four Thirds SLR lens designs, like
300mm f//2.8       3,290 g
90-250mm f/2.8   3,270 g
150mm f/2           1,610 g
35-100mm f/2      1,650 g
or a bit more modestly, my favorite
50-200/2.8-3.5      995 g

So far though the MFT heavyweights are a more reasonable
300mm f/4            1270 g from Olympus
and
200mm f/2.8         1245 g from Panasonic
These are already significantly heavier than the rumored E-M1X body is likely to be.
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