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Author Topic: 10 bit display  (Read 11646 times)

D Fosse

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Re: 10 bit display
« Reply #20 on: November 14, 2015, 12:54:28 pm »

For soft proofing, the surround makes a big difference.

Yes, that is extremely important and a very underrated factor. It has just as much impact as the ambient light.

I'm not at all happy with the currently fashioniable dark UIs. In Photoshop I switched it back to the classic light gray, but Lightroom keeps throwing me off.
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BobDavid

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Re: 10 bit display
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2015, 04:22:27 pm »

For soft proofing, the surround makes a big difference. What do you have your surround set to? "Black" is almost always the wrong answer. Soft proofing also depends on how much of your surround is "covered" by the image.

Jim

I soft proof with the default Photoshop grey. But, it my be useful to try soft proofing with a background closer to 170, 170, 170.  I'd have to create a big 170s file and then paste the smaller image over that. ... I think you raise an interesting point about how our eyes are tricked when a file is surrounded by dark grey or black.
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Yahor Shumski

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10 bit display
« Reply #22 on: November 15, 2015, 02:25:16 pm »

Are you sure about this and is it documented somewhere?  I had been under the impression that up to the arrival of CS6 10 bit only partially implemented (whatever that meant!) but from CS6 10 bit pipeline fully implemented in Windows not in Mac.

I am on PC, Photoshop CC, Quadro k620, Nec PA272W and test ramp file looks smooth in Proof colors only. I don't have explanation for such behavior and it is not documented but works.


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« Last Edit: November 15, 2015, 02:36:26 pm by Yahor Shumski »
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BobDavid

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Re: 10 bit display
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2015, 09:09:40 am »

For soft proofing, the surround makes a big difference. What do you have your surround set to? "Black" is almost always the wrong answer. Soft proofing also depends on how much of your surround is "covered" by the image.

Jim

Jim, I set the surround to 185, 185, 185 and then at 200, 200, 200.  I am amazed by how much more accurate this makes soft proofing--such a simple and intuitive approach. Thank you for mentioning this.
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TonyW

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Re: 10 bit display
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2015, 03:39:09 pm »

...I calibrated the monitor first using an i1Pro. Then I looked at the target to see the gamma chart. After that, I calibrated the monitor and specified 2.1 gamma. Many years ago I tried working in D65, I opted to use 5000K because I seemed to get a better match with prints, especially taking into account where they are displayed. ..

My lightroom is in a dedicated space with subdued lighting and a solux lamp off in the corner. When I hold prints up a few feet away from the lamp, the pictures look great--they match what I'm seeing on the screen.

...
Hi Bob

I know the calibration and profiling question was a little basic, thankfully you were not offended, just had to ask - in case  :D

My experience different to yours in that D50 always looked too yellow and dingy and not close to any paper white that I used, D65 seemed a better fit.  Still what matters is your  print to screen match and if this happens to be D50 or any other then that is what you should be using IMO.

Can we take it that LR shows no issues with colour or density matching and that the prints all look great - at least most of the time - and that the problem only occurs during PS CS6 sessions?
Then again if the above is correct using the same paper profiles for both LR and CS6 printing should yield the same result.

I can see how it would be frustrating to observe banding on resize below 66% but wonder how much impact it will make in the real world with real images rather than test ramps?  Just being aware that it is a 'feature' of CS6 should help keep you out of trouble.  Speaking as someone who once tried for an hour to correct Luminance Moire using every trick in the book only to realize that PS zoom had been set to less than 100% and that moire did not exist in the image data you learn the lesson to check at 100% view and where appropriate a test print section of region of interest  :-[

I am on PC, Photoshop CC, Quadro k620, Nec PA272W and test ramp file looks smooth in Proof colors only. I don't have explanation for such behavior and it is not documented but works.
...
There is something at the back of my mind about PS CC support for 10 bit at least initially being somewhat lacking cannot remember where I saw this and if it only related to AMD 10 bit cards.
However one way that this could conceivably occur is if Windows colour management has not been set to use the monitor profile i.e. Use my Profile ticked in the Colour Management Windows app (or a wrong profile used). 

In this case could it be that within PS your graphics adapter has not been recognized as 10 bit and that the soft proofing method uses a different method to display e.g. dithering or even DirectX giving you the smooth ramp?  Just thinking out loud and trying to reason why.  CS6 should work ok therefore recent versions of CC should

Have you asked Adobe for an explanation?

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Yahor Shumski

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Re: 10 bit display
« Reply #25 on: November 19, 2015, 09:50:40 am »

In this case could it be that within PS your graphics adapter has not been recognized as 10 bit and that the soft proofing method uses a different method to display e.g. dithering or even DirectX giving you the smooth ramp?  Just thinking out loud and trying to reason why.  CS6 should work ok therefore recent versions of CC should

Have you asked Adobe for an explanation?

I tried the latest Quadro driver for my workstation but the Photoshop CC behavior is intact, smooth ramp in Proof colors only. Adobe support is not helpful on official forum, it seems 10bit workflow has not high enough priority.

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digitaldog

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Re: 10 bit display
« Reply #26 on: November 19, 2015, 10:32:52 am »

Quote
In Photoshop I switched it back to the classic light gray, but Lightroom keeps throwing me off.
But when you invoke soft proofing in LR, the surround goes just off white, gradually.
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