Epson Legacy Platine Profile says to use PLU260 media settings, not Platine?!

[narikin]

Noticed that the Legacy Platine profile for Epson instructs you to use the PLU260 media profile, not the Legacy Platine media profile.
(Platine is a media choice available on both printer panel and printer driver)

Huh?  Can anyone shed light on this?

The Epson profile is very good otherwise, I can't better it custom wise and I'd like to use it, but this has confused me.

[Mark D Segal]

It probably just means that they issued the paper before they included that paper as a Media Type in an updated driver version. When they issued the paper they generated a profile for it using Premium Luster 260 as the reference Media Type. If you use the same Media Type in your driver settings that they used for creating that profile, the profile should perform decently for you with Legacy Platine paper. You could probably improve on its accuracy somewhat by generating a custom profile using Legacy Platine as the Media Type, if you have high quality profiling software and spectro at hand.

[Rand47]

Noticed that the Legacy Platine profile for Epson instructs you to use the PLU260 media profile, not the Legacy Platine media profile.
(Platine is a media choice available on both printer panel and printer driver)

Huh?  Can anyone shed light on this?

The Epson profile is very good otherwise, I can't better it custom wise and I'd like to use it, but this has confused me.

Which printer are you using?  And, since the driver offers you Platine as a media type, is the profile you are referring to the one that came with the printer driver package? 

Rand

[narikin]

Which printer are you using?  And, since the driver offers you Platine as a media type, is the profile you are referring to the one that came with the printer driver package? 

Rand

P20000,

And, yes the profile and media settings came with the printers firmware/software utility.

Mark - Thanks for your input:

Agree with you, and will use PLU, but it seems odd - Epson need to update the titles of their profiles. The profile name simply has 'Legacy Platine' in its title, and has no indication there to use PLU260 setting in it. So only someone who remembers the accompanying PDF would ignore the obvious choice Platine for Platine, and choose PLU instead!

[Rand47]

P20000,

And, yes the profile and media settings came with the printers firmware/software utility.

Mark - Thanks for your input:

Agree with you, and will use PLU, but it seems odd - Epson need to update the titles of their profiles. The profile name simply has 'Legacy Platine' in its title, and has no indication there to use PLU260 setting in it. So only someone who remembers the accompanying PDF would ignore the obvious choice Platine for Platine, and choose PLU instead!

That’s really strange.  It would seem that one of two things is the case.  Either Epson has two versions of the profile (one that works with the “Platine” choice as media choice, and one that works with PLU), OR that Epson added the “Platine” paper choice in the driver settings, but underneath that it is based on their single profile that was made using PLU.  This is the kind of inconsistent “black box” stuff that I hate about Epson, even though I love their printers.

Mark, any chance that your contacts at Epson could shed some light on this?

Rand

[Rand47]

....You could probably improve on its accuracy somewhat by generating a custom profile using Legacy Platine as the Media Type, if you have high quality profiling software and spectro at hand.  . . .   

Mark,   I genuinely appreciate your intent, and even the quasi-logic to what you’ve said above.  BUT, my question is what the heck is the “Platine” paper type for if it is inappropriate to use with the profile that is provided in the same driver package?  It is non-sensical.  Unless Epson is so obtuse as to assume anyone selecting “Platine” from the paper type selections is only going to use “printer manages color” in an application.  Please tell me that’s not true!  Epson is either incredibly sloppy in not even thinking about these kinds of situations and the confusion they cause, or just don’t understand their customer base very well.

Arrrghhh....

Rand

[Mark D Segal]

My first few sentences in reply #1 explain what I think may have been the sequence of events that occurred. I really can't add anything to that. Ideally, the new paper, the new media type and the new driver update with all that included should happen simultaneously. Maybe it didn't, explaining the disconnect. But this is really no big deal. One just uses the Media Type in the driver that was used for creating the profile and the prints should be fine. The key thing is the consistency between the two. And people should keep their drivers, profiles and Media Type settings always up to date.

[Alan Goldhammer]

It's worth reposting this link from Scott Martin regarding selection of the optimal media setting:  http://www.on-sight.com/how-to-determine-the-optimal-media-selection-for-any-paper/  I have found on occasion that the manufacturer's suggested setting is not optimal.  This is not in reference to Epson branded papers as I do not use them so it's really not all that relevant to the question posed by the OP but Mark Dubovoy also pointed this out about a decade ago in a LuLa article.

[Mark D Segal]

It's worth reposting this link from Scott Martin regarding selection of the optimal media setting:  http://www.on-sight.com/how-to-determine-the-optimal-media-selection-for-any-paper/  I have found on occasion that the manufacturer's suggested setting is not optimal.  This is not in reference to Epson branded papers as I do not use them so it's really not all that relevant to the question posed by the OP but Mark Dubovoy also pointed this out about a decade ago in a LuLa article.

Yes Alan, that reference has a specific context, quote: "If you have a 3rd party paper and you aren’t quite sure which media selection to use in the printer driver,....".

However, when you are certain which Media Type was used to make the profile because the manufacturer/provider tells you as much, then you simply use it, because it's the technically coherent approach and therefore most likely the best fit. Occasionally one can do a bit more *to taste* by selecting a "nearest neighbour" Media Type, so no harm trying a couple, but I think the generic approach most often holds its own.

[ssgphoto]

Once difference I have found is that on the p20000 the media settings add different amounts of leader margin, the Platine setting adds quite a lot and premium luster not at all. I found this to be true of many different media on this machine whereas it was never part of the 11880 driver or media settings.  It most annoying when using sheets and figuring this out has been extremely frustrating. Of course the p20000 is built for speed and is not ideal for sheets but there are needs form time to time. I have naturally defaulted PLU media and never noticed that since I dont use the Epson platine as much as I prefer the Innova.

Another media setting thing worth noting is that the Hot press bright media setting actually crashes my printer, all the others work. I wonder if Anyone else has discovered this. (Firmware and driver are up to date).

[Wayne Fox]

I believe the addition of the Legacy media types will be followed up eventually with a Profile based on using those media types. certainly would have been more logical to wait on the media preset until the profiles were ready.  Does the Legacy profiles install with the installer now or do they still need to be downloaded separately?  Whenever they install with the driver at that point the matching media type should be used instead of the one recommended when you download and install them separately.  This is pretty much how it has worked with all new Epson media introductions.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the media type settings for the two papers isn’t identical anyway, so either media type might deliver identical results.

Legacy Baryta and Platine on rolls requires customizing the settings anyway to get good results, I have to use 5mm as the thickness, platen gap to wide and roll back tension to high.  Otherwise I get head strikes and scratches.

Fortunately Lightroom templates remember all of these settings so I don’t have remember to set them.

[Mark D Segal]

I believe the addition of the Legacy media types will be followed up eventually with a Profile based on using those media types. certainly would have been more logical to wait on the media preset until the profiles were ready.  Does the Legacy profiles install with the installer now or do they still need to be downloaded separately?  Whenever they install with the driver at that point the matching media type should be used instead of the one recommended when you download and install them separately.  This is pretty much how it has worked with all new Epson media introductions.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the media type settings for the two papers isn’t identical anyway, so either media type might deliver identical results.

Wayne, re the last sentence above, Platine and Premium Luster have a different substrate, differnet thickness, different thickness, so I would expect some difference in the Media Type specs, but maybe not much that one needs to be overly concerned about a choice between these two. Premium Luster contains OBAs whereas Platine does not, but that is more a profiling issue.

Re the previous para, at least since this past May (if not earlier), the Epson driver for the P5000 printer has already included their own Legacy Profiles, so no need to download them separately, and the Legacy Media Types are all in the driver as well, so there is no longer any disconnect between Media Type and profile for this printer; hence I would expect likewise for the previous printer releases in this series.

[schertz]

The Legacy paper Media Type(s) in the driver is also there to be used with "Printer Managers Colour", for example when printing with AB&W...

[Rand47]

The Legacy paper Media Type(s) in the driver is also there to be used with "Printer Managers Colour", for example when printing with AB&W...

And this is exactly the point I was trying to drive home.  Re the above, it would seem logical enough, but “Says who?”  That seems an assumption on our parts w/ ZERO credible information from Epson.  Where in the manual are we told this?  In the paper packaging?  Via a customer info bulletin for registered owners?

And “yes” the Platine media type, came with, and was installed right along with the ICC profile, in the single driver package on my SC P5000 printer — with ZERO information from Epson on when, how, with what ICC profile (or not) the media for Platine should be used.

Mark, of course is correct, one can “assume” that the info in the ICC profile itself is correct (albeit confusing as heck considering there’s a Platine paper type) and use PLU as media type.  But this group of people here tend to be better informed in general than the average Epson purchaser.  How the hell is the average Joe or Jane supposed to figure this out on their own.  It’s just poor....

Rand

[Mark D Segal]

Rand,

This is really not complicated. On page 57 of the Manual (for the SC-P5000) it says to select the Media Type that matches the paper you loaded. Fine, so if you loaded Platine, you select Platine Media Type. Done. And it works as expected for a non-custom profile.

In the very early days of the Legacy Paper line, the paper came out before the driver update. That could have caused some temporary confusion, but we're long past that.