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Author Topic: Nikon History  (Read 14539 times)

Theodoros

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2016, 11:15:00 am »

I think we don't agree on much, actually.

I think you don't mention where you disagree... Also, I suppose that you also disagree that not responding is much better than posting bold.... or blah, blah, blah irrelevant for that matter... (IMO).
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Theodoros

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2016, 11:23:59 am »

I believe on the older pre-1977 lenses there is a need to convert them so they can be "safely" mounted onto DSLRs.  John White describes the situation ( http://www.aiconversions.com/compatibilitytable.htm ) and will do the necessary modification for a reasonable price.  I have three legacy lenses bought in the early 1970s that were modified and worked very well on my D300 and now D810.  You simply set them up via the lens menu; they don't auto-focus or set the aperture but that's a minor inconvenience for most of the work I do.

They need a simple replacement of the aperture ring with one that "grabs" the different mechanism of (mechanical) aperture coupling on the AI compatible cameras... Alternatively, one can take the original aperture ring off the lens, (very easy to do) and save a part of it off... the info of the amount and the position that may be saved off can be easily found on web... then the lens becomes an AI-compatible one that work with full metering even with todays FF cameras and the higher models of the APS-c cameras...
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Theodoros

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2016, 11:44:56 am »

I was a diehard Nikon guy from the 70's until the advent of digital when Nikon really dropped the ball. Canon introduced the 1Ds with the full frame 11mp sensor and Nikon had no response for years. Most of us waited while using the 5MP cropped sensor D1x as long as we could and Nikon just ignored it's pro user base with no word on a full frame body for at least a year. So myself and thousands of other pros reluctantly decided to switch to Canon as the full frame 11MP sensor quickly became the standard.

 I also remember the anger when Canon switched lens mounts but looking back it was a smart thing for them to do. Their AF EOS system was excellent and it's probably when Canon took the lead from Nikon for sports photography. Just look on the sidelines at any sporting event for all the white lenses ;-).

Spot on... The delay to introduce a FF sensor was a fatal marketing mistake for Nikon that established them as followers than being leaders...  Also... Nikon should have followed Canon in having in lens motors for AF and aperture control from day 1... Instead, they where 10 years late to make the AF-S lenses (which do focus by using an internal AF motor) and they first introduced an electronic aperture lens with the 24mm PC-E lens introduction which was ...20 years later!
The strange thing is that all the changes didn't require a different CPU pin layout than the one introduced with the axle driven AF lenses (and lasts until today)... Needles to say that the G series of lenses was the most stupid thing a maker could ever do... the G series operates the aperture mechanically exactly like if it was a D series lens... but drops the aperture ring (for no reason whatsoever) which makes them incompatible with all the (superb) cameras that where introduced before the axle driven AF models...
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BrianVS

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #23 on: April 01, 2016, 12:51:27 pm »

The 43~86/3.5 was one of the most popular and useful lenses made. PJ's loved it, despite Nikon's apologies for performance.

Not everyone judges a lens by shooting brick walls.

lees2a by fiftyonepointsix, on Flickr

non-Ai 43~86 Zoom-Nikkor, wide-open on the Nikon F.

The 11-element Ai version was better, but several 100K of the 9-element version sold- a good indication of success. The 36~82/2.8 Zoomar with the leaf shutter Bessamatic was no where near as successful.

An early one that I picked up for $25,

nikkor43_86_early by fiftyonepointsix, on Flickr

on an equally early Nikon F2.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2016, 01:18:49 pm by BrianVS »
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BrianVS

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #24 on: April 01, 2016, 01:04:29 pm »

I believe on the older pre-1977 lenses there is a need to convert them so they can be "safely" mounted onto DSLRs.  John White describes the situation ( http://www.aiconversions.com/compatibilitytable.htm ) and will do the necessary modification for a reasonable price.  I have three legacy lenses bought in the early 1970s that were modified and worked very well on my D300 and now D810.  You simply set them up via the lens menu; they don't auto-focus or set the aperture but that's a minor inconvenience for most of the work I do.

Nikon charged $18.50 to factory convert non-Ai lenses to Ai, replaced the aperture ring and basically gave the lens a CLA. They did this for several years, I had some done in the early 90s. After that- you can "slice and dice" if you cannot find the original parts to replace the aperture ring.

I use Nikon and Leica digital cameras as I can use them with my collection of lenses. The Leica- I've used lenses over 80 years old; the Nikon- 1952 25cm F4 Nikkor-Q with an N-F adapter.

Nikon is still around, makes gear, sells gear- has a different philosophy than Canon. Canon never looks back, Nikon remembers their heritage. So do I.

https://www.leicaplace.com/resources/nikkor-sc-5cm-f1-5-the-lens-that-got-the-attention-of-the-world.4/
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John Koerner

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #25 on: April 01, 2016, 01:18:44 pm »

Nikon charged $18.50 to factory convert non-Ai lenses to Ai, replaced the aperture ring and basically gave the lens a CLA. They did this for several years, I had some done in the early 90s. After that- you can "slice and dice" if you cannot find the original parts to replace the aperture ring.

I use Nikon and Leica digital cameras as I can use them with my collection of lenses. The Leica- I've used lenses over 80 years old; the Nikon- 1952 25cm F4 Nikkor-Q with an N-F adapter.

Nikon is still around, makes gear, sells gear- has a different philosophy than Canon. Canon never looks back, Nikon remembers their heritage. So do I.

https://www.leicaplace.com/resources/nikkor-sc-5cm-f1-5-the-lens-that-got-the-attention-of-the-world.4/

Nicely said, and great article.

Appreciate the share, thanks :)
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razrblck

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #26 on: April 01, 2016, 01:57:20 pm »

There was a time when Nikon made lenses for Canon. :P
« Last Edit: April 01, 2016, 03:16:01 pm by razrblck »
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BrianVS

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #27 on: April 01, 2016, 02:17:56 pm »

My Nikkor-SC 5cm F1.5 (1949) was originally bought with a Canon III, also an early one. I popped the top off the Canon II, cleaned all the haze from the viewfinder/rangefinder, and put a Serenar 50/1.9 on it.
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John Koerner

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2016, 04:07:05 pm »

There's even one at $100...  ::)

You're of course right. My search was done a month or two back, where none were to be found.
Or at least anyone, that I would care to get, were around.

A mint 1982 Ai-s version complete with filter set, box, papers etc. is very hard to find. Closest today is $1500 and that's without box...

Sorry to offend you, I'm not here to pick up a fight. Bye...

You sound offended ...

Me, I was just surprised.

I am not necessarily looking for a "mint" lens, with box, though it would be nice.

Just an excellent, fully-functional tool.

Here are a few:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/331805533047?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Near-Mint-Nikon-Ai-S-AIS-NIKKOR-15mm-F-3-5-Ultra-Wide-Angle-MF-Lens-F-S-/231898876083?hash=item35fe4008b3:g:6~cAAOSwr7ZW5A3h

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nikon-Nikkor-AI-S-15mm-F-3-5-Ai-S-Lens-/281950491873?hash=item41a58f14e1:g:LDYAAOSwezVW1WJ3

All priced pretty reasonably.

Jack
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BrianVS

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2016, 05:18:13 pm »

https://www.keh.com/shop/nikon-15mm-f-3-5-ais-manual-focus-lens-rear-bayonet.html

KEH, EX+, caps and L1BC filter.

NIKON 15MM F/3.5 AIS MANUAL FOCUS LENS

A little over $1K, comes with warranty.
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NancyP

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #30 on: April 01, 2016, 05:59:02 pm »

I am still using my dad's circa 1970 AIS 105 f/2.5 (with adapter) on my Canon 6D. The old lenses were not as "perfect" in terms of aberrations, but had nice rendering.
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Paul2660

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #31 on: April 01, 2016, 06:21:20 pm »

Here you go,

More old Nikon that you could ever want.  Entire collection 60K


http://www.ebay.com/itm/301913998860?rmvSB=true

Paul C
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John Koerner

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2016, 07:10:59 pm »

There was a time when Nikon made lenses for Canon. :P

 ;D

I am wanting to get into photomicroscopy, actually, and Nikkor makes oodles of these as well.
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John Koerner

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2016, 07:15:34 pm »

https://www.keh.com/shop/nikon-15mm-f-3-5-ais-manual-focus-lens-rear-bayonet.html

KEH, EX+, caps and L1BC filter.

NIKON 15MM F/3.5 AIS MANUAL FOCUS LENS

A little over $1K, comes with warranty.

I actually think some of the eBay lenses look a little nicer, for less.

I suppose "how much to spend" becomes a question of purpose.

I recently bought a "mint" version of an older macro lens ... and then felt nervous using it.

It's like, "Do I really want to bang-up this vintage lens on mountain/desert hikes?"

If a person is looking to "collect" and "feel pride in" a particular lens, then go for mint.

But if you're looking to use a lens, have it in your bag, and lug it all over the place where it may be dinged-up ... why buy mint at all?

Let a collector get the mint version, and just buy a clean/workable lens (with a few dings) for yourself, and just get out there and enjoy it.
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BrianVS

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #34 on: April 01, 2016, 08:17:08 pm »

Ebay is always something of a risk, especially if getting a lens from overseas. KEH- a known entity. I've bought a lot of lenses from Ebay, but I do my own repair work. If it is cheap, or extremely rare- I'll take a gamble. With KEH, it's a sure bet- they have a no nonsense return and a warranty backed up by an inhouse repair facility that I used to fix a broken Leica CL.
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dwswager

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #35 on: April 03, 2016, 09:28:13 pm »

I was a diehard Nikon guy from the 70's until the advent of digital when Nikon really dropped the ball. Canon introduced the 1Ds with the full frame 11mp sensor and Nikon had no response for years. Most of us waited while using the 5MP cropped sensor D1x as long as we could and Nikon just ignored it's pro user base with no word on a full frame body for at least a year. So myself and thousands of other pros reluctantly decided to switch to Canon as the full frame 11MP sensor quickly became the standard.

 I also remember the anger when Canon switched lens mounts but looking back it was a smart thing for them to do. Their AF EOS system was excellent and it's probably when Canon took the lead from Nikon for sports photography. Just look on the sidelines at any sporting event for all the white lenses ;-).

Yes, the tech lead flip flops.  Nikon basically created the DSLR and then couldn't follow up.  Canon introduced the CMOS sensor and owned the best imaging and then couldn't follow it up.  Nikon (with help from Sony and Toshiba) now has the lead. 

And I agree that the change from FD to EF mount was a good thing overall for Canon.  But it did present an opportunity for switching.  And as an owner of a D810 and having a preorder for a D500, I am very very glad I switched back then and even more glad now.   
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stevesanacore

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #36 on: April 04, 2016, 09:57:20 am »

Yes, the tech lead flip flops.  Nikon basically created the DSLR and then couldn't follow up.  Canon introduced the CMOS sensor and owned the best imaging and then couldn't follow it up.  Nikon (with help from Sony and Toshiba) now has the lead. 

And I agree that the change from FD to EF mount was a good thing overall for Canon.  But it did present an opportunity for switching.  And as an owner of a D810 and having a preorder for a D500, I am very very glad I switched back then and even more glad now.

Yes, I think lots of Canon users would have loved to switch back when the D3x was released, (and many did). The D800 series was a total reversal as Canon was now the one who couldn't respond quickly enough and many Canon users did move back to Nikon or just started to shoot with both systems, (as I did), in order to reap the benefits of that amazing sensor.
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NancyP

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #37 on: April 04, 2016, 07:50:41 pm »

I used a very good Nikon diagnostic light microscope for 20 years. The university then decided to go with Olympus, so my replacement current diagnostic light microscope is an Olympus, also wonderful quality optics. Our university's "better" confocal microscopes are Olympus also. The US used to make quite decent but not stellar microscopes (American Optical - these were sturdy, inexpensive, and what I used throughout my residency - for many years these were top sellers for clinical laboratories and for pathologists.).

The major camera companies make many medical instruments: pathologists' light microscopes, optometry refraction set-ups and slit lamp microscopes for opthalmology, endoscopes (long tubes with optics and glass fiber-optics) for anywhere you might want to view, dissecting microscopes (low power, long-working-distance microscopes) for operating rooms and for bench use.
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John Koerner

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #38 on: April 04, 2016, 11:29:08 pm »

Yes, I think lots of Canon users would have loved to switch back when the D3x was released, (and many did). The D800 series was a total reversal as Canon was now the one who couldn't respond quickly enough and many Canon users did move back to Nikon or just started to shoot with both systems, (as I did), in order to reap the benefits of that amazing sensor.

Canon and Nikon are both great systems. The mainstays. The rest of them are either "also-rans" (or, in some cases, up-n-comers, but not "there" yet. Really, not even close).

The big difference, though, to me, is Nikon has stayed connected to its past.

Thus the history, the roots, the sense of connectedness seems to be deeper amongst Nikon users than Canon users.
(And rightfully-so.)

I love some of Canon's newer lenses, I really do, and I think their 1DxII is probably the better buy between it and the D5 ... with FAR better 4K capabilities (although, I suspect, it will not be in the same league as the D5 in either single-image quality or in low-light performance).

However, I am lukewarm about Canon's low-to-mid-level cameras.
For most consumers, Canon's midrange is simply weak compared to (virtually) everyone else.

The way I see it, since the 5DS-r already isn't as good as the D810, overall, I can only imagine that the soon-to-be-released D900 will blow make the Canon 5D away as an embarrassment, in the same way that the D500 will immediately render the 7DII anemic and sickly by comparison.

That said, this thread topic wasn't intended to start a "brand debate," but to tip my hat to the fact Nikon remains connected to its elder lenses (many of which are quite remarkable, and useful) which, because many are so inexpensive to get a copy of, makes it kind of fun to plan and experiment with.

Jack
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dwswager

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Re: Nikon History
« Reply #39 on: April 05, 2016, 08:30:18 am »

Canon and Nikon are both great systems. The mainstays. The rest of them are either "also-rans" (or, in some cases, up-n-comers, but not "there" yet. Really, not even close).

The big difference, though, to me, is Nikon has stayed connected to its past.

Thus the history, the roots, the sense of connectedness seems to be deeper amongst Nikon users than Canon users.
(And rightfully-so.)

I love some of Canon's newer lenses, I really do, and I think their 1DxII is probably the better buy between it and the D5 ... with FAR better 4K capabilities (although, I suspect, it will not be in the same league as the D5 in either single-image quality or in low-light performance).

However, I am lukewarm about Canon's low-to-mid-level cameras.
For most consumers, Canon's midrange is simply weak compared to (virtually) everyone else.

The way I see it, since the 5DS-r already isn't as good as the D810, overall, I can only imagine that the soon-to-be-released D900 will blow make the Canon 5D away as an embarrassment, in the same way that the D500 will immediately render the 7DII anemic and sickly by comparison.

That said, this thread topic wasn't intended to start a "brand debate," but to tip my hat to the fact Nikon remains connected to its elder lenses (many of which are quite remarkable, and useful) which, because many are so inexpensive to get a copy of, makes it kind of fun to plan and experiment with.

Jack

First, as I Nikon shooter, I am at least glad to see Canon making progress.

I believe the 1DxII and D5 comparable.  The D810 and 5Ds are also comparable, but with slightly different strengths and weaknesses depending on your shooting needs.  From there on though, and when the D500 is released, there really isn't a Canon body I would recommend over the comparable Nikon for someone not already invested in the Canon system.

For quite some time I only recommended Canon to friends that asked, now it is Nikon.  And the whole while I was a Nikon shooter.
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