Trump II

[Schewe]

BTW Alan, I notice you have not responded to my challenge to point to a post where I claimed Trump was guilty of collusion...

You are welcome to quote me when you can but don't put words into people's mouths.

[Alan Klein]

It is my experience tells me when somebody says "trust me", that is the exact thing not to do. Based on the fact that Trump seems unable to form coherent sentances and string them into meaningful thoughts without reading from a teleprompter, I admit to believing Trump is  dim bulb that doesn't have a clue how to govern and that is baced up by the leaders of the GOP saying Trump is new at this being a political operative. Wow when your friends admit you don't know what you are doing, that's not a ringing endorsement...

"Trust me" on that...

:-)

I agree, Jeff, that he does have problems with public speaking.  He confuses words, leaves words out, even gets things wrong often.  Well, he's not a lawyer or politician who know how to talk out of both sides of their mouths, who when they're done, you don't know really where they stand.  So we're going to have to put up with his malapropisms.  (I'm not sure that's the right word.) 

I think we all give each other the right to misspell words here in our posts and get the grammar wrong.  But, we mainly respond to the points being made in them.   We should do the same with Trump.  Playing "gotcha" games politically will eventually come back to bite you on the you know what.  People eventually "get it" and will sympathize with him because of that kind of game playing. 

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

...

[Alan Klein]

BTW Alan, I notice you have not responded to my challenge to point to a post where I claimed Trump was guilty of collusion...

You are welcome to quote me when you can but don't put words into people's mouths.

You and the main stream media have continuously hinted that Trump colluded with the Russians.  You still did it in that post you referred too.  Well, Comey finally put it to bed by confirming under oath before Congress as he told Trump privately months before that there was no investigation of Trump regarding collusion. 

So I'm confused by your question.  Do you still claim Trump colluded?  A simple Yes or No will do.  Not some long wordy exclamation that attempts to hide your belief. 

[Schewe]

So I'm confused by your question.  Do you still claim Trump colluded?  A simple Yes or No will do.  Not some long wordy exclamation that attempts to hide your belief.

I don't know if Trump colluded with Russia...neither do you. All I know is that when Comey was director Trump was not personally under investigation. Bet he's under investigation now for obstruction :-)

Feinstein has called for one...
I'm thinking Trump jumped out of the fire and into the frying pan now that there's a special council.

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

Come on, Slobo, I think you are deliberately misleading this forum with that post.  Show me an example of a dead man's skeleton saying those words.

Meet Achmed...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBvfiCdk-jc

He may not have said those words, but then "what does it mean when he speaks words?".

Cheers,
Bart

[mecrox]

You really have to stop watching liberal media only.  I realize 95% of the world's media is biased liberal, but you need to get some balance. 

Comey helped Trump today because he removed the cloud of collusion over him.  Now Trump can deal with the Russians. (see my previous post on this).  The President still has a Republican controlled congress.  So all the wheels of Washington power are Republican.  You've been so caught up in the liberal press's "let's destroy Trump" campaign, you haven't been paying attention to what Trump has been doing domestically and internationally to reverse Obama's lackluster administrations and liberal direction. 

Regarding Pence becoming President, there's no way Trump will get impeached, much less convicted by the 2/3 vote of the Senate.  The only way Pence will become President if Trump dies in office.    If the democrats want to regain power, they have to come up with a real plan of how they intend to help Americans rather than relying on calling the President obscene names.  Anyway, Trump, as you saw in the campaign, is better at that then anyone else.

Thanks. I wasn't really thinking of the usual ding-dong but about the level of competence in government without which a modern state cannot function effectively. It's become a hugely complex business involving countless thousands of people. If enough of them won't play ball, government jobs go unfilled and everything takes a turn for the worse, things just stop working and in the end voters will drop the hammer for all that on a party not just on a leader. I'd have thought that's a potential problem for the Trump administration. If enough people simply won't deal with it, the consequences will land on the Republican Party with Mr Pence smiling in the wings like the Cheshire Cat. It looks to me as if that is the big risk for Trump and entourage, the feeling that they're just not up to the task. Every Congressional hearing, foreign policy cock-up etc. simply weakens him and feeds the perception of incompetence. So I guess the question is for how long will the politicians wear it.

[Alan Klein]

I don't know if Trump colluded with Russia...neither do you. All I know is that when Comey was director Trump was not personally under investigation. Bet he's under investigation now for obstruction :-)

Well,  I don't know if you robbed a bank or not.   But if the FBI director swore under oath that you weren't under investigation,  I would give you the benefit of the doubt.

[Peter McLennan]

I think we all give each other the right to misspell words here in our posts and get the grammar wrong.

OK, fair enough. I'll stop. But understand, please, that with good spelling and grammar comes credibility. With poor spelling and grammar, the opposite. Typos are one thing, crap spelling and grammar another.

The same rules apply to our photography.  Most of us can determine a photographer's credibility by viewing his or her images, right?

But, we mainly respond to the points being made in them.   We should do the same with Trump.

We would if only we could understand what he's saying.  The Mexican president following a meeting with Trump described him as "unintelligible".  I agree.

I guess we're supposed to follow Conway's instructions to listen to what he means, not what he says.

[Peter McLennan]

Does it come as a surprise that anti-Trumpers, otherwise known to appear reasonably intelligent prior to his election, now take everything literally?

How else should we take "everything"? 

[Alan Klein]

Well, I wouldn't judge your photography by the way you spoke either. I have a good friend who stutters.  But he's got a great heart  and is a wonderful person. I have to be patient and allow him to get through his sentences  to understand what he's trying to say. So let's see what Trump does as president rather than the way he says it. Then we can judge how good or bad a president he is.

[Schewe]

Well,  I don't know if you robbed a bank or not.   But if the FBI director swore under oath that you weren't under investigation,  I would give you the benefit of the doubt.

Do you understand the difference between "not being under investigation" from "not suspected of collusion"? Comey said Trump wasn't under investigation not that Trump was not suspected of colluding...

Comey said he told Trump he wasn't currently under investigation and declined to make that public because then he would be FORCED to publicly state he WAS under investigation if that changed and the investigation was expanded to include Trump personally.

Just be clear, Trump and his campaign are not out of the woods...the Russian investigation is STILL being conducted to determine what role Russia had in the meddling in the election and whether or not the Trump campaign colluded with the people responsible with the meddling.

Flynn and Manafort are people of interest. Flynn wants immunity and his lawyer says he has stories to tell in exchange. Hum wonder what he might say and I wonder if that has anything to do with the fact that Trump went way out on a limb to have the FBI quite investigating Flynn? What about Kushner? Think he's under investigation? We know that Federal prosecutors have subpoenas issued by a grand jury issued  and a FISA warrant as part of the Russian/Trump Camp investigation...

While the administration has sent out their surrogates with their talking points the fact remains the ONLY thing we now know for a fact is that Comey wasn't investigating Trump personally. We also know Comey says Trump has lied and we know Trump is claiming Comey lied. So, who do you believe?

Either Trump or Comey is lying. Who might it be?

To believe the president’s statement, we must conclude not only that Comey perjured himself but that he is a liar of exceptional premeditation

In emphatically contradicting Comey’s sworn testimony, the president has placed front and center the question that Risch tactically sidestepped. Who is lying – Trump or Comey? What is clear is that the members of the Senate intelligence committee appear unanimous in their agreement that it must be Trump.

Not one senator hazarded as much as a single question challenging Comey’s veracity – not James Lankford, not Tom Cotton, not John Cornyn, three of the Senate’s most reliably conservative members. In a fractious political universe that has worked to destabilize appeals to any shared truths, a bipartisan group of senators made clear their belief that the president was lying.

The conclusion follows not simply from Trump’s long and durable history of mendacity. To believe the president’s statement, we must conclude not only that Comey perjured himself on Thursday but that the former director is a liar of exceptional premeditation and forethought. We must conclude that Comey dashed out of a meeting with the president to fabricate a false contemporaneous account of that meeting which he then maliciously shared with other senior officials.

It's pretty telling that none of the Senators questioned Comey's credibility which pretty much says they believe Comey and not Trump.

[Alan Klein]

Do you understand the difference between "not being under investigation" from "not suspected of collusion"? Comey said Trump wasn't under investigation not that Trump was not suspected of colluding...

Comey said he told Trump he wasn't currently under investigation and declined to make that public because then he would be FORCED to publicly state he WAS under investigation if that changed and the investigation was expanded to include Trump personally.

Just be clear, Trump and his campaign are not out of the woods...the Russian investigation is STILL being conducted to determine what role Russia had in the meddling in the election and whether or not the Trump campaign colluded with the people responsible with the meddling.

Flynn and Manafort are people of interest. Flynn wants immunity and his lawyer says he has stories to tell in exchange. Hum wonder what he might say and I wonder if that has anything to do with the fact that Trump went way out on a limb to have the FBI quite investigating Flynn? What about Kushner? Think he's under investigation? We know that Federal prosecutors have subpoenas issued by a grand jury issued  and a FISA warrant as part of the Russian/Trump Camp investigation...

While the administration has sent out their surrogates with their talking points the fact remains the ONLY thing we now know for a fact is that Comey wasn't investigating Trump personally. We also know Comey says Trump has lied and we know Trump is claiming Comey lied. So, who do you believe?

Either Trump or Comey is lying. Who might it be?



It's pretty telling that none of the Senators questioned Comey's credibility which pretty much says they believe Comey and not Trump.

Thanks for answering my question in the affirmative that you believe Trump colluded with the Russians.  You have a long and convoluted way of answering, but there it is. 

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

Come on, Slobo, I think you are deliberately misleading this forum with that post.  Show me an example of a dead man's skeleton saying those words. 

 

[Schewe]

Thanks for answering my question in the affirmative that you believe Trump colluded with the Russians.  You have a long and convoluted way of answering, but there it is.

Again I really don't know...but I sure wouldn't be surprised to find out that there's no proof he himself colluded with the Russians. But I'm convinced Russia sure did try and succeeded in interfering with our election and that Trump would not have won if they didn't. I wonder why Trump clings to his claim it's fake news and thinks it's a conspiracy by the democrats to explain why they lost.

I also believe that there is something very weird about his love of Putin...it defies logic. Everybody else in the weatern world knows they are our enemy.

[Schewe]

So who's lying, Comey or Trump?

[Schewe]

Hillary ran an absolutely horrible campaign!

Yep, no question and in spite of that, but I seriously think she still would have squeaked out a win if the DNC wasn't hacked and the drip drip drip of Podesta's emails didn't steal the media's attention. Oh, and that last Comey cockup...

Heck, everybody including the Russians and Trump himself thought she was going to win.

:~)

[Schewe]

In case we forget about Russia...it ain't a Republican or Democratic things, it's an American thing.


An image of President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia was projected on a screen during an economic forum in St. Petersburg
this month. There is no evidence that Russia has stopped trying to meddle in the American electoral system.

Trump-Comey Feud Eclipses a Warning on Russia: ‘They Will Be Back’

WASHINGTON — Lost in the showdown between President Trump and James B. Comey that played out this past week was a chilling threat to the United States. Mr. Comey, the former director of the F.B.I., testified that the Russians had not only intervened in last year’s election, but would try to do it again.

“It’s not a Republican thing or Democratic thing — it really is an American thing,” Mr. Comey told the Senate Intelligence Committee. “They’re going to come for whatever party they choose to try and work on behalf of. And they’re not devoted to either, in my experience. They’re just about their own advantage. And they will be back.”

What started out as a counterintelligence investigation to guard the United States against a hostile foreign power has morphed into a political scandal about what Mr. Trump did, what he said and what he meant by it. Lawmakers have focused mainly on the gripping conflict between the president and the F.B.I. director he fired with cascading requests for documents, recordings and hearings.

But from the headquarters of the National Security Agency to state capitals that have discovered that the Russians were inside their voter-registration systems, the worry is that attention will be diverted from figuring out how Russia disrupted American democracy last year and how to prevent it from happening again. Russian hackers did not just breach Democratic email accounts; according to Mr. Comey, they orchestrated a “massive effort” targeting hundreds of — and possibly more than 1,000 — American government and private organizations since 2015.

“It’s important for us in the West to understand that we’re facing an adversary who wishes for his own reasons to do us harm,” said Daniel Fried, a career diplomat who oversaw sanctions imposed on Russia before retiring this year. “Whatever the domestic politics of this, Comey was spot-on right that Russia is coming after us, but not just the U.S., but the free world in general. And we need to take this seriously.”

I thought a telling part of Comey's testimony was the fact that with all the meetings and phone calls Trump never once asked him about how that investigation into Russian meddling was going...

[Slobodan Blagojevic]

...

[Schewe]

How long did it take for evidence to be found on Nixon?

Well, the DNC was broken into June 17, 1972.

March 17, 1973: Watergate burglar McCord writes a letter to Judge John Sirica, claiming that some of his testimony was perjured under pressure and that the burglary was not a CIA operation, but had involved other government officials, thereby leading the investigation to the White House.

May 19, 1973: Independent special prosecutor Archibald Cox appointed to oversee investigation into possible presidential impropriety.

July 23, 1973: Nixon refuses to turn over presidential tapes to Senate Watergate Committee or the special prosecutor.

October 20, 1973: "Saturday Night Massacre" - Nixon orders Elliot Richardson and Ruckleshouse to fire special prosecutor Cox. They both refuse to comply and resign. Robert Bork considers resigning but carries out the order.

November 17, 1973: Nixon delivers "I am not a crook" speech at a televised press conference at Disney World (Florida).

April 16, 1974: Special Prosecutor Jaworski issues a subpoena for 64 White House tapes.

June 15, 1974: Woodward and Bernstein's book All the President's Men is published by Simon & Schuster (ISBN 0-671-21781-X).

July 24, 1974: United States v. Nixon decided: Nixon is ordered to give up tapes to investigators.

May 9, 1974: Impeachment hearings begin before the House Judiciary Committee.

July 27 to July 30, 1974: House Judiciary Committee passes Articles of Impeachment.

August 9, 1974 Nixon resigned the presidency.

In case you don't remember the time line, Timeline of the Watergate scandal.

So, it didn't happen over nite.