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Author Topic: New Capital  (Read 2854 times)

RSL

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #60 on: May 26, 2018, 10:11:19 AM »

It's a good point, Rob. But when you start limiting the ability of citizens to own the tools of self-defense, you're likely eventually to arrive at the position of Venezuela or North Korea where the only guns are in the hands of dictators and their flunkies.

Farmer

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #61 on: May 26, 2018, 06:54:36 PM »

It's a good point, Rob. But when you start limiting the ability of citizens to own the tools of self-defense, you're likely eventually to arrive at the position of Venezuela or North Korea where the only guns are in the hands of dictators and their flunkies.

Yes.  Canada, Australia, UK, NZ, most of Europe, Japan...so few good examples compared to your extreme ones, right?

There's nothing "likely" about your scenario unless you add in dictatorships, or unless you have governments who blatantly and openly lie and attempt to control and suppress the media and who have blind followers who accept their every word...

Rob's point was exactly on point.  There's a reason miltiary and police forces use guns and not other forms of weapons.  Guns amplying and multiply the killing capacity of an individual more than any other personal weapon.  Easy access to guns means far more people are able to inflict far more damage and death then if they didn't have access.

The US can and should determine what it thinks is right for itself, but when I see some folks literally saying that the 2nd Amendment is "God given" and cannot be removed, I think there's a strong case to suggest some people shouldn't have so much of a say in things.

So, yes, people do things, but when you give them tools that make them better at it then there are consequences and your founding fathers could not possibly have conceived the impact of personal arms in the modern US.  But, hey, just turn your schools into maximum security prisons, with more protection than a military base - that'll be an outstanding learning environment for kids and will help to "fix" the education problem you think exists.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2018, 06:58:51 PM by Farmer »
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Phil Brown

LesPalenik

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #62 on: May 26, 2018, 08:42:58 PM »

But, hey, just turn your schools into maximum security prisons, with more protection than a military base - that'll be an outstanding learning environment for kids and will help to "fix" the education problem you think exists.

The next logical step in securing the schools after training the teachers in close combat tactics would be to install metal detectors at the entrance and equip the janitors with high-speed rifles.

jeremyrh

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #63 on: May 27, 2018, 04:10:53 AM »

It's just democracy in action. Americans have had many opportunities to vote against slaughter in schools, but they have chosen not to do so. Inexplicable, from this side of the world, and unfortunate for the murdered children, but we have to respect their decision.
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Rob C

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #64 on: May 27, 2018, 06:13:57 AM »

It's just democracy in action. Americans have had many opportunities to vote against slaughter in schools, but they have chosen not to do so. Inexplicable, from this side of the world, and unfortunate for the murdered children, but we have to respect their decision.

But is it democracy?

Where the gun lobby has so much influence, democracy and its expression seem a doubtful coupling.

But I wouldn't suggest that it's simply a US problem: guns, perhaps, but our own media and those who control it are as agenda-driven as anywhere else; it's just a slightly different agenda.

Anyone who sat watching the Brexit thing unfold - as I did, because of its possible impact on my life and security as a foreigner abroad - would laugh at the idea that there was much truth being bandied about. Rather, there were interviews aplenty with the unsophisticated grunts of English labour (one, in Sunderland, acually claimed that Japan had factories in the UK because of the UK's unique engineering skills! (Unique, today? Where hardly any people get an apprenticehip in anything?) Even the often maligned Scots were able to see through that, possibly because they already know how transient the power of the shipyard, the coalmine etc.

There is a visible parallel to that in the politicians and officials who eschew proper dress code by appearinjg in public sans tie or even a formal suit. Public life appearance is not about showing what a cool dude you are at home or on the ranch, or on the farm; it's about observing the dignity of, and a respect towards the public office that, for better or worse, it's your turn to hold and represent. If you can't even uphold that simple prerequisite, what hope anything more sacred such as principle, and the common good?

Slobodan Blagojevic

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #65 on: May 27, 2018, 09:35:52 AM »

It's just democracy in action. Americans have had many opportunities to vote against slaughter in schools, but they have chosen not to do so. Inexplicable, from this side of the world, and unfortunate for the murdered children, but we have to respect their decision.

When something appears “inexplicable,” perhaps it is time to question our own ability to understand, and how much our own mental and ideological framework prevents us from understanding?

Rob C

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Re: New Capital
« Reply #66 on: May 27, 2018, 01:57:35 PM »

When something appears “inexplicable,” perhaps it is time to question our own ability to understand, and how much our own mental and ideological framework prevents us from understanding?


That pretty neatly defines my take on religion: religion is flawed, but the belief in a reality beyond present understanding is not; it's just too far out of our league to be understood. Denial forces parallel or collateral denial of many things we see but don't understand...
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