Lightroom really DOES suck

[jjj]

Actually I can't now recall off hand which feature it was I mentioned being removed.
Maybe it was the calendar filter that got binned in V2, a shame as it could have been very useful.
I vaguely seem to recall that PSE many years back had a browser thang with a very useful calendar search tool.

[jjj]

Individually, the previous removals were about the same level as each of the recent ones. I think the big difference here was that the recent change bundled half a dozen removals together, all in the same area and all in the same dot release.

It was removing long standing parts of people's workflow and not replacing them with anything that was the issue.

[ButchM]

My post was directed more at others which say product so...and...so is better at this and product so...and...so is better at that. Just drop LR and move to product so...and...so.

And ... if you would have actually read those comments in detail ... you would have also seen that some of us do use other options that do certain tasks better. Too bad you find it upsetting when others point out  that Adobe's version of such tools included in Lr don't measure up.

[Rhossydd]

if scaling occurs,
...... there's a bug in ACPU on Windows that can occur.

I've never read of any cases where scaling in ACPU doesn't happen on Windows.

[Rhossydd]

That isn't what I am saying, is it?

That's exactly what you're saying.

You've said features have been removed from LR in the past, but have failed to give a single example of one.

[john beardsworth]

It was removing long standing parts of people's workflow and not replacing them with anything that was the issue.

But it also played into some existing fears of dumbed down apps, the subscription model, removing stuff from something you've bought, the way Apple recently shafted people, and Andrew's bitterness of course. Remove those half-dozen features over time and there wouldn't have been much more fuss than over the previous removals. You were quite close to remembering the one you mentioned before, but please don't lose sleep over them!

[pegelli]

they were bloody annoying at the time

Let me reiterate my point as well, for me on an annoyance scale from 1 to 100 these were probably below 5, maybe mildly annoying but probably less. That's why I can't remember them, because if they were any higher I would.

[john beardsworth]

That's exactly what you're saying.

You've said features have been removed from LR in the past, but have failed to give a single example of one.

Nope, I keep empasizing that the specific features simply aren't important (FWIW Jeremy knew of one) but what actually matters is that people forgot them, pretty thoroughly it appears, and adapted. I don't agree with all the ways Import changed in 6.2, but it would have been the same here - except for so many coming at once and all those other externals (misjudging the OSX release, Apple's dumbing down, fears and prejudices).

[john beardsworth]

Let me reiterate my point as well, for me on an annoyance scale from 1 to 100 these were probably below 5, maybe mildly annoying but probably less. That's why I can't remember them, because if they were any higher I would.

No, really, each was similar. But bundle 6 together and the impact is 5 to the power 6!

[digitaldog]

I hope you take your own advice to heart. Are you now deejjaaa / alterego in disguise?

The question doesn't deserve a reply!

As I keep telling you, it is not the specific removals that are important.

They are not important to you! They might not be important to me IF I knew what they were. I keep asking, you're unable to answer. IF I knew WTF you were referring to with respect to removed features, we might come to a full and violent agreement. But since you can't answer a simple question, you're statements about features removed appear to be science fiction. Can we have some actual science, an actual answer from you? Doesn't appear so. Back in your hole John.

I couldn't care less if you remain ignorant.

I am ignorant, hence the reason I've asked you nearly a dozen times to educate me but you're incapable of doing so.

Do you not understand that?

I fully understand you made a statement that you can't explain or backup.
Do your clients who presumably pay you for your expertise have to jump through so many hoops to get a simple answer to an LR question from someone who states he's an LR expert?

My point, which I'll happily keep reiterating, is that what is important is that removals have happened before, they were bloody annoying at the time, but people adapt and move on.

WHAT SPECIFICALLY was removed? I'll be the judge as will others what's important.

[digitaldog]

I've never read of any cases where scaling in ACPU doesn't happen on Windows.

And I've never had the scaling affect me with a device that's darn picky about size!

[pegelli]

No, really, each was similar. But bundle 6 together and the impact is 5 to the power 6!

Nice try, but no cigar 

[Rhossydd]

And I've never had the scaling affect me with a device that's darn picky about size!

But if you've created a target design that can be measured without the scaling issue causing problems, that would explain it. As you've alluded to in reply #133 " MY target takes into account this possibility such that even if scaling occurs, I can measure MY targets without issue."
That's a very clever trick, but it doesn't change the fact that NCM was removed from PS from CS5 onwards, not moved as you've suggested, and that the only public version of ACPU resizes charts on Windows systems.

[Eric Myrvaagnes]

Like many others (apparently) I have been hoping John Beardsworth would provide us the list of features he says were removed from LR prior to version 6. I have used every version of LR since #1 and I , too, cannot remember a single feature that was removed, and certainly none that were "bloody annoying."

I do hope he will relent and give us that list rather than continue repeating his unsupported assertion over and over.

He has now earned a place on my very selective "ignore" list. If he ever provides the list, I hope someone will let me knoe about it.

[pegelli]

He has now earned a place on my very selective "ignore" list. If he ever provides the list, I hope someone will let me knoe about it.

I'll quote him if it ever happens so you can see it Eric.

However I'm also not a real fan of the "ignore" function. It's too crude for my liking. Sometimes it's very amusing to see people behave like an a$$ and if it's really worth ignoring my scroll wheel is pretty quick as well and much more selective 

[ButchM]

Like many others (apparently) I have been hoping John Beardsworth would provide us the list of features he says were removed from LR prior to version 6. I have used every version of LR since #1 and I , too, can

Same here ... it's quite possible that some functions and or capabilities were indeed removed the past ... but as indicated by our loss of recall as a group ... those specific facets must have indeed been unimportant to most users.

Conversely, as much as some would like to downplay the event and analyze the reactions was the result of outside influences and not the direct result of poor decision making by Adobe management ... the backlash over 6.2 would indicate that the recent exclusion of certain features or capabilities didn't fall within the same criteria of being unimportant falling under the radar of the average user. It would seem the two situations are not relatable in many respects.

[john beardsworth]

Same here ... it's quite possible that some functions and or capabilities were indeed removed the past ... but as indicated by our loss of recall as a group ... those specific facets must have indeed been unimportant to most users.

Conversely, as much as some would like to downplay the event and analyze the reactions was the result of outside influences and not the direct result of poor decision making by Adobe management ... the backlash over 6.2 would indicate that the recent exclusion of certain features or capabilities didn't fall within the same criteria of being unimportant falling under the radar of the average user. It would seem the two situations are not relatable in many respects.

Well, 6 or so features going at once and in one area probably has a different magnitude, and I think you'd be wrong to rule out the toxic combination of outside influences, whatever your view of Adobe's decision making.

[ButchM]

Well, 6 or so features going at once and in one area probably has a different magnitude, and I think you'd be wrong to rule out the toxic combination of outside influences, whatever your view of Adobe's decision making.

I disagree to an extent ... if you take the time to peruse the comments made on the The Lightroom Journal blog and at the feedback.photoshop.com site, many of the folks complaining really were not aware of many of the multiple items that were removed. They were mostly focused on the one or two items that they utilized most often.

For example, I noticed how certain folks noticed the absence of the Eject after Import function seemed totally unaware that the Move function was also absent ... and many of those users who took the time to make their thought known were Windows users ... so I doubt resentment for Apple had very little to factor into the process.

[jjj]

No, really, each was similar. But bundle 6 together and the impact is 5 to the power 6!

Nope. Not the case
Nothing that changed before screwed up my or other folks workflow in quite so serious a manner. I think only one of the items that went AWOL recently affected me and boy did it mess things up.
What was actually different was that those who were individually affected by various elisions, all shouted foul at the same time which gave us more leverage so Adobe had to pay attention.

[john beardsworth]

I disagree to an extent ... if you take the time to peruse the comments made on the The Lightroom Journal blog and at the feedback.photoshop.com site, many of the folks complaining really were not aware of many of the multiple items that were removed. They were mostly focused on the one or two items that they utilized most often.

Hm, so a few years down the track and they would forget those features ever existed?