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Author Topic: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in ... late September 2018  (Read 66399 times)

BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #500 on: August 22, 2018, 05:54:55 pm »

Im hoping they put a second slot in the battery grip.

I am not sure that adding a high speed databus connection btwn the body and the grip would be such a good design.

Now that would ensure that 3rd party grips arenít easily released... ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

Alex Waugh

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #501 on: August 22, 2018, 06:04:50 pm »

I am not sure that adding a high speed databus connection btwn the body and the grip would be such a good design.

Now that would ensure that 3rd party grips arenít easily released... ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

You are correct I did not even think of the data requirements going though the grip. I think we'll get 2 slots - all shall be revealed in a few hours anyway.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #502 on: August 22, 2018, 08:01:12 pm »

Nikonrumors is now back pedaling a bit on this lack of double memory slots, we shall see in 4 hours. ;)

This picture seem to hint at the fact that there is only an XQD slot, but there may be a SD hidden behind it.

https://nikonrumors.com/2018/08/22/more-nikon-z6-leaks-new-specs-pictures.aspx/

On the D850 the SD slot only takes 5 mm extra next to the XQD.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 08:13:19 pm by BernardLanguillier »
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shadowblade

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #503 on: August 22, 2018, 08:30:52 pm »

https://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/first-real-world-image-of-the-nikon-z-leaked-plus-specs-and-size-comparison-with-other-mirrorless-cameras/

  • The Z7 looks like a mirrorless D850 with higher frame rate. Other sources are stating it's based off the same sensor.
  • The number of AF points is far less relevant than the performance of those points. That goes equally for the D850, A7r3, A7III, A9 and these new cameras. It doesn't matter if you have 1000 AF points if they don't perform. Equally, the D850 seems to AF just fine, despite its 150-or-so points (their reduced accuracy and consistency vs the A7r3 points, as documented on Jim Kasson's website, being related to the nature of DSLR vs mirrorless focusing rather than being due to the number of points, and their speed makes up for it).
  • I doubt Nikon would be so monumentally stupid as to give these cameras one card slot only. They aren't competing against the first- or second-generation A7r, which were, in many ways, basically fit-for-release prototypes released into an environment with no peer competition - they're competing against the A7r3 and A9 (as well as whatever Canon decides to release) for high-end users. For this, dual card slots is almost a must. Note that the rumour says one XQD card. XQD cards are a fair bit larger than SD cards (although not huge by any means). There could well be one XQD card and one SD card slot - a bit like how many SLRs have one CF slot and one SD slot for backup.
  • 9/10/12fps is really much of a muchness. It puts all of them in the same class frame rate wise - more than fast enough for sports and fast action, but not quite an A9. No-one ever faulted the D3 for having 9fps instead of 10fps like the 1D3, or the D5 for having 12fps instead of 14. The more relevant question is whether this is with electronic shutter only or not, and what happens to the viewfinder during shooting.
  • If the Nikon has dual card slots, then price could turn out to be the killer, particularly if the rumour about both bodies having the same price is true. £3399 for the Z7 vs £2899 for the A7r3, with far fewer native-mount lenses available, is enough of a step up in price to hurt the Nikon. If the Z6 is also Ā£3399, it would be absolutely ridiculous vs the A7III.
  • In the context of these cameras, the A7s3 will be a very interesting release, since it will likely be closest to the Nikons in terms of release date and price (the A7III being a budget design which just happens to perform very, very well). If they manage to bump up the resolution to 24MP and integrate A7r3/A9-type AF capability, while maintaining the focus on high-ISO capability like the rest of the A7s series, the Z6 could be in trouble
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #504 on: August 22, 2018, 08:57:16 pm »

  • I doubt Nikon would be so monumentally stupid as to give these cameras one card slot only.

I hope that you are right.

I would be incredibly ironic to see Nikon over-achieve on all the super challenging technological aspects you have been highlighting for weeks in terms of AF, sensor, weight, size, heat, ability to release 2 cameras,... to see them fail on this super basic aspect that is only a marketing decision.  ;D

Now, Nikon may think that the level of performance of their camera is so high (in particular on the AF front) that buyers will be able to overcome this limitation with limited actual practical impact. And this may be paving the way for upcoming Z8/Z9 cameras with higher megapixels and speed that would have double slots.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 09:55:42 pm by BernardLanguillier »
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eronald

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #505 on: August 22, 2018, 09:37:10 pm »

There's an interesting new/old comparison photo (or mockup?) below, the Nikon mount looks huge, enough for 44x33 MF, or maybe in-body stabilisation for video..

https://www.sonyalpharumors.com
Edmund
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DP

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #506 on: August 22, 2018, 10:38:34 pm »

the Nikon mount looks huge, enough for 44x33 MF
mount yes, but what about contact pins above sensor inside the chamber for communication w/ lenses - are you sure they will allow such sensor ?
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BJL

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #507 on: August 22, 2018, 11:09:28 pm »

There's an interesting new/old comparison photo (or mockup?) below, the Nikon mount looks huge, enough for 44x33 MF, or maybe in-body stabilisation for video..

https://www.sonyalpharumors.com
Edmund
Bigger than Sonyís APS-C 46mm, but it looks well under 55mm, so not nearly big enough to work with the 55mm diagonal of 44x33mm sensors.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #508 on: August 22, 2018, 11:56:00 pm »

https://nikonrumors.com/2018/08/22/nikon-z-and-nikkor-500mm-f-5-6-lens-japanese-pricing.aspx/

Prices in Japan are clearly targeting the upper end segment.

Nikon is obviously very confident about the level of performance of these bodies... it doesn't look like they have targeted the a7rIII, but more the a7rIV. ;)

Cheers,
Bernard

BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #509 on: August 23, 2018, 12:28:52 am »

Live from Nikon event:
- Z mount inner diameter is 55mm, flange distance is 16mm
-> best future potential

- z7: 45.7 mp, 493 focus points (phase + contrast), end of Sept availability, open price, est retail 440,000 Japanese Yen incl tax
- z6: 24.5 mp, ISO 100-51200, 12 fps, end of Nov availability, est retail 270,000 Japanese Yen incl tax

shared features: fully weatherproof, expeed 6 (new middle range sharpening), EVF (aspherical glass used, quad-VGA EVF, 3.6 mp), IBIS (5 axis, 5 stop), FF 4K 30p, FF HD 120, 10 bits NLOG HMDI output, lenses with quiter AF and little focus breathing, smooth focus, aperture change, battery pack available, new lens production quality/tolerances, full compatibility with existing flashes.

All lenses announced and planned belong to a new S line (highest quality, seems to correspond to Canon L)
- 3 lenses as rumored (24-70 f4, 35mm f1.8, 50mm f1.8), said to be amazing performers at full aperture from closeup to infinity, very little CA (including axial), great corner performance, great bokeh, multi-focus systems,  great AF performance
- 58mm f0.95 Noct under developement - super sharp and great bokeh
- 5 lenses in 2019 (20mm f1.8, 85mm f1.8, 24-70 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8, 14-30 f4)
- 3+ lenses in 2020 (50mm f1.2 - first of a new f1.2 line, 24mm f1.8, 14-24mm f2.8)

Prices/releases dates of lenses in Japan:
- 24-70: end of Sept, suggested retail 136,000 Yen excl tax
- 35mm f1.8: end of Sept, suggested retail 114,000 Yen excl tax
- 50mm f1.8: end of Oct, suggested retail 83,000 Yen excl tax
- mount f->Z: end of Sept, suggested retail, 36,000 Yen excl tax

Unfortunately, the single card slot is confirmed as well as the lack of eye AF feature (even if face detection AF is said to be very effective). These 2 may be dealbreakers for many potential buyers.

Battery life is reported to be good from DPreview, with 1,600 images per battery charge in real world usage.

Cheers,
Bernard 
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 01:17:18 am by BernardLanguillier »
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Alex Waugh

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #510 on: August 23, 2018, 12:57:36 am »

Terrible presentation from Nikon ambassadors but what can you expect. I thought the zoom was a good size but im not a fan of the double telescope, 1k for 1.8 lenses is steep.

Only things I want to know about are EVF quality, availability of grip and card slots. Looks like I might be sticking with SLRs for a while but maybe that will change when I hold one.

Way less sexy than a D850 also.

EDIT
Raw specs - https://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/mirrorless/z_7/spec.htm

1/200 sync
XQD only (1 slot?)
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 01:18:15 am by Alex Waugh »
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jeremyrh

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #511 on: August 23, 2018, 01:41:48 am »

So what happens if Sony stop making XQD cards....?
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Martin Kristiansen

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #512 on: August 23, 2018, 01:49:02 am »

As a Sony user my 2c. I think it looks OK. Never been a huge fan of the melted cheese styling of the big DSLRís. I donít think the looks are such a big deal anyway quite honestly and I donít find the camera actually offensive.

Single card slot doesnít bother me. I shoot a lot and I have never had a SD card fail and these new cards are reported even more stable. CF were a lot more wobbly. Anyway all my commercial stuff is shot therhered. I donít do weddings.

The 24 to 70 F4 would be a buy for me. Wouldnít go near the very fast primes. Not my style.

I think all round a pretty solid looking entry into FF mirrorless. Doesnít tempt me to swop to Nikon but if I was just entering the mirrorless field this would be worth a look for me. If it had been around two years ago there is a strong chance I would have bought this. I had to overcome some pretty strong prejudices initially to go Sony.
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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #513 on: August 23, 2018, 02:29:47 am »

So what happens if Sony stop making XQD cards....?

- Lexar is supposed to restart manufacturing of XQD cards,
- Delkin is making some too,
- Nikon is now selling some too.

Cheers,
Bernard
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 02:56:09 am by BernardLanguillier »
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davidgp

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #514 on: August 23, 2018, 02:35:01 am »

For me here... the most interesting announcement from Nikon is the lens roadmap... it shows a clear compromise with the new mount system, for any person that has doubts about the future of a new lens mount system. Because if you relay in AF, you will want to go native at some point...

In terms of features of the cameras, Looking at the sheet, I donít see something that is that much stronger or weaker than the competition, but I suppose we will need to wait to autumn for some independent review and analysis of the cameras.

Looks like Nikon went for video market also, something they didnít took that seriously in the F mount...

My two cents...


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davidgp

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #515 on: August 23, 2018, 02:38:04 am »

So what happens if Sony stop making XQD cards....?

Nothing, XQD is a format proposed by Sony, Nikon and SanDisk... part now of the CompactFlash association... and several manufacturers announcing cards now...


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alatreille

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #516 on: August 23, 2018, 02:47:35 am »

Can we mount canon lenses on these?

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BernardLanguillier

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #517 on: August 23, 2018, 02:52:31 am »

Can we mount canon lenses on these?

Most certainly, although it will remain to be seen how they behave AF wise.

You should even be able to mount Sony mirrorless lenses on this. The mount is much larger with a more shallow flange distance, it should be enough to build a adapter. Since the Sony AF protocol is public, the adapter manufacturers will just need to reverse engineer the Nikon Z/S protocol.

Cheers,
Bernard

alan_b

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #518 on: August 23, 2018, 03:10:38 am »

So what happens if Sony stop making XQD cards....?

Apparently CFexpress cards will also work down the road with a firmware update.
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Alex Waugh

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Re: Nikonís new mirrorless system, coming in early 2019
« Reply #519 on: August 23, 2018, 03:18:01 am »

I would like to know if they have different aspect modes. A proper 4x5 would be lovely. I would also like information about the grip and am a bit perplexed it wasn't in the roadmap. I have pre-ordered without a deposit requirement from my local dealer, I'll see what the next few weeks brings.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 03:23:00 am by Alex Waugh »
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